Thread: Low Dps

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  1. #41
    Being hit capped makes a huge difference.

  2. #42
    My DPS is much better nowadays, compared to other classes, but it's also true that the average quality of the heroic player has dropped compared to a few days ago (wiping in silly places).

    I'm still being defeated regularly by mages and warlocks.
    Shadow Walk : Significantly increases Stealth effectiveness for 6 sec, but causes Stealth to be nerfed to justify its usage. In addition, it uses old Enveloping Shadows icon and has no sound, animation or spell effect to show that the skill is actually doing something.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Mugajak View Post
    It didn't change at all. There's a natural progression curve over the course of a gear/level set; if at level 1 you gain haste, you get LOTS of energy. At level 2, that same haste is less effective. At 40, it's a LOT less effective than it was at 1, but you now have access to new gear with more haste... boosting you up to the same level you felt as a level 1 with 5 haste rating. Etc. etc.... when you go from end-game gear to entry-game gear, your haste is low. If it wasn't, we'd be a fully GCD capped class as of early cata, with no exceptions, and we'd either be rebalanced or do everything we could to shed haste because we'd be at like 870%...

    Once you're in T16(?)H gear, it'll feel just about like T13H did a week ago.
    I have an incredibly hard time believing they didn't change energy regen. When 5.0.4 hit I went from nearly energy capped all the time in combat to having a slow as molasses rotation. Energy regen definitely feels like it changed to me. Since 5.0.5 both combat and muti are slow but getting better as my gear gets a little better. When I first got into heroics is was PAINFUL. Now it's bearable and I can at least keep pace with most of the dps I run into. Weapons of course made the biggest difference. Getting to 6% on hit and exp was also a big difference for dungeons. There just aren't that many stat points to go around yet.

  4. #44
    Starting today my first heroics - better t stick to my legendaries until i get another daggor to couple my 450 one? Just for better/smoother transition.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Starting today my first heroics - better t stick to my legendaries until i get another daggor to couple my 450 one? Just for better/smoother transition.
    I kept my daggers as a pair until I got a 2nd 450+ dagger. To be honest when I first changed my legendaries to a 463/450 I hardly noticed a difference as Assassination.

  6. #46
    I'm super angry about the tank specs. And challenge modes means Blizzard won't fix their dumb uncapped vengeance. Makes me super pissed I don't have a tank spec on my class, if they're gonna effortlessly top meters. Sustained AoE multitarget has been a mutilate specialization since Lich King, but now every tank shits on it, and blood makes it look like level 70 came along somehow.

    But, in terms of damage relative to the other "damage dealing" (rofl lolol) classes, I'm doing fine. My mainhand is too low to dink with combat, but mutilate is performing very nicely for me, and sub decently.

  7. #47
    Yeah that tank crap is dumb. Our prot warrior did 54k tanking the first 25m boss which was 10th. That is so retarded... A blood dk would have been even higher (we opted to not use a blood dk for the double tanking as they are apparently more bursty).

    Edit: For comparison I did 79k and our first non blade flurrying rogue did 61k.

  8. #48
    I'm going as sub into heroics - they are really really easy and i find myself more at ease with energetic recovery; assassination with this gear and very low haste is really painful XD

    Probably going Sub/Combat for raiding - i have to get a couple of weapons.

  9. #49
    I can't even come close to touching fire mages, they are about 20k+ ahead

    no way that margin can be narrowed without either major bufs to rogues or nerfs to fire mages.

  10. #50
    well i as many here in hc's struggle between 25 35 ? k dps ... Usually top 1 dps is tank : druid dk monk or warr , those guys are godlike dmg wise .

    Rest are + - 20 25 k ahead of me . Apart mages and warlocks so far , if there is such with a decent gear 450 + -. Theyre dmg is "lol" 80-100k single target . They make hc's look like wotlk dungeons :|

  11. #51
    The Patient Matutin's Avatar
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    Those locks... I cant fucking beat locks on dps :c
    My Rogue

    Veni, vidi, vici.

    I like MoP now c:

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Refreshedx View Post
    Is it me or is rogue dps in pve situations really low?
    I'm not sure how you didn't notice all the rogue nerfs while you were leveling, but ya our damage, mobility, utility, and survivability all got nerfed really bad. While i was leveling i would have trouble killing one mob while everyone else around me was plowing through 3-4 at a time, and even one would bring me down to half health. As for Dps, i found i do the most playing as Assassination. Just keep Rupture up and refresh SnD with Envenom, pretty straightforward.

  13. #53
    My DPS is fine. Rogues will almost never be top in the first tier, but you can get close.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/2...?s=1025&e=1304

    The monk in there is a tank, by the way. Our Feng strat was not exactly optimal for melee DPS.

    Your DPS will get a lot better when you can cap hit/exp and reforge some secondaries to your best one below hit/exp. Weapons are major too.

  14. #54
    I'm with most of the people here. I've gone from one of the highest DPS in my guild to struggling to even hit the 30-35k mark in dungeons at the moment.

    I know as I get decent gear my DPS will go up BUT it's actually depressing being SO far lower damage than everyone else in a dungeon. Most other classes seem to walk through AOEing and even with crappy gear are hitting 50-90k without breaking a sweat. Even the Tanks are doing double the damage of a rogue now... though some of them seem to be doing more damage than anyone else anyway.

    The "better single target" doesn't mean squat anymore, as all the boss has to do is whirlwind or spinning fire kick and we're either out of the fight or resorting to throwing ninja stars at them, whilst all the casters are DPSing still.. not that I actually believe we're even close to some classes single target anymore.

    It's depressing, and making me feel embarassed being in dungeons sometimes with the DPS. It better get better with gear.. a helluva lot, or I can't imagine anyone taking rogues on raids/challenges unless they want to stealth past some trash. Time to finish levelling my warrior

  15. #55
    To maybe help people be a little less depressed...

    I was miserable during heroic farming. I was frustrated with energy and embarrassed of my dps. I was only going to be brought in for a few fights this week in favor of other (mainly range) classes. My DPS on stone guard as combat was fine (as expected with the cleave) and I had to come in last minute for Gara'jal because someone else left. I was pretty nervous but was pleasantly surprised that my dps wasn't horrible. I did shit damage as combat down in the spirit realm but my sustained single target on the boss was good.

    Anyway, don't be too bummed out. It's a lot better in a raid environment.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by rogueMatthias View Post
    I'm with most of the people here. I've gone from one of the highest DPS in my guild to struggling to even hit the 30-35k mark in dungeons at the moment.

    I know as I get decent gear my DPS will go up BUT it's actually depressing being SO far lower damage than everyone else in a dungeon. Most other classes seem to walk through AOEing and even with crappy gear are hitting 50-90k without breaking a sweat. Even the Tanks are doing double the damage of a rogue now... though some of them seem to be doing more damage than anyone else anyway.

    The "better single target" doesn't mean squat anymore, as all the boss has to do is whirlwind or spinning fire kick and we're either out of the fight or resorting to throwing ninja stars at them, whilst all the casters are DPSing still.. not that I actually believe we're even close to some classes single target anymore.

    It's depressing, and making me feel embarassed being in dungeons sometimes with the DPS. It better get better with gear.. a helluva lot, or I can't imagine anyone taking rogues on raids/challenges unless they want to stealth past some trash. Time to finish levelling my warrior
    You realize one of the 3 first Gold times had a Rogue in the group, right? BF+KSp absolutely wipes out trash packs, and our single target damage is comparable to anything else. We also bring a good amount of utility to Challenge modes: Shroud, Cloak, Feint, Kick, Gouge, Blind, Sap, Stuns, Tricks, and more that I'm forgetting.

    Rogue damage is notoriously tied to gear. If your gear is bad, your damage will be very bad. If your gear is good, your damage will be very good. The damage to gear scaling curve is much steeper for rogues than any other class. You just went from DS gear (super awesome, final-tier gear) to sub-heroic dungeon gear. Once you're 463, you'll start pulling your weight more.

  17. #57
    I wouldn't call it low. I just switched from Sub to Combat since I got some decent axes (435ivl). I was averaging 27k-30k single target in heroics as Sub with Legendaries. I just ran SPM and my DPS+Damage increased by about 2k with those axes and being Combat. Combat and Sub look like they will be the stronger specs in PvE.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovan View Post
    I kept my daggers as a pair until I got a 2nd 450+ dagger. To be honest when I first changed my legendaries to a 463/450 I hardly noticed a difference as Assassination.
    I found that hard to believe, so I did some testing. Turns out you couldn't be further from the truth.

    Tested on a raiding target dummy:
    2 non-enchanted green ilvl 437 daggers: 27k dps
    2 landslide-enchanted legendary daggers: 13k dps

    I'm going with the other claims here that your dps output scales heavily with your gear.
    I was doing embarassingly low numbers myself in hc instances (dangling on bottom of the meters with a bigger margin than any self-respecting rogue would like to admit), so I did something I wanted to avoid until I had all ilvl 460+ blues: I gemmed and enchanted everything I had.
    My damage as assassination rogue is...acceptable now. On trash it's still pretty crappy (unless it's a FoK opportunity) but on bossfights I can get up to 40k now. On a few fights where we get to stay on the boss all the time (last boss of scarlet halls, as an example) I actually ended up as top dps with 50k. It's not that fantastic when compared to what some other classes do, but at least I don't have to be ashamed anymore. I do believe my dps will improve a good bit when I get better daggers (got 1 blue dagger yesterday, now looking for a second one).

    So in short: don't wait with gems and enchants until you got better gear. It helps you to close that dps gap until you get the good stuff.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    I'm going as sub into heroics - they are really really easy and i find myself more at ease with energetic recovery; assassination with this gear and very low haste is really painful XD

    Probably going Sub/Combat for raiding - i have to get a couple of weapons.
    I just got to try sub and assassination on single target (2nd raid boss on 25m). I was lucky enough to get the epic dagger with my random chance at loot bag off the first boss the previous night. I was a crap ton higher as assassination. I switched for the last hour after the break (my other spec was combat as I had assumed combat/sub was the best way to go) and I gained something like 15% dps. Now I played sub for the last 4ish months of DS pretty much exclusively so I feel pretty comfortable with it (even after the 5.0 alterations) and while I admit it was a new fight and I may not have been 100% optimal as I was focused on other things, we're talking about a pretty huge dps jump. I went from middle of our meter to the top (granted no one else in my raid afaik has an epic weapon, let alone a 489 one).

    I think we have another case of a model over-estimating the dps like at the start of Cata where combat was projected to be on par with assassination.

    Incidentally, I did try combat with my epic dagger in OH, one of my two fists MH, and did slightly less than sub. That was just for one pull so maybe something was off, I dunno. I had probably 10ish attempts with sub and 6ish with assassination so I don't think I was just randomly getting rng'd. I should also mention that that 15%ish gain I was seeing, was almost entirely out of execute range so it should have gone up had the attempts been kills.

    Quote Originally Posted by MacHaggis View Post
    I found that hard to believe, so I did some testing. Turns out you couldn't be further from the truth.

    Tested on a raiding target dummy:
    2 non-enchanted green ilvl 437 daggers: 27k dps
    2 landslide-enchanted legendary daggers: 13k dps
    Sorry, but I find THAT hard to believe. I was pulling more than 13k dps at 90 with my legendaries and something like 2/3 heroic DS gear. The AoA bosses I did right after hitting 90 I'm pretty sure I was clocking in near 30k as assassination with legendaries and 2/3 heroic ds gear.

    Quote Originally Posted by SpaceJam View Post
    I wouldn't call it low. I just switched from Sub to Combat since I got some decent axes (435ivl). I was averaging 27k-30k single target in heroics as Sub with Legendaries. I just ran SPM and my DPS+Damage increased by about 2k with those axes and being Combat. Combat and Sub look like they will be the stronger specs in PvE.
    Like I said above, that is absolutely not what I'm seeing in an actual raid. Combat certainly is the strongest when you can cleave like the first boss where I dominated our meter, but given equivalent weapons, with what I saw on the second boss (pure single target, near full uptime) assassination is noticeably ahead.
    Last edited by Sesshou; 2012-10-04 at 08:51 AM.

  20. #60
    Sorry, but I find THAT hard to believe. I was pulling more than 13k dps at 90 with my legendaries and something like 2/3 heroic DS gear. The AoA bosses I did right after hitting 90 I'm pretty sure I was clocking in near 30k as assassination with legendaries and 2/3 heroic ds gear.
    I'm just quoting the numbers I'm seeing, why would I lie about that?
    Just try it yourself. Get 2 green daggers and your legendaries and start hacking away at a raiders target dummy.

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