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  1. #41
    I like to play a new class from the beginning, especially when I do a special role such as healer and tank, so I can learn with the minimal stuff then add each new thing into the mix as I level to get a feel for what I'm doing and I'm not overwhelmed by an array of buttons.

    At the lower levels, BM is very easy (as long as you don't get parties that are crazy about facepulling as I've seemed to keep getting when I tanked lately...though I never minded that on my Pally because all they had to do was run through Conencration for me to get the threat off and I could handle insanely large packs). See a mob pack that a bit out of the way and you want to pull them along with the ones you have? Throw a barrel at them like Donkey Kong.

    From what I'm reading out of this thread, though, is that they at some point become like a Warrior or DK in how complex they can be. I haven't gotten that far yet (I've been busy getting my healer to 90 for the guild raid runs that are coming soon), but from what I've seen so far and from what I've read, I'm not going to be disappointed.
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  2. #42
    Coming from a bear tank (my tank in Cata) the BM monk is a nice change. I am kinda glad they start monk out at level one because there is a slight learning curve to them and getting used to there active mitigation.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by DirewolfX View Post
    That works if your healer can keep up with you. You can't use any defensive abilities while spinning, so it's risky.

    Also, Keg Smash + Breath of Fire will help get higher numbers. Especially if you pull with a keg toss (since KS only puts dizzying on 3 guys--the DoT part of fire breath is what makes it good).
    Keg smash hits and puts dizzying on all targets after the hotfix

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Monk
    Keg Smash damage has been increased by 50%.
    Keg Smash can now hit every target in range (was previously a maximum of three).

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by darkpower View Post
    I like to play a new class from the beginning, especially when I do a special role such as healer and tank, so I can learn with the minimal stuff then add each new thing into the mix as I level to get a feel for what I'm doing and I'm not overwhelmed by an array of buttons.

    At the lower levels, BM is very easy (as long as you don't get parties that are crazy about facepulling as I've seemed to keep getting when I tanked lately...though I never minded that on my Pally because all they had to do was run through Conencration for me to get the threat off and I could handle insanely large packs). See a mob pack that a bit out of the way and you want to pull them along with the ones you have? Throw a barrel at them like Donkey Kong.

    From what I'm reading out of this thread, though, is that they at some point become like a Warrior or DK in how complex they can be. I haven't gotten that far yet (I've been busy getting my healer to 90 for the guild raid runs that are coming soon), but from what I've seen so far and from what I've read, I'm not going to be disappointed.
    You really won't be, juggling all your AM abilities is quite challenging.

    I have run in to the problem of chi starvation as well really, especially now that I get in to moderate to high stagger stacks more often. I feel like I can't do much other than just keep shuffle up. And Guard on CD, using my Chi Burst basically never happens because I never have 2 chi lying around, think this will be fixed when I get more haste, but it's very painful for now.

  5. #45
    I don't really bother with the zen sphere/chi wave tier, really. I mean, I've specced into the 'chain heal/lightning' ability, but I barely ever use it. My chi goes on blackout kick, breath of fire, the move that boosts the damage of SCK (and grants Shuffle), Guard, and Purifying Brew. Seems to work fine for me.

    I have wondered about whether it's worth using Breath of Fire on a single target, though. I mean, it hits hard, but obviously has no defensive benefits. It's not like I have threat issues either, so I guess I'll keep using BOK. Haven't bothered to figure out what is better single target DPS though, BOK or BoF.

  6. #46
    As a hunter, I ran 5 heroic yesterday with a monk tank, your AoE power is insane.
    For any pack of at least 4 mobs, 100k+ dps sustained... Not asking for a nerf, but wow !

  7. #47
    Stood in the Fire Chiasmus's Avatar
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    The spec is great fun and very active on less difficult content. There is a huge disparity between the survival of, say, a Death Knight and a Monk on the more difficult content however. Brewmasters are getting destroyed more than any other tank in Challenge Modes at the moment, where half the time to survive without cooldowns the only valid strategy is to kite with Dizzying Haze and well positioned Clashes.

    Other than that, Keg Smash is absolutely incredible and needs to be nerfed hard. Overall survival needs some help on non-trivial content, perhaps by restoring Stagger back up to 30% baseline.
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  8. #48
    Stood in the Fire Mongler's Avatar
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    As a DK tank reading what you guys have to say about them, the only word that I can honestly say is.....interesting. Reading how much of a skill cap they require and them being the most active in the mitigation department among tanks puts me in a sense of disbelief, wonderment, ...and really, a little a bit of jealousy. I have yet to roll a monk due to helping gear up guildies for tonight, but now this has peaked my interest. Although..I think this depends on the person playing, not the actual class, like some of you were saying. I also take literally little to no damage in heroics and I get a waterfall of complements about it, but maybe that's just the experience I have and knowing what to do in any given situation and how to react to best serve not only me, but the group's well being. And if the class is every bit as intriguing as you guys make it out to be...then I'll try my hand in this and report on how much I like it.
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  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Affectionate View Post
    Keg smash hits and puts dizzying on all targets after the hotfix

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Monk
    Keg Smash damage has been increased by 50%.
    Keg Smash can now hit every target in range (was previously a maximum of three).
    I Thought this was the case. At the very least if the damage component only hits 3 (which i don't think it does) the haze debuff defiantly does.

    One thing though. BoF's hit detection is a bit screwy. The cone is too narrow at the point of origin taht i find myself having to backpedal to hit anything that isn't directly in front of me in melee range and it can miss larger targets all together.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Valient View Post
    especially if you glyph BoF and time it to interrupt casters.
    I agree with everything you said and thank you for the breath of fire glyph tip. I can see this helping alot!! The early pull Leg Sweep was/is crucial in certain trash packs.

    I like that you have to decide what you will be spending Chi offensively or defensively.

    I'm not breezing my way through heroics without taking any damage like some of the people in this thread but it has gotten a lot better since I first went in at 440 ilevel. I am breezing through heroics but my health does spike at times, mostly from trash not bosses; either from a stun as has been mentioned or from casters channelling and when there's multiple I can only interrupt one. I think the Breath of Fire disorient mentioned above will give me another tool to help prevent them from finishing/interrupting their spells. I can't wait to try it out once I pick up that glyph!!

    I have poor Clash and Transcendence usage but I appreciate the tips above on when to use it. I am trying to increase their use in my day to day.
    Last edited by Zene; 2012-10-02 at 02:03 PM.

  11. #51
    I'm only 64 but I'm having a blast tanking. I haven't had this much fun since TBC Prot Paladin....except being in outland. I agree BoF's hit detection is a bit screwy and I have the same issues that Zymn is having. I did run into a problem last night...I think it was more of a "Those people" LFD pug than a problem with the monk.

    It was Myself, my friend a Ret paladin, a shammy healer, a WW monk and a Demo Warlock. First boss in SP I taunt so he'll run pass the 2 packs before he get close enough for me not to pull adds with clash or to hit him with keg smash the warlock lays into him. The boss runs for the warlock. The WW monk taunts..cause...in 64 lvls I've noticed, that's apparently what you do as a DPS monk, spam whirlwind kick and do the flying kick into random pack of mobs cause they don't know how to stop. My friend crits with exorcism and gets aggro. Then the locks pet taunts.

    I couldn't pick the boss up so I just backed up and /sit. Waited for taunt to come off CD and then taunted...again.. I did get the boss at that point but then again I had to also kill the totems.

    Through out the entire run I had issues keeping mobs on me cause the WW monk kept taunting and the Locks pet kept AE taunting. It was getting to the point where I couldn't keep shuffle up cause I kept having to use all my Chi and Energy on threat generation. This was the first time I had this problem, I wasn't sure if it was me or one of those situations that turned me from a fun loving happy tank into the "I'm the tank damn it! We're going the way I want to go, the pace I want to go at based on the healer mana ofc. You pull it you tank it, if you're not the healer I couldn't care less if you die."

    I was wondering somethings though, what do BM's do about caster mobs that won't move? I can keep aggro on them so they just attack me but there's always DPS who wants to be a hero and instead of being the mob that hitting me I'll get later it's now the mob I have to keep making sure is paying attention to me. Should I take the ranged Paralysis for this? I often try to get them closer with clash but sometimes clash is goofy and either just won't go off or does nothing.

    Another thing, CC's like root and fear, whats a Monk to do?

    I know it's only 64 and with heirlooms and what not the instances possibly up until Cat content are a joke, which is sad when I remember doing these when they were relevant content, but I'm actually enjoying tanking for once.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Sabii View Post
    I was wondering somethings though, what do BM's do about caster mobs that won't move? I can keep aggro on them so they just attack me but there's always DPS who wants to be a hero and instead of being the mob that hitting me I'll get later it's now the mob I have to keep making sure is paying attention to me. Should I take the ranged Paralysis for this? I often try to get them closer with clash but sometimes clash is goofy and either just won't go off or does nothing.
    Roll to them, spear hand strike, drag back to the group. Or just drag the meleers to the caster; there's usually only 1 per pack, maybe 2. If 2, interrupt one and bring to the other. You'll be able to keep aggro on the meleers while moving by spamming SCK, and be able to avoid taking damage with Guard.

    Another thing, CC's like root and fear, whats a Monk to do?
    Not much unfortunately. You could talent into the thing that clears immobilizes for the roots, but for fears and stuns there isn't much. Just make sure Guard is up as much as possible and you should be able to survive it.

  13. #53
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    although if the gear already has Crit and Exp/Hit or Crit and Haste on it, and you are Exp/Hit capped and approaching often energy capping (at least during haste buffs), perhaps defensive stats would be more beneficial than haste at that point.
    I think you would still retain the Crit/Haste over anything once the Exp/Hit caps are reached. I think that one thing people don't consider is that EB's design gives Monk's a method to increase their average dodge through ratings that don't suffer from diminishing returns.

    Calculate out how much dodge rating it takes to get 30% more dodge (you can start from T14 agil levels) and pushing levels of haste (more energy -> chi) and crit to get as close to the 9 stacks in 9 seconds seems a lot more interesting (not to mention DPS boost). As others have said it's probably not possible this tier even in heroic gear but still makes Dodge/Parry look like a poor choice. I'd mostly like to see them tweak mastery so it becomes a more interesting option to consider.

    That being said I'm really enjoying my monk so far. The active mitigation of my DK coupled with amazing mobility is a lovely marriage. I'm just hoping our EH is where it needs to be starting off but with raids out we should start seeing feedback and logs regarding that very soon.

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  14. #54
    Warchief DirewolfX's Avatar
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    Now that I think about it, you can stagger while stunned, right? Mastery might be a good way to deal with stuns... delay the damage from stunlock a bit then purify it when you're out of stun. It might be less overall mitigation than crit->EB, but could smooth out spikes a lot.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Affectionate View Post
    Keg smash hits and puts dizzying on all targets after the hotfix

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Monk
    Keg Smash damage has been increased by 50%.
    Keg Smash can now hit every target in range (was previously a maximum of three).
    That's not correct is it?

    I thought it only applied Weakened Blows not Dizzing Haze.

  16. #56
    Warchief DirewolfX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jayinjersey View Post
    That's not correct is it?

    I thought it only applied Weakened Blows not Dizzing Haze.
    It applies both. Some bosses seem to be immune to Dizzying Haze, though.

  17. #57
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DirewolfX View Post
    Now that I think about it, you can stagger while stunned, right? Mastery might be a good way to deal with stuns... delay the damage from stunlock a bit then purify it when you're out of stun. It might be less overall mitigation than crit->EB, but could smooth out spikes a lot.
    but only when you can predict the stun to put up Shuffle. it's hard to get Shuffle up 100% of the time and it might fall off during stun at which point your not staggering as much of the damage anymore.

  18. #58
    I have Pally and Dk tank at 85. I raided w/ both and both are faceroll. I am now a 90 Brewmaster and leveled him from level 1. What I can say is Monk tanks have more going on in a fight. We have to keep up our dodge, parry and guard up and worry about the stagger DoT. If we have a shitty healer than we have to worry about self healing.

  19. #59
    Warchief DirewolfX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grubjuice View Post
    but only when you can predict the stun to put up Shuffle. it's hard to get Shuffle up 100% of the time and it might fall off during stun at which point your not staggering as much of the damage anymore.
    I think keeping up Shuffle 100% should not bee too hard with some haste + good add-ons to monitor duration.

  20. #60
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    not being a very good tank i find brewmaster a bit overwhelming, I think i may stick to mistweaver, and if i want to tank i have a Druid that i find much easier to play.

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