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  1. #61
    Herald of the Titans Kezool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    Lol, friend told me and pointed me to his stream, you have to look for a shittier tank....by far....dont know why people hype him so much :s
    How does your brain function? You post a dumbass statement and then wonder why he's hyped? He's hyped by the people sharing your mentality.

    Gratulations on not understanding yourself my good man, I would dedicate some resources on actually finding out who you are.
    Live in fear, for the bullsquirrel is near.

    The entire internet needs to be aware of this

  2. #62
    Herald of the Titans Zellviren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kanrei View Post
    So maths and sims are great, but in pratice you are going for what work best for you. Fornow Im not using Shield Block at all, only Shield Barrier so mastery dont have that high value and Kaeleena points are quite valid. Having high hit/expertise to be able use next Shield Barrier asap when previous is destroyed is more important then mastery.
    I enjoyed your post and largely agree, but Kaeleena's points are not valid because the reasoning behind them is ignorant of why mastery is a decent stat at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    We don't know all the reasons, and if you honestly think that SoO will last for 15 months and that WoD won't release until the 20th of december, you are beyond silly.
    Well, we'll just have to wait and see who's "beyond silly"... Won't we?

  3. #63
    The Lightbringer shadowkras's Avatar
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    Im not raiding yet, but i ran some heroics this weekend replacing shield block by shield barrier completely, and i noticed a glaring difference on the damage i was taking, some bosses my health simply wouldnt drop at all, and i rarely went under 70% on double trash packs.

    Could be that the extra attacks made me gain more rage from revenge spamming and got barrier up as soon as i took damage.
    People take stupidity to a whole new level when they sit in front of a computer.

    www.poepra2.com.br Um blog para quem prefere jogos multiplayer.

  4. #64
    After alot of speculation as to which way I wanted to gear I decided to talk to our raid healers and get thier thoughts/concerns, and was reminded of the few weeks before cata came out and Mastery was introduced to the game. My life became spikey with low mastery, and if I missed a block multiple times in a row I could be dead on the floor. Gotta love RNG. After that I tried stacking mastery and balanced out my damage intake. My point is even though the numbers do not lie on total damage intake with low mastery RNG comes into play and that is a risk I chose not to take especially when learning new content. I would hate to be causing raid wipes and adding to the stress of my healers by not stacking mastery.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by roflmfao View Post
    After alot of speculation as to which way I wanted to gear I decided to talk to our raid healers and get thier thoughts/concerns, and was reminded of the few weeks before cata came out and Mastery was introduced to the game. My life became spikey with low mastery, and if I missed a block multiple times in a row I could be dead on the floor. Gotta love RNG. After that I tried stacking mastery and balanced out my damage intake. My point is even though the numbers do not lie on total damage intake with low mastery RNG comes into play and that is a risk I chose not to take especially when learning new content. I would hate to be causing raid wipes and adding to the stress of my healers by not stacking mastery.
    Can you share your stat values? Or perhaps an armory link?

  6. #66
    Herald of the Titans Zellviren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadowkras View Post
    Im not raiding yet, but i ran some heroics this weekend replacing shield block by shield barrier completely, and i noticed a glaring difference on the damage i was taking, some bosses my health simply wouldnt drop at all, and i rarely went under 70% on double trash packs.

    Could be that the extra attacks made me gain more rage from revenge spamming and got barrier up as soon as i took damage.
    I didn’t agree with all of Preach’s advice in his Protection video, but he was correct about how best to use barriers – basically, only use them if you’re about to cap your rage (glyph is probably mandatory) or when you need them. The basic premise is that if you only use them when about to cap, you’ll always have one when you need it for the bigger nukes.

    Tanking Ook Ook and taking no damage during his frontal cone stun is a good laugh.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    We don't know all the reasons, and if you honestly think that SoO will last for 15 months and that WoD won't release until the 20th of december, you are beyond silly.
    Well, we'll just have to wait and see who's "beyond silly"... Won't we?

  7. #67
    Having cleared Normal MSV and about 35 attempts in on Heroic Stone Guards, I must say that you guys are missing out if you are purely using shield barrier. Shield block has its strengths and basically a 100% uptime.

    Obviously shield barrier is amazing. We are the only class with that type of ability and it is a huge reason why I think Warriors are the best tanks right now. But just defaulting to shield barrier will not always be the best thing to do. Dont be bad and just use 1 button because it is easy.

    As far as stat priority:
    Hit/Exp soft cap(purely through reforging)>stam>Mastery>Parry/Dodge

  8. #68
    Herald of the Titans Zellviren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by defer09 View Post
    Having cleared Normal MSV and about 35 attempts in on Heroic Stone Guards, I must say that you guys are missing out if you are purely using shield barrier. Shield block has its strengths and basically a 100% uptime.

    Obviously shield barrier is amazing. We are the only class with that type of ability and it is a huge reason why I think Warriors are the best tanks right now. But just defaulting to shield barrier will not always be the best thing to do. Dont be bad and just use 1 button because it is easy.

    As far as stat priority:
    Hit/Exp soft cap(purely through reforging)>stam>Mastery>Parry/Dodge
    I don't think anyone is saying you should default to Shield Barrier, that would definitely be an error - but with the sheer volume of magical damage flying around in MSV, as well as Shield Barrier's synergy with Vengeance, which encounters are you finding that Shield Block is strong on, outside of trash?
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    We don't know all the reasons, and if you honestly think that SoO will last for 15 months and that WoD won't release until the 20th of december, you are beyond silly.
    Well, we'll just have to wait and see who's "beyond silly"... Won't we?

  9. #69
    The Lightbringer shadowkras's Avatar
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    you guys are missing out if you are purely using shield barrier
    We are experimenting.

    But im sure if one ability was plain out superior to the other, blizzard would have nerfed it already.
    People take stupidity to a whole new level when they sit in front of a computer.

    www.poepra2.com.br Um blog para quem prefere jogos multiplayer.

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Thylacine View Post
    I don't think anyone is saying you should default to Shield Barrier, that would definitely be an error - but with the sheer volume of magical damage flying around in MSV, as well as Shield Barrier's synergy with Vengeance, which encounters are you finding that Shield Block is strong on, outside of trash?
    Twin Emps is a great place to use it. The boss hits extremely hard and I am taking less damage then our feral tank by a fair amount.

    I found that Shield blocking about 2 second before breath on Elegon and also shield barriering the breath covers the attack before, the breath and the attacks after. I never dropped below like 60% on any breath doing this. It obviously requires some rage pooling but not enough to take too much damage.

    Many fights require a mixture of both and I feel like many tanks are not utilizing both.

    This is probably the most fun I have ever had tanking. So much experiment and skill required compared to what it has been for years.

  11. #71
    Mechagnome Gritalian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by defer09 View Post

    I found that Shield blocking about 2 second before breath on Elegon and also shield barriering the breath covers the attack before, the breath and the attacks after. I never dropped below like 60% on any breath doing this. It obviously requires some rage pooling but not enough to take too much damage.
    This is exactly what I do. The amount of health I have compared to when I don't is typically 50-60% difference. I normally wait to pop Block right as he starts casting breath and can get barrier in just in time.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Gritalian View Post
    This is exactly what I do. The amount of health I have compared to when I don't is typically 50-60% difference. I normally wait to pop Block right as he starts casting breath and can get barrier in just in time.
    I feel like the majority of Warriors I talk to are saying "LOL BARRIER IS SO OP I NEVER HAVE TO USE shield block". I generate rage so fast with Shield block that i can use both most of the time.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by defer09 View Post
    I feel like the majority of Warriors I talk to are saying "LOL BARRIER IS SO OP I NEVER HAVE TO USE shield block". I generate rage so fast with Shield block that i can use both most of the time.
    Its propably beause its better to use Shield Barrier in dungeons etc. Even in Vaults with so much magic dmg on some bosses Shield Barrier provide better reduction if you need choose which ability use.

    Imo its all about pratice and knowledge what kind and ammount of dmg boss do to you and choosing right ability to mitigate it. And that will separate good warriors tanks from average ones.

  14. #74
    Herald of the Titans Zellviren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by defer09 View Post
    I feel like the majority of Warriors I talk to are saying "LOL BARRIER IS SO OP I NEVER HAVE TO USE shield block". I generate rage so fast with Shield block that i can use both most of the time.
    Having increased my expertise and hit to soft-cap levels, it is actually very noticeable how much your rage generation increases and how the “bleed” strategy really works. Truthfully, I just need more experience on more bosses now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    We don't know all the reasons, and if you honestly think that SoO will last for 15 months and that WoD won't release until the 20th of december, you are beyond silly.
    Well, we'll just have to wait and see who's "beyond silly"... Won't we?

  15. #75
    Stood in the Fire chaddd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CapM View Post
    "1. Stamina (until you have enough, see below);
    2. Mastery Rating;
    3. Parry Rating and Dodge Rating (there is an important distinction here, see below);
    4. Hit Rating and Expertise Rating."
    I went with:

    1. Hit Rating and Expertise Rating.
    2. Stamina
    3. Mastery Rating
    4. Parry Rating
    5.Dodge Rating

    I was going to try and gear as quoted but was having issues getting the 7.5 w/o gems/reforge, and just straight from gear at this point. W/O the yellow hit cap I was having a terrible time controlling raid boss mobs on pull and being able to keep my 2 charges of block and bleed to barrier on block CD going. Much better now.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-11 at 01:01 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Thylacine View Post
    Having increased my expertise and hit to soft-cap levels, it is actually very noticeable how much your rage generation increases and how the “bleed” strategy really works. Truthfully, I just need more experience on more bosses now.
    Just saw this last post and I totally agree. Not only does it feel much smoother tanking this way but I feel much more in control (the active part) of tanking now.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-11 at 01:02 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kanrei View Post
    Its propably beause its better to use Shield Barrier in dungeons etc. Even in Vaults with so much magic dmg on some bosses Shield Barrier provide better reduction if you need choose which ability use.

    Imo its all about pratice and knowledge what kind and ammount of dmg boss do to you and choosing right ability to mitigate it. And that will separate good warriors tanks from average ones.
    Basically. Block for physical, barrier for magic, and then barrier for bleed on block CDs since it can absorb any type of damage. The distinction of raid or dungeon are not important, just the type.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-11 at 01:06 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by shadowkras View Post
    We are experimenting.

    But im sure if one ability was plain out superior to the other, blizzard would have nerfed it already.
    If you are trying to run a mostly barrier build I like gearing for avoidance 1st.

    Parry>Dodge>mastery>hit=exp. I tried that, and it was good in dungeons, but I didn't like it in raids. Block->Block->Barrier, Block->Block->barrier is where it's at in raids it seems, unless its of course magic damage. If I know its just magic inc I jump the shark and just go w/ barrier at 60 rage.
    Last edited by chaddd; 2012-10-11 at 05:03 PM.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaddd View Post
    If I know its just magic inc I jump the shark and just go w/ barrier at 60 rage.
    That doesn't mean what you think it means.

  17. #77
    Stood in the Fire chaddd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Porcell View Post
    That doesn't mean what you think it means.
    "Jumping the Shark is a term used to refer to the point at which something that was once great reaches a point of sharp decline in quality and popularity."

    So you are right... ha.

    If I know its just magic I forego block and just go with barrier.

  18. #78
    To change the direction of this thread just a tad, how have you guys found your prot raid dps on bosses? After reforging to get enough hit/exp so I had sufficient rage for blocks/barriers, I tried to experiment with using my rage for hstrikes (and executes at sub 20%) rather than bleed barriers during block uptimes. The only reason I did this is because I was attempting to keep up with our blood dk tank who was pulling absurd numbers (yay for their recent nerf), and our raid has the belief of tanks spending resources on dps rather than pure active mitigation. How this will play out in heroic modes I have yet to see since we will start H stone guards tonight. After browsing through some of the highest parsing prot warrs in normal mode on WOL, it seems they're also spending a fair amount of rage on dps rather than active mitigation as well - I guess we will see tonight to see if we're able to trade the squishiness of not block/barriering for the increased raid dps.

  19. #79

    Question

    Hey guys,

    I need some help with optimizing a full avoidance build for Gara'jal 25 HC.
    I'm trying to figure out what would be best on full mastery VS parry/dodge in order to reduce Gara'jal's damage output on the voodoo dolls.

    Here is the WoL from Midwinter's kill:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=1555&e=1914
    Gara'jal output is 2/3 melee and 1/3 spells so as I see it, I should go with full mastery, though i'm not confident on my ability to keep SB up with no hit/expertise...

    I'd really appreciate some input so thanks in advance for your help.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Räzen View Post
    Hey guys, I need some help with optimizing a full avoidance build for Gara'jal 25 HC.
    This is an interesting topic for us too since we're on Gara'jal albeit 10 man. We were having discussion about whether 2 man healing it in which case tank avoidance is extremely important or go ahead and 3 heal with tanks taking on a more offensive role. I'm still figuring this out myself before sunday and unfortunately not a lot of warriors here have gotten to Gara'Jal i think, but any input would be terrific from anyone!

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