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  1. #1

    Ashe and life steal

    So the other day I was playing my main champ Ashe and almost every game I had, someone was insulting me for getting bloodthirster first after boots, and everyone said life steal is absolutly useless on her. Now, I don't know about anyone else, but I find it incredibly helpfull. My main items are BT, boots of swiftness, phantom dancer, black cleaver, blood razor and then my situational item, just not in that order. With a fully charged BT I almost dont need to blue pill to heal after a team fight, just need to wipe out a minion wave.

    Are these people insane, or did I miss something with her?

  2. #2
    Life steal certainly is NOT useless on any AD Carry. On most adc champions (depending on your situation), it's the best to go straight for an Infinity Edge, unless you're suffering from a lot of pressure on your lane, and you'll want to maybe get a BT or at least a Vampiric Scepter (I always get this before finishing my IE) first.

    You're better off getting Berserker Greaves instead of Swiftness. Simply because all they give you is movement speed, which you won't really need with your built-in slow, and Phantom Dancer.

    There's absolutely no reason to get a Blood Razor. Since you'd probably take it to shred tanks, you'd be far better off getting a Last Whisper instead.

    A typical full adc build would be:
    Berserker Greaves
    Infinity Edge
    Phantom Dancer
    Last Whisper
    Blood Thirster
    Black Cleaver or Guardian Angel

  3. #3
    I normally get blood razor for the attack speed. It's the single biggest AS increase I can find that's actually usefull.

  4. #4
    Moderator Axethor's Avatar
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    Yeah, BT is fine but what isn't fine is the lack of an infinity edge. Ashe has the best crit chance of any ADC, so the faster you get an IE, the more damage you put out.

    Phantom dancer is also a better AS item than Blodrazor because it give more crit and movespeed.

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  5. #5
    I think that what you're being yelled at is not so much getting BT, but not getting IE first. IE is just so much better on Ashe due to her inbuilt crit.
    "English doesn't so much borrow words from other languages as follows them into a dark alley, hits them over the head and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary."

  6. #6
    Mechagnome Silent's Avatar
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    Yep the inbuilt crit that works on the first hit only

  7. #7
    Herald of the Titans Caine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silent View Post
    Yep the inbuilt crit that works on the first hit only
    Point being? It's still pretty much a guaranteed crit on that first hit.
    "Defending a position by citing free speech is the ultimate concession: you're saying that literally the most compelling thing you can say for it is that it's not illegal to express."

  8. #8
    Ashe is a champion with basically no damage at all without items. You pretty much need Infinity Edge asap on her.

    Boots of swiftness really are not that good, they don´t give much movespeed for the price and berserkers are better. I recommend going the following build (works for every other AD carry in the game aswell): Boots and hpot, 1-2 dorans and vamp scepter for the lifesteal then straight to infinity edge. After IE go for a PD, after this you get LW if their team has some armor, else you go BT. At this point you should get a defensive item (GA, QSS or BV) then get LW/BT depending on which one you got earlier.

  9. #9
    I wouldn't build the BT early. If you need the lifesteal, starting with 2x Doran's Blades can help, or pick up the Vamp Scepter earlir, but don't full-built the BT until late game.

    Infinity Edge is FAR more bang for your buck on Ashe.

    I prefer the traditional

    Berserker Greaves
    Infinity Edge
    Phantom Dancer
    Last Whisper
    Blood Thirster
    Black Cleaver or Guardian Angel

    build for almost every ADC myself.

  10. #10
    Immortal Duilliath's Avatar
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    BT is fine. Even as first item, it might at times be a good idea.

    The rest of your build isn't. Only Phantom Dancer deserves a purchase.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Rampant Rabbit View Post

    A typical full adc build would be:
    Berserker Greaves
    Infinity Edge
    Phantom Dancer
    Last Whisper
    Blood Thirster
    Black Cleaver or Guardian Angel (GA is probably much better pick for your squishy ass, and if you have Last Whisper, you're fine with armor pen.)
    This. And I usually start with Vampiric Scepter instead of Doran's Blades... but that comes to personal preference. Infinity Edge is a must on AD Carries, especially Ashe.

    That first crit is quite damn important and can get you an early kill, nothing to laugh at.

  12. #12
    Moderator Isrozzis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skullrot View Post
    So the other day I was playing my main champ Ashe and almost every game I had, someone was insulting me for getting bloodthirster first after boots, and everyone said life steal is absolutly useless on her. Now, I don't know about anyone else, but I find it incredibly helpfull. My main items are BT, boots of swiftness, phantom dancer, black cleaver, blood razor and then my situational item, just not in that order. With a fully charged BT I almost dont need to blue pill to heal after a team fight, just need to wipe out a minion wave.

    Are these people insane, or did I miss something with her?
    Well, the BT first is completely standard. After that though, your build is kinda wonky. Always get zerker greaves on a ranged AD unless there is some really specific reason you need merc treads and you have a nunu (it almost never happens). After that you want to get a PD and Last Whisper. In general Last whisper provides more damage than Black Cleaver. BC is really only good if they have no armor and you get it early. And don't get a blood razer. There really isn't any reason to get one. It's expensive and the % shred is mitigated my mr.

    Though instead of BT first, I would recommend an IE first, since ashe's passive goes well with it. You can build a BT or an IE first then go with the standard items after that. But, to answer your question, a BT is by no means bad on a ranged AD. It's actually really good, and if you are getting it as your first item you are doing nothing wrong. I prefer the IE first, but that's just how I play my ranged ads.

  13. #13
    You can either build a BT first or an I.E., but building Madreds, Black Cleaver and Boots of Swiftness is a bad choice, just don't build those.

    Always go for the standard AD carry build with a defensive item after getting BT/I.E.->PD->Defensive Item.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Skullrot View Post
    I normally get blood razor for the attack speed. It's the single biggest AS increase I can find that's actually usefull.
    Sorry, but if you get a bloodrazor when there arent any HP stacking assholes, you're just plain bad.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Trafalgarlaw View Post
    Sorry, but if you get a bloodrazor when there arent any HP stacking assholes, you're just plain bad.
    I think it is pretty obvious reading the post that OP is pretty new to the game, no need to be a dick.

  16. #16
    Warchief
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    Only reason to start BT is if you're getting behind on your lane (or playing a non-sustain composition), or if your champion's ability scales really well with AD. Such as Ezreal, Graves, most of their damage really comes from abilities moreso than auto's. Whereas Ashe's damage only really comes from her auto's.

  17. #17
    Immortal Duilliath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackroo View Post
    Only reason to start BT is if you're getting behind on your lane (or playing a non-sustain composition), or if your champion's ability scales really well with AD. Such as Ezreal, Graves, most of their damage really comes from abilities moreso than auto's. Whereas Ashe's damage only really comes from her auto's.
    No.

    Getting a BT very early in allows you to dominate a lane hard, as any exchanges you have will automatically end in your advantage.

    That said, for some champions a BT over IE makes sense. Others really want IE first. Ashe is one of those that wants IE.

  18. #18
    Ok, so this discussion is starting to turn into an argument between BT and IE and to be honest, I can't see why people are so supportive of IE.


    IE gives you only 80 AD, 25% crit and an extra 50% crit damage.

    BT when fully charged on minions gives you 100 AD and 20% life steal.


    To me it seems the life steal would be a ton better than the extra crit and crit damage because you are constantly getting more HP back from the life steal where as your relying on RNG for a crit.

    Maybe it's because I don't really use IE, but when I get my build off, I don't have a lot of problem destroying people as well as staying alive. The few times I have tried IE, I couldn't survive for as long against a ton of burst.

  19. #19
    Immortal Duilliath's Avatar
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    The thing is... you're not buying it fully charged.

    Additionally, BT gives *one* offensive stat: AD. IE gives AD, Crit *and* makes every other bit of crit more damaging. A simple Vamp Sceptre and a Doran's Blade (or two) are more than sufficient lifesteal.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Skullrot View Post
    Ok, so this discussion is starting to turn into an argument between BT and IE and to be honest, I can't see why people are so supportive of IE.


    IE gives you only 80 AD, 25% crit and an extra 50% crit damage.

    BT when fully charged on minions gives you 100 AD and 20% life steal.


    To me it seems the life steal would be a ton better than the extra crit and crit damage because you are constantly getting more HP back from the life steal where as your relying on RNG for a crit.

    Maybe it's because I don't really use IE, but when I get my build off, I don't have a lot of problem destroying people as well as staying alive. The few times I have tried IE, I couldn't survive for as long against a ton of burst.
    As has been said many times before, Ashe has a built-in crit system that charges up every so many seconds until you crit.

    This is why it's preferable to start with IE. Solid AD, crit, increased crit dmg.

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