Do YOU like the new rep system?

[Dabrix32]

No and I refuse to do any quests becuase I hate questing. I never did Argent Tourney or any dailies during Wrath and I never did Molten Front Dailies during Cata. I just cant stand questing. Id rather actually play the game and run Heroics with other people for my rep. Questing is for leveling then it stops.

[Elegiac]

No and I refuse to do any quests becuase I hate questing. I never did Argent Tourney or any dailies during Wrath and I never did Molten Front Dailies during Cata. I just cant stand questing. Id rather actually play the game and run Heroics with other people for my rep. Questing is for leveling then it stops.

Orly? Well, allow me to flaunt my Silver Covenant Hippogryph.

[Dabrix32]

Orly? Well, allow me to flaunt my Silver Covenant Hippogryph.

So?...........

[Deleted]

Tabards that work in Arenas, Battlegrounds, Challenge Modes, Dungeons, and Raids. BoA rep tokens purchasable using Honor and Justice points.

Wrath and Cata had some very good concepts as regards making rep gain easier for people that like a specific aspect of the game.

I don't understand how getting reputation for PVE gear would make any sense at all by farming PvP, also farming dungeons for rep would still need a shared reputation cap together with the daily quests.

Wrath and Cata had a terrible concept of acquiring reputation because you could just equip said tabard and farm dungeons to no end until you were exalted.

[Deleted]

No and I refuse to do any quests becuase I hate questing. I never did Argent Tourney or any dailies during Wrath and I never did Molten Front Dailies during Cata. I just cant stand questing. Id rather actually play the game and run Heroics with other people for my rep. Questing is for leveling then it stops.

so dont play the game then, simple as that. You refuse to quest, fine i dont really care

[Glorious Leader]

I don't understand how getting reputation for PVE gear would make any sense at all by farming PvP, also farming dungeons for rep would still need a shared reputation cap together with the daily quests.

Wrath and Cata had a terrible concept of acquiring reputation because you could just equip said tabard and farm dungeons to no end until you were exalted.

Why is that terrible exactly?

[Deleted]

Why is that terrible exactly?

Because you plow through the content too quickly, you grind up all of the factions, get everything you need by farming hours and hours for a day or two, and then there is barely anything left to do in the game until the next big patch which is months away. It's much better to drag the process out over a longer period of time so it's not all consumed too quickly. You could say "well just don't farm the crap out of it if you want to savor it for later" but as you should well know that mindset doesn't work at all when you play in a guild and need to do all you can to stay on top. I'm not even in a competetive guild, I don't care what spot we are on compared to others, but I damn well want to make sure that I don't drag the rest of my team behind thus I will do everything I can to improve my character. Therefor I love this gating system because it's the same for everyone, I can easily log on a couple of hours a day, do all the rep stuff of the day and then go on and do whatever else I feel like. If the amount of rep you could gather per day wasn't limited I would feel forced to farm it to no end until I was exalted with every single one of the factions, and I know that the rest guild would do the exact same thing. In a week or two there would be absolutely nothing to do in the game again outside of raids, and it's Cataclym all over again.

[Glorious Leader]

Because you plow through the content too quickly, you grind up all of the factions, get everything you need by farming hours and hours for a day or two, and then there is barely anything left to do in the game until the next big patch which is months away..

That is BLIZZARDS problem not yours. I mean it's true you might do that or some people might and frankly even under those circumstances your really exaggerating but even then it's up to Blizzard to keep frresh content coming my way at a reasonable pace. Again we had 9 months without new content under the old cataclysm system. They lost players but they still somehow managed to keep 9 million. Not only that during wotlk they had a PEAK of subs. People didn't blast through content in no time and they weren't leaving in droves. People may have claimed they were bored on forums somewhere but the sub numbers don't reflect this. No the answer was and is to keep the system as it was in wotlk/cata and just not take 6-9 months to release patches. After 3-4 months people will get bored because even by that point the most casual of casuals will have seen it all and everybody and their alts will have seen at all. Even if you take the claim that people are bored, it wasn't because they burned through content to fast. It was because Blizzard didn't release content fast enough. They claim they will address this in this expansion. My suspicion is that they can't or won't and that's why they wen't back to this horrid regressive design.

Their was NOTHING wrong with the tabard system and everything wrong with their ability to release stuff at a reasonable time frame.

[Vargur]

I hate the new system. Too time consuming.

Wait until you unlock Revered for all factions. 3 hours minimum DAILY at peak times to complete them all and stay competitive.

[Deleted]

That is BLIZZARDS problem not yours. I mean it's true you might do that or some people might and frankly even under those circumstances your really exaggerating but even then it's up to Blizzard to keep frresh content coming my way at a reasonable pace. Again we had 9 months without new content under the old cataclysm system. They lost players but they still somehow managed to keep 9 million. Not only that during wotlk they had a PEAK of subs. People didn't blast through content in no time and they weren't leaving in droves. No the answer was and is to keep the system as it was in wotlk/cata and just not take 6-9 months to release patches. After 3-4 months people will get bored because even by that point the most casual of casuals will have seen it all and everybody and their alts will have seen at all.

Yeah they had peak subs during Wrath, which means that until then it head been increasing and at that point started to decrease. The peak was soon after Wrath's release if I'm not mistaken, which means that it was carried by the system from Burning Crusade, which did not have the tabard system, which let the content live for a much longer time. Wrath/Cataclysm system was basically ignore everything that is slightly outdated. You're saying the Wrath/Cataclysm system worked better even though that's when people started to leave? WoW lost a TON of subscribers during Cataclysm, it had a horrible design, hell even with MoP launch we are just above 10 million even though at Cataclysm launch we were up at 12, because people fear it's going to be just another Cataclysm expansion.

[davesurfer]

That said, no rep, and you dont get the item you want... Its not worth going just for the loot drop. Furthermore, raiders still did dungeons for rep previously. They don't now, so as soon as you outlevel dungeons in gear, theres no reason to go back.

In the previous model "raiders" actually maxed rep before they out geared the heroics, so not sure this makes any sense at all

[RandomGamer]

I don't like it. It's not about the mindless grind, or because it's time inefficient. It's about it being just an artificial way of Blizzard of making content last longer. It doesn't make things harder just slow and boring.

Their proposed fix for alts reputation doesn't help. I don't see myself doing dailies with every alt just to unlock valor gear. I'll just leave my alts rotting with 463 heroic blues or honor gear and wait for next patch.... Except I can't If I want to level up their professions.

So this is blizzard forcing you to play twice as much, forcing you out on the world.

[Glorious Leader]

Yeah they had peak subs during Wrath, which means that until then it head been increasing and at that point started to decrease. The peak was soon after Wrath's release if I'm not mistaken, which means that it was carried by the system from Burning Crusade, which did not have the tabard system, which let the content live for a much longer time. Wrath/Cataclysm system was basically ignore everything that is slightly outdated. You're saying the Wrath/Cataclysm system worked better even though that's when people started to leave? WoW lost a TON of subscribers during Cataclysm, it had a horrible design, hell even with MoP launch we are just above 10 million even though at Cataclysm launch we were up at 12, because people fear it's going to be just another Cataclysm expansion.

No it began to decrease when they STOPPED RELEASING CONTENT THAT WAS ACCESSIBLE TO PEOPLE. I.E IN cataclysm when (apparently) everyone felt it was to hard so that content wasn't accessible and later during the expansion when they just forsook the community for 9 months without anything and same for the end of wotlk when we had icc for god knows how long and one boss in between that was barely touched. Getting rid of tabards MAKES CONTENT LESS ACCESSIBLE TO PEOPLE. So they need to make content more accessible again and release more of it more often. I'm saying the overall reward system in cataclysm/wrath was perfect and made total sense (including rep farming through tabards) and had nothing to do with the reason that people left. It was the most progressive, finely tuned and the provided the most freedom I can think of. Do it at your own pace. As opposed to now where, hey don't log in YOU LOSE. Theirs lots you could have changed about cataclysm but the reward system (including tabard grinding) was the last thing I would have touched. I mean the argument being tossed around that this degree of gating is necessary is basically saying don't expect anything better than patches every 9 months. F2P games do better ffs.

[Deleted]

I don't like it. It's not about the mindless grind, or because it's time inefficient. It's about it being just an artificial way of Blizzard of making content last longer. It doesn't make things harder just slow and boring.

Their proposed fix for alts reputation doesn't help. I don't see myself doing dailies with every alt just to unlock valor gear. I'll just leave my alts rotting with 463 heroic blues or honor gear and wait for next patch.... Except I can't If I want to level up their professions.

So this is blizzard forcing you to play twice as much, forcing you out on the world.

It's blizzards way to give players something to do, something players have been crying out for to no end throughout all of 4.3.

---------- Post added 2012-10-05 at 05:28 PM ----------

No it began to decrease when they STOPPED RELEASING CONTENT THAT WAS ACCESSIBLE TO PEOPLE. I.E IN cataclysm when (apparently) everyone felt it was to hard so that content wasn't accessible and later during the expansion when they just forsook the community for 9 months without anything and same for the end of wotlk when we had icc for god knows how long and one boss in between that was barely touched. Getting rid of tabards MAKES CONTENT LESS ACCESSIBLE TO PEOPLE. So they need to make content more accessible again and release more of it more often. I'm saying the overall reward system in cataclysm/wrath was perfect and made total sense (including rep farming through tabards) and had nothing to do with the reason that people left.

If less accessible means less mindless farming in dungeons then I say that's a good thing. You should run dungeons for item rewards, not for reputation with a faction. To gain a factions trust you should do things, for them. Releasing more content more often is exactly what Blizzard is working on but has nothing to do with reputations. It might have been perfect for you, but it was a horrible system for me. I'm guessing Blizzard feels the same way.

[Glorious Leader]

It's blizzards way to give players something to do, something players have been crying out for to no end throughout all of 4.3.

No that's misunderstanding what the community wanted. The community wanted something to do.. MORE OF WHAT THEY HAD ALREADY. Not 9 month gaps. That doesn't mean they want gated daily progression. THEY JUST WANTED BLIZZARD TO RELEASE MORE CONTENT not stretch their already shitty patch model to make it APPEAR like we've got more.

---------- Post added 2012-10-05 at 03:34 PM ----------

It's blizzards way to give players something to do, something players have been crying out for to no end throughout all of 4.3.

---------- Post added 2012-10-05 at 05:28 PM ----------


If less accessible means less mindless farming in dungeons then I say that's a good thing. You should run dungeons for item rewards, not for reputation with a faction. To gain a factions trust you should do things, for them. Releasing more content more often is exactly what Blizzard is working on but has nothing to do with reputations. It might have been perfect for you, but it was a horrible system for me. I'm guessing Blizzard feels the same way.

As opposed to what Mindless farming of daily quests? Cause that's soooooo much fucking better right? Hey man I'm local panda guy Y. You wanna get in good with me well do the same fucking thing for a whole month and then I'll love you. That's much more realistic then wear this tabard in this factions honor and gain cred with them. You should run dungeons for rewards that are subject to either being ninjad or RNG bullshit? I'm guessing Blizzard knows where it's bread is buttered. It will make the decision that makoes more of it's paid customers happy. The vast majority of who are casuals, who lost out when the system is tied to daily fucking nonsense. Hell they already made changes I would expect alot more coming.

[Deleted]

No that's misunderstanding what the community wanted. The community wanted something to do.. MORE OF WHAT THEY HAD ALREADY. Not 9 month gaps. That doesn't mean they want gated daily progression. THEY JUST WANTED BLIZZARD TO RELEASE MORE CONTENT not stretch their already shitty patch model to make it APPEAR like we've got more.

The gap of content has pretty much always existed at the end of expansions, I recall people complaining in BC that the black temple had been going on for too long so they made sunwell, which didn't turn out all that well after all because it was so hard very few amount of people even got past the first boss or even set foot in there. Wrath had it with ICC, Cataclysm with DS, we will probably have it again in MoP.

I don't think it's that simple for Blizzard to just make more content. There was even a blue post reply on this matter only a couple of days ago that perhaps explains it better but, hiring more developers takes time, they need to make sure that they are skilled and passionate enough and that they really have work for them in the years to come. The content they are making also become more and more advanced, so it takes more time to develop the same amount of content because it's of higher quality.

Hell, even regular quests are a lot more advanced today compared to before. And gating the content does in a sense mean more, because it lasts for a longer time, because you're not devouring all of it at once like a fat kid eating chocolate, then crying for more when it's all gone.

[Glorious Leader]

The gap of content has pretty much always existed at the end of expansions, I recall people complaining in BC that the black temple had been going on for too long so they made sunwell, which didn't turn out all that well afterall because it was so hard very few amount of people even got past the first boss or even set foot in there. Wrath had it with ICC, Cataclysm with DS, we will probably have it again in MoP.

I don't think it's that simple for Blizzard to just make more content. There was even a blue post reply on this matter only a couple of days ago that perhaps explains it better but, hiring more developers takes time, they need to make sure that they are skilled and passionate enough and that they really have work for them in the years to come. The content they are making also become more and more advanced, so it takes more time to develop the same amount of content because it's of higher quality.

Single blue post aside if you go back and read some of the developer posts from GC one thing they talk about is exactly that doing a better job at releasing content faster. Not just because it took them 9 months to release pandas but also because their were just to many lulls during cataclysm without content. They've acknowledged this, it's their goal for pandas and apparently they're already on the ball for 5.1 and 5.2. Given that, I don't understand the regressive and limiting gating of this content, especially tied to dailies. Some gating I guess is required but this is excessive and frankly stupid. Tabards were fine, Blizzard was just slow to get content out. They know they were and they claim they want to do better. So do better. Don't make it appear you are by making content seem longer but not actually giving more of it.

[Deleted]

Single blue post aside if you go back and read some of the developer posts from GC one thing they talk about is exactly that doing a better job at releasing content faster. Not just because it took them 9 months to release pandas but also because their were just to many lulls during cataclysm without content. They've acknowledged this, it's their goal for pandas and apparently they're already on the ball for 5.1 and 5.2. Given that, I don't understand the regressive and limiting gating of this content, especially tied to dailies. Some gating I guess is required but this is excessive and frankly stupid. Tabards were fine, Blizzard was just slow to get content out. They know they were and they claim they want to do better. So do better. Don't make it appear you are by making content seem longer but not actually giving more of it.

I hope you are well aware that a lot of this content they speak of, is not raids or even necessarily dungeons. The content they speak of is to release more scenarios and daily quests in-between raids so you get something new to do while waiting for the next raid to be released. New battlegrounds and possibly dungeons were mentioned, but not guaranteed, even though we are of course going to see more dungeons added as the expansion goes forward, I wouldn't expect too much from said new non-raid patches.

And again no, tabards were not fine.

[Glorious Leader]

I hope you are well aware that a lot of this content they speak of, is not raids or even necessarily dungeons. The content they speak of is to release more scenarios and daily quests in-between raids so you get something new to do while waiting for the next raid to be released. New battlegrounds and possibly dungeons were mentioned, but not guaranteed, even though we are of course going to see more dungeons added as the expansion goes forward, I wouldn't expect too much from said new non-raid patches.

And again no, tabards were not fine.

Tabards were indeed fine as it granted more freedom than being tied down to DAILY quests. That should be stressed. IF YOU DON'T DO THEM DAILY it doesn't work in your advantage.

As for what the content they plan on releasing is we'll see. The raids themselves are gated and so is lfr and that I understand to an extent because raids are probably harder to produce. I'm fine with that. Gating everything else behind rep though is just stupid. It's a huge fucking cock block. It's not like you make VP that fast anyway so it's already gated by the limited supply you get. On top of that you now have to have this rep faction as well that can only be farmed one way, on a daily basis and with an artificial limit set to it. JP gear is also practically fucking useless. Another mechanic to gate character progression. They went overboard, it's crazy.

[Deleted]

Tabards were indeed fine as it granted more freedom than being tied down to DAILY quests. That should be stressed. IF YOU DON'T DO THEM DAILY it doesn't work in your advantage.

As for what the content they plan on releasing is we'll see. The raids themselves are gated and so is lfr and that I understand to an extent because raids are probably harder to produce. I'm fine with that. Gating everything else behind rep though is just stupid. It's a huge fucking cock block. It's not like you make VP that fast anyway so it's already gated by the limited supply you get. On top of that you now have to have this rep faction as well that can only be farmed one way, on a daily basis and with an artificial limit set to it. JP gear is also practically fucking useless. Another mechanic to gate character progression. They went overboard, it's crazy.

Not having a restriction for X amount of rep per day is not really more freedom, as a lot of people, me included, would feel forced to farm up the rep asap, which is exactly what Blizzard wants to avoid. They want the content to last for as long as possible, and for good reason.

As I said before I definitely feel that they should try to add an alternative to daily quests to gather rep for those who really don't like it, but it should still be restricted to the exact same amount per day, and be shared with it so you don't feel the need to do both.

Also it was Ghostcrawler I believe who said that the extra patches will mostly include daily quests and scenarios, it's not something I just made up.