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  1. #221
    We started progression on Heroic Elegon tonight. Our biggest struggle is usually mechanics overall, which is what I'm concerned about, since it takes us more than normal to find a strategy and adapt it to our playstyle.

    With that in mind, I've got a couple of random questions, since I haven't found more information elsewhere:

    1. I've seen some 2 heal, and 3 heal strategies. We are currently 2 healing it, but due to comp changes one of them just switched, and is behind the gearing curve, plus learning to play a new class sets it back a little bit more. Including the 12% nerf, is 3 heal a viable strategy, without having stellar DPS? I worry about learning the fight with 3 healers, only to fail at the DPS checks and having to readjust for 2 healers.

    2. After the 12.5% health nerf, think we could go with 4 and 4 sparks? Our comp has a lot of DoT classes, and we struggle making a 5th reliably (on normal, on heroic it'll be slightly worse)

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Odeanathus View Post
    So tried spiritbinder last night for a full night... Not that exciting for a tank imo but meh.

    One problem we had when we two healed it we had to send our shadowpriest in to heal the shadowrealm every now or then... He quickly started complaining about running OOM.. Is there anything special offspec healers do to manage this or is everyone running with a Disc priest running in DPS gear to overcome this?
    dps will OOM themselves offhealing (except druids during heart of the wild) and shouldnt be healing the spirit realm unless your healer didn't get sent down somehow. its possible for a dps (lets use feral druid as an example) to pop nature's swiftness and a predatory swiftness proc and heal themselves to full from 30%, but isnt really something you should count on in your strategy.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-26 at 08:30 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Maefor View Post
    2. After the 12.5% health nerf, think we could go with 4 and 4 sparks? Our comp has a lot of DoT classes, and we struggle making a 5th reliably (on normal, on heroic it'll be slightly worse)
    its possible to alter your strategy to optimize the damage your dot classes can do - for example instead of everyone attacking their own target, everyone spreading damage and cleaving. As a feral druid I do an absurdly high amount of damage to the sparks; a big contributor to that is getting a well timed (and preferably dream of cenarius buffed) thrash off on three of the sparks right when they spawn. It leaves me with less energy than I'd like to deal with my own spark, but helps the group overall.

    I dont have much to comment specifically to H elegon though, as I havent done it yet - good luck!

  3. #223
    Fluffy Kitten Puupi's Avatar
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    Go with 2 healers, 3 is overkill. We did it with 4+4 sparks.

    Our kill video from my resto shammy pov:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcr3J...ature=youtu.be
    "For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." - H. L. Mencken

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Raxxed View Post
    We've killed Elegon heroic and progressing on H Garajal at the moment. Garajal is extremely dps intensive on 10man and requires near perfect execution. Elegon is miles easier.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-25 at 09:05 AM ----------

    As I make that post we wipe at 2.7%.. bitch of a boss.
    Well, that's fairly interesting as we were killing heroics in a linear manner at the moment. How many days took you to down Elegon? (because I understand that wowprogress it's not to be trusted, since you were working on Gara'jal before going to Elegon?)

    Since several of you are calling it easier, I may try to suggest changing the order on our guild and go with Elegon now.
    Last edited by Espada; 2012-10-26 at 02:08 PM.

  5. #225
    Quote Originally Posted by Espada View Post
    Well, that's fairly interesting as we were killing heroics in a linear manner at the moment. How many days took you to down Elegon? (because I understand that wowprogress it's not to be trusted, since you were working on Gara'jal before going to Elegon?)

    Since several of you are calling it easier, I may try to suggest changing the order on our guild and go with Elegon now.
    we killed garajal and this week spent tues/wednesday progressing on spirit kings before deciding to go to elegon instead(getting mostly to 2nd emperor, sometimes 3rd). within 20 attempts we had acouple wipes at 6%. and that was mostly our faults(didnt kill orb in time etc). garajal took us about 120 wipes before we got it.

  6. #226
    Will of the emperor normal, what are the requirements for 2 healing it?

  7. #227
    Is it possible (I mean, does anyone really tried it out) to do the LFR thing on dogs - stack em at each other and just cleave? Of course, after setting them on differend stages of energy, like 0, 33, 66%.

    Im asking, because before our first kill we managed to get dogs really low - to like 10% - with this going on. We got them stacked after our 2nd tank died at about 50%. So, anyone actually did this boss that way?

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by jetpippo View Post
    Will of the emperor normal, what are the requirements for 2 healing it?
    requirements? as in healing needed? depends on your tanks, iv finished the fight doing 34k HPS and 45k HPS
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." -Friedrich Nietzsche

  9. #229
    Casual team raid leader here. Okay, so we're on normal Gara'jal 10 (we haven't had much time to progress with raid absences and such, a lot of bad luck in my team right now), we haven't gotten much time to work on him at all but I did notice that at the 3 minute mark, my raid (which had no problems getting Stone Guard and Feng down in time) had Gara'jal down to 65-70%. With a six minute enrage timer, we'd never make it in time.

    Currently what we were doing was sending the teams of two DPS and a healer into the spirit realm and they'd try to squeeze out as much of the Spirit World as they could. Healers were topping everyone off and trying to stack as much of a buff as possible on the two DPS and themselves, and the DPS killed as many adds as possible within the given 30 seconds.

    What I'm considering is having this done instead:
    Healer gets in, tops everybody off, and heals to max their mana. Then promptly leaves.
    DPS go in, get the adds down to a manageable level while getting buffed by the healer, then leave when the number of adds is lower than a certain number.

    Is this plan of action better? And, if so, what number of adds should we bring it down to?

  10. #230
    Quote Originally Posted by gerhard2202 View Post
    Casual team raid leader here. Okay, so we're on normal Gara'jal 10 (we haven't had much time to progress with raid absences and such, a lot of bad luck in my team right now), we haven't gotten much time to work on him at all but I did notice that at the 3 minute mark, my raid (which had no problems getting Stone Guard and Feng down in time) had Gara'jal down to 65-70%. With a six minute enrage timer, we'd never make it in time.

    Currently what we were doing was sending the teams of two DPS and a healer into the spirit realm and they'd try to squeeze out as much of the Spirit World as they could. Healers were topping everyone off and trying to stack as much of a buff as possible on the two DPS and themselves, and the DPS killed as many adds as possible within the given 30 seconds.

    What I'm considering is having this done instead:
    Healer gets in, tops everybody off, and heals to max their mana. Then promptly leaves.
    DPS go in, get the adds down to a manageable level while getting buffed by the healer, then leave when the number of adds is lower than a certain number.

    Is this plan of action better? And, if so, what number of adds should we bring it down to?
    We were having trouble balancing this the first time we killed the boss as well. What we ended up doing was making a priority queue of dps who would be going down.... with the first two a boomkin and shadow priest. While the healer heals them up, they both DoT up all of the mobs, and then one of the players is designated as immediately going back up as soon as he's healed to full. This gives him some buff, kills the adds, but gets him back on the boss as soon as possible.

    We tried something similar to leaving adds up intentionally and the damage was usually unbearable for the healers after a while. Our setup was a disc priest (me) with a druid. I consider both of us to be highly top-end healers.

    So to sum up what worked for us: make a priority queue for DPS, starting with DoT classes in your raid. Send two down, but one comes back up as soon as possible to DPS the boss while the healer and the other DPS stay down stacking buffs.

  11. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by gerhard2202 View Post
    Casual team raid leader here. Okay, so we're on normal Gara'jal 10 (we haven't had much time to progress with raid absences and such, a lot of bad luck in my team right now), we haven't gotten much time to work on him at all but I did notice that at the 3 minute mark, my raid (which had no problems getting Stone Guard and Feng down in time) had Gara'jal down to 65-70%. With a six minute enrage timer, we'd never make it in time.

    Currently what we were doing was sending the teams of two DPS and a healer into the spirit realm and they'd try to squeeze out as much of the Spirit World as they could. Healers were topping everyone off and trying to stack as much of a buff as possible on the two DPS and themselves, and the DPS killed as many adds as possible within the given 30 seconds.

    What I'm considering is having this done instead:
    Healer gets in, tops everybody off, and heals to max their mana. Then promptly leaves.
    DPS go in, get the adds down to a manageable level while getting buffed by the healer, then leave when the number of adds is lower than a certain number.

    Is this plan of action better? And, if so, what number of adds should we bring it down to?
    Our guild sends 2 dps down and a healer. The healer only stacks enough heals on himself to top off his mana and spams both dps. MAKE sure that dps are popping cooldowns right after they come out of the realm. And don't send a member down consecutively. Don't forget the final 20-25 is when you ignore spirit totems so dps increases there on the boss. Good luck.

  12. #232
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by h3lladvocate View Post
    Did about 30 attempts on H Gara'jal last night, don't know if were getting anywhere. Our best attempt was 20% enrage, so that's quite a lot to make up...

    We're lusting off the pull, HotW Resto + Disc DEEPS the boss in additon to rest of the raid, getting him to about 80% before first totem. Sending 2 dps + 1 heal every totem, stacking SI to 20+ stacks, etc. but DPS just doesn't seem there. Here's our comp:

    Tanks: Prot Pally + Brewmaster
    DPS: Fire mage, Affi Lock x2, Boomkin, S.Priest
    Heals: Holy Pally, Disc Priest (.5), Resto Druid

    Damage seems really high too, dunno what it is, don't know if we could drop to two heals, people are sometimes getting nearly globaled by adds + dolls. Any and all suggestions would be helpful!
    We get him to ~75% as hero ran out and our best attempt was 2.7%
    In reality our dps just need to be better.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-26 at 09:53 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Odeanathus View Post
    So tried spiritbinder last night for a full night... Not that exciting for a tank imo but meh.

    One problem we had when we two healed it we had to send our shadowpriest in to heal the shadowrealm every now or then... He quickly started complaining about running OOM.. Is there anything special offspec healers do to manage this or is everyone running with a Disc priest running in DPS gear to overcome this?
    Not sure why you can't just send a healer in rather than your spriest?
    If you're 2 or 3 healing, it doesn't matter, sending a healer in is crucial because of the mana return they get.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-26 at 09:56 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Maefor View Post
    We started progression on Heroic Elegon tonight. Our biggest struggle is usually mechanics overall, which is what I'm concerned about, since it takes us more than normal to find a strategy and adapt it to our playstyle.

    With that in mind, I've got a couple of random questions, since I haven't found more information elsewhere:

    1. I've seen some 2 heal, and 3 heal strategies. We are currently 2 healing it, but due to comp changes one of them just switched, and is behind the gearing curve, plus learning to play a new class sets it back a little bit more. Including the 12% nerf, is 3 heal a viable strategy, without having stellar DPS? I worry about learning the fight with 3 healers, only to fail at the DPS checks and having to readjust for 2 healers.

    2. After the 12.5% health nerf, think we could go with 4 and 4 sparks? Our comp has a lot of DoT classes, and we struggle making a 5th reliably (on normal, on heroic it'll be slightly worse)
    We 2healed. If you have god tier DPS, try 3healing.

    We had 6 stack - 5 stack. This worked around our dps allowing us to get 4 protectors in the second phase 1, and burn the boss in about 30 seconds in the final phase

    Instead of zerging the boss after we knew we'd let a wave through, we decided to change up the plan and dpsed the pillars the instant they became attackable.

    This lead to a faster, more flowing fight and gave us less adds in the transition, which were the cause of a good 30% of the wipes.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-26 at 10:00 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Espada View Post
    Well, that's fairly interesting as we were killing heroics in a linear manner at the moment. How many days took you to down Elegon? (because I understand that wowprogress it's not to be trusted, since you were working on Gara'jal before going to Elegon?)

    Since several of you are calling it easier, I may try to suggest changing the order on our guild and go with Elegon now.
    The dps requirements for elegon can be met extremely easily, the fight overall is just a walk in the park compared to Gara'jal's dps check
    We beat the enrage on elegon by almost a minute.
    We're wiping at 10% on Gara'jal most attempts to the enrage.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-26 at 10:02 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Okacz View Post
    Is it possible (I mean, does anyone really tried it out) to do the LFR thing on dogs - stack em at each other and just cleave? Of course, after setting them on differend stages of energy, like 0, 33, 66%.

    Im asking, because before our first kill we managed to get dogs really low - to like 10% - with this going on. We got them stacked after our 2nd tank died at about 50%. So, anyone actually did this boss that way?
    It's been done on normal mode, yes. Most of the high ranking logs do that and just cleavestorm through all 3 dogs rotating raid cds.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-26 at 10:05 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by gerhard2202 View Post
    Casual team raid leader here. Okay, so we're on normal Gara'jal 10 (we haven't had much time to progress with raid absences and such, a lot of bad luck in my team right now), we haven't gotten much time to work on him at all but I did notice that at the 3 minute mark, my raid (which had no problems getting Stone Guard and Feng down in time) had Gara'jal down to 65-70%. With a six minute enrage timer, we'd never make it in time.

    Currently what we were doing was sending the teams of two DPS and a healer into the spirit realm and they'd try to squeeze out as much of the Spirit World as they could. Healers were topping everyone off and trying to stack as much of a buff as possible on the two DPS and themselves, and the DPS killed as many adds as possible within the given 30 seconds.

    What I'm considering is having this done instead:
    Healer gets in, tops everybody off, and heals to max their mana. Then promptly leaves.
    DPS go in, get the adds down to a manageable level while getting buffed by the healer, then leave when the number of adds is lower than a certain number.

    Is this plan of action better? And, if so, what number of adds should we bring it down to?
    We sent down a healer and 2 dps, the healer bomb heals one of the dps to ~20 stacks then bomb heals the other dps to as many stacks as he can before leaving.

    If you send down a multidot class, bomb heal the OTHER dps first, they can leave earlier and the multidotter can just destroy the adds inside while you're utilizing the other dps's dps on the boss.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  13. #233
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Gara'jal heroic down.. brb going to a psychiatrist.

    Few quick things:
    2 Healed (Pally + Disc Priest)
    Tanks: 483 Prot warrior (me) 466 Prot Paladin
    Boomkin, Mage, Hunter, Ele shaman, Spriest, Frost DK

    Beat enrage by 11 seconds.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  14. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by Raxxed View Post
    Gara'jal heroic down.. brb going to a psychiatrist.

    Few quick things:
    2 Healed (Pally + Disc Priest)
    Tanks: 483 Prot warrior (me) 466 Prot Paladin
    Boomkin, Mage, Hunter, Ele shaman, Spriest, Frost DK

    Beat enrage by 11 seconds.
    To come back to your comment as to why we are not sending in a healer... is because we cant... One has voodoo dolls the other frail soul... How do you handle this? Wait untill the frailsoul runs out? Or all your healers top people off, leave a hot and exit the shadow realm?

    Seriously curious about this since the plan atm is to bring a smiter tonight as the 3rd healer.
    Odeanathus is one of those people who get's a job driving the special bus just to make fun of the disabled kids....

  15. #235
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odeanathus View Post
    To come back to your comment as to why we are not sending in a healer... is because we cant... One has voodoo dolls the other frail soul... How do you handle this? Wait untill the frailsoul runs out? Or all your healers top people off, leave a hot and exit the shadow realm?

    Seriously curious about this since the plan atm is to bring a smiter tonight as the 3rd healer.
    Having dps come out of the spirit realm before banishment means they will get the voodoo dolls rather than the healer (I don't know too much of how it works, I just asked our pally healer and that's what he said)

    As long as you have basically everyone outside when he applies voodoo dolls, it wont go on a healer. At least that's how i'm interpreting what he's saying.

    He called every single totem, so he knows more about it than I do.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  16. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by Raxxed View Post
    Having dps come out of the spirit realm before banishment means they will get the voodoo dolls rather than the healer (I don't know too much of how it works, I just asked our pally healer and that's what he said)

    As long as you have basically everyone outside when he applies voodoo dolls, it wont go on a healer. At least that's how i'm interpreting what he's saying.

    He called every single totem, so he knows more about it than I do.
    Wait... that sounds kinda.... an important mechanic... and also unlikely since the first time we have voodoo dolls it always picks one dps and one healer... (No one in the realm at this time).

    I could forsee you beeing able to get lucky/unlucky and also by leaving the shadow realm early you can make sure both the healers don't have frailsoul stuff but the scenario you described sounds very sketchy...

    Could you ask your paladin healer person to eleborate?
    Odeanathus is one of those people who get's a job driving the special bus just to make fun of the disabled kids....

  17. #237
    Hello, I was curious if you could soak the add explosion on Elegon heroic with Divine Shield (paladin) or ice block (mages)
    I am struggling to find any info on that.

  18. #238
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Myzaree View Post
    Hello, I was curious if you could soak the add explosion on Elegon heroic with Divine Shield (paladin) or ice block (mages)
    I am struggling to find any info on that.
    Hiya

    You sure can!

    We use 2 paladins bubbling for our kills

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-28 at 06:42 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Odeanathus View Post
    Wait... that sounds kinda.... an important mechanic... and also unlikely since the first time we have voodoo dolls it always picks one dps and one healer... (No one in the realm at this time).

    I could forsee you beeing able to get lucky/unlucky and also by leaving the shadow realm early you can make sure both the healers don't have frailsoul stuff but the scenario you described sounds very sketchy...

    Could you ask your paladin healer person to eleborate?
    Oh trust me, It was rediculously sketchy. The amount of times that I saw Voodoo Dolls on a healer with 9% mana made me want to shoot myself, but it somehow works and the boss is dead.

    The first dolls will always be on a healer, 100% downright guaranteed

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-28 at 08:24 PM ----------

    To clarify, 2healing is extremely RNG dependant, but 3healing is much more dps reliant.

    If you have the dps to kill the boss (~75% or less as heroism runs out) with 3 healers, I would strongly suggest doing so, it's a hell of a lot less frustrating than 2healing.

    I wouldn't suggest 2healing unless your dps is on the low side. It's much easier with 3.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  19. #239
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    2/6N hof down, hitting up garalon now. questions welcome
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  20. #240
    Quote Originally Posted by Raxxed View Post
    2/6N hof down, hitting up garalon now. questions welcome
    Good luck! that fight looks intense. I love raiding weekends but right about now I really wish I could be in the fight. Time to finish gearing one of my alts!

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