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  1. #121
    My guild put about 30~ attempts into H guards and never really made that much progress at all, partially because our offtank is incredibly undergeared or was at the time and if she ever had more then 1 dog on her she would get gibbed. As far as i understand it you are suppose to let unmitigated overloads go off in order to better control which dog is petrifying to break chains/pop mines when you may need to. Because for us we would just constantly get Jade or Cobalt and with 2 melee a lot of us would have to sit in melee and ended up either dying to chains from going two different ways around a mine or people just not being able to see mines because of the massive clump of spell effects/ground effects in the stack pile. Is it the correct way to let unmitigated's go off or just go about how we were doing it and try to avoid mines more?

    Also on Feng for the shadow phase we just cc'd bursted all the waves of adds down but occasionally one would slip through just heal all the dmg we had done to him. I've heard the barrier is used in some way during this phase so i assume its either used on the adds somehow or you use it on Feng when the adds are about to heal to negate the heal, which is it =D?

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Rurts View Post
    *NOT* true.

    Generally, you need to make a choice, considering your roster:

    - if you have strong dotters, like warlocks, boomkins and the like, generally anyone who can solo-dps the adds, go with 3 healers and send only 1 healer 1 dps down on each totem, rotating healers (duh) and dps (so they can put their stacks to good use nuking the boss)

    - if you *don't* have the luxury of having such a good dps roster, but your healers are good, 2-heal it

    The first tactic is easier, simpler and more fool-proof (doesn't strain the healers AT ALL + you will not have problems due to unfortunate voodoo doll placement), so if you have the right people, you should go for it. When in doubt - find a warlock, since Affliction utterly destroys this fight (did 82k this week myself in pre-raid gear with some arts 'n' crafts pieces, and I don't consider myself an exceptionally skilled player at all).
    You might have strong DPS but it sounds like you have bad Healers if you need 3. Just cause you are able to do it doesn't mean you should. Your putting a lot of un-needed stress on your DPS.

  3. #123
    We found it easily doable and not at all stressing with 3 healers, given proper food/flask/pot buffs, proper Innervation management and going 1+1 (which, like I mentioned, is more than enough with dot-based casters). Your statement can thus be easily turned around: sounds like you have bad dps if you need 6, you're putting a lot of un-needed stress on your healers ;]

    Regardless, the question asked was about viability of doing this boss with 3 healers. Sflame answered that it's currently not possible with 3, which I decided to clarify, so that Uniqed can have a clear picture of the options he has: if he thinks his dps are up to the task, it's totally fine to go with 3 healers, if his comp doesn't support it (no strong dotter in the raid), 2 is better.

    The take home message here is: using 3 healers is just as viable, eliminates any kind of rng-related risk (e.g. both healers getting VD, or even one getting it and consequently being low on mana at an inopportune moment) and can be done easily by a mid-range guild (we're 4/6 atm) given the right comp.

  4. #124
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Been swamped with stuff to do, sorry about no replies. I'll work on getting all the replies out now.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  5. #125
    My guild can't get Will of the Emperor down. We have wiped to the soft enrage several times. We tried two healing and found it impossible, so we are three healing. We are melee heavy. We start out well and are ahead on adds, then slowly fall behind. We're hitting the soft enrage at around 30%. We tank the bosses by the stairs and have a Rogue sitting on the boss. We prioritize Courage > Rage > Strength. Melee are mostly killing adds and ranged are the only ones who manage to get DPS on the bosses in between adds (until we fall behind). Tanks get an opportunistic about 75% of the time. The Rogue rarely gets the opportunistic. What can we improve on positioning and strat wise? I know the obvious: DPS need to do more DPS and people need to get better at opportunistics, but I don't feel like that alone will make up for 30% of the health still on the boss.

    Our raid makeup is as follows:

    BM Hunter
    Windwalker Monk
    Fire Mage
    Assassination Rogue
    Frost Death Knight

    Resto Shaman
    Holy Priest
    Resto Druid

    Prot Warrior
    Prot Paladin - a word on the Pally tank, he takes A LOT of damage. It's taking two of us healers spamming him to keep him up, and even then he'll die some times. What's going on here?
    Last edited by Selkinor; 2012-10-14 at 06:52 AM.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Selkinor View Post
    My guild can't get Will of the Emperor down. We have wiped to the soft enrage several times. We tried two healing and found it impossible, so we are three healing. We are melee heavy. We start out well and are ahead on adds, then slowly fall behind. We're hitting the soft enrage at around 30%. We tank the bosses by the stairs and have a Rogue sitting on the boss. We prioritize Courage > Rage > Strength. Melee are mostly killing adds and ranged are the only ones who manage to get DPS on the bosses in between adds (until we fall behind). Tanks get an opportunistic about 75% of the time. The Rogue rarely gets the opportunistic. What can we improve on positioning and strat wise? I know the obvious: DPS need to do more DPS and people need to get better at opportunistics, but I don't feel like that alone will make up for 30% of the health still on the boss.

    Our raid makeup is as follows:

    BM Hunter
    Windwalker Monk
    Fire Mage
    Assassination Rogue
    Frost Death Knight

    Resto Shaman
    Holy Priest
    Resto Druid

    Prot Warrior
    Prot Paladin - a word on the Pally tank, he takes A LOT of damage. It's taking two of us healers spamming him to keep him up, and even then he'll die some times. What's going on here?
    We 3 healed it tonight mainly because we wanted our shaman in and he didn't have a really good ele spec yet. A few things:

    1) We noticed our prot pally taking a lot of damage too. No one knows why. Luckily, he's a tankaholic and has a DK tank alt whose up to par, and took much less damage despite having less gear. I don't know anything about protpally, but I think most of the tank damage in this fight is physical, and prot pallies aren't really the best set up for physical mitigation.

    2) Your hunter, if possible, should be SV. Entrapment snares from frost/snake traps are amazing, and cleave is better in SV than it is in BM currently. Plus, pet uptime suffers on this fight a lot, to the detriment of BM. IDK mages that well, but our mage is frost for this fight, IDK if it's because she prefers frost as a spec or for some snaring reasons. With your melee comp it'll be on these two to do a lot of the snaring/CCing of rages while you're burning down courages.

    3) I don't know why you're falling behind, tbh. The problem with a melee heavy comp is getting them to the courage, snaring them, and killing them quickly. Rage and Strength spawn close enough to each other that it's not a huge movement issue. However, with the courage, a hunter should be able to easily disengage behind them and concussive rather quickly (that's what I do) to get the initial slows off. As our group hunter, and the AoE snare-r (binding shot is great for this fight, btw, as well as entrapment if your hunter has experience with SV), I break off the courage as soon as the melee are there and applying their snares, just so I can keep traps, glaives, etc on the rages. It's all about movement.

    4) You should have adds dying prior to the gas phases, or going into it. The problem here is you have so many melee, and you want to get them some DPS time on the boss during these phases, but if they take too much combo damage it's kind of pointless. They need to do some hurt on the boss, and be able to get those opportunity strikes for it to be worthwhile. Plus, they can't cleave, and you have literally only one multi-dotter in this comp, which is bad news bears.

    5) Keep in mind fixates break after hard CCs on the Rages. If your melee are in there DPSing and a thing breaks out of a ring of frost, it'll retarget someone and may wreck a melee.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-14 at 07:42 AM ----------

    We're starting heroic progression this next week, and I'm doing some research on H-Guards. We're formulating our own strat for the specifics of our comp, but feedback is always appreciated:

    1) Crystal runners. I'm thinking at least our worgen feral because he has 3 sprints, and me, worgen hunter, cause I have double sprint (from his symbiosis) and disengage. Whether we do 2 or 3, idk, I've seen both in videos. The third runner would probably depend - either our DK using his talented 30s CD sprint, a mage, potentially our rogue (though he does insane cleave on this fight).

    2) questions on activating tiles: Does blink activate them all in a line, or will it skip them? Same question for: disengage, warlock gate, warrior leap, druid charge (the one which charges you to an ally in resto spec I believe).

    3) Exploding things outside of their petrification. Obviously don't plan on doing this with chains, but I've been exploding cobalts on CD with deterrence - still helpful in heroic? My DPS goes down as a result obviously, but normal modes haven't really been an issue with DPS. Obviously explode as many as possible during cobalt petrify.

    4) Where to stop with tile running? I've seen videos where at around 30ish% they just stop running tiles and if the guardian sucks them up, it sucks them up.

    5) Tank 2 on one side always, or switch which side has 2? We juggle them a bit more in normal to keep 2 on one side so melee don't have to move as much, but that obviously leads to more pools/mines, etc on one side, especially if we have chains and we have to go into melee with our chained ppl.
    Last edited by eschatological; 2012-10-14 at 07:33 AM.

  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Rurts View Post
    sounds like you have bad dps if you need 6, you're putting a lot of un-needed stress on your healers ;]
    Yeah cause faster kills are always a bad thing right..... >.>

  8. #128
    You're a persistent one, eh? Look, I'm not sure what else can I say in addition to the points I made above, i.e. that both tacts are viable and the decision to use one should be made based on raid comp, individual performance and personal preference.

    Ok, look: OUT OF TWO EQUALLY VIABLE WAYS OF DOING THE SAME THING YOURS IS BETTER!!!1

    There, I said it. Now, can you please find something else to fixate on? We're derailing a useful thread.

  9. #129
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-e86q9xst9rua2ebz/

    Logs from tonights Elegon

    I know we had many lolwtf stupid wipes, but is there any chance you could point out what we are doing wrong, what changes should we make ?

  10. #130
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    I really meed more spare time..

    I'm free in just over an hour. Should be able to reply to the majority of peoples posts.

    Sorry for the delays.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:13 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by zebpally View Post
    Thats our latest attempt on Gara'jal. We had to pug a dps that left and then another one and he left as well after a few wipes. So our progression halted. But I don't I feel like we are really stuck on this boss. I am the dk tank. I really don't know what to do or how to fix the situation. We are either dead well before the enrage timer. Our druid tank is subbing in. Healing is his main spec. I would really appreciate if someone can give us any ideas or any tips. We were 1 min off enrage when we wiped on our best attempt.
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=1832&e=2116
    I would suggest 3healing if you are dying before the enrage. We've 3healed on our kills and still beaten the enrage by a nice margin.

    Utilize your warlock in the spirit realm. DoT classes in there are absolute GODS.

    Make sure you're not sending people in with stacks, they should be focusing the boss to ensure the stacks aren't going to waste.

    Spam heals on those in the spirit realm, for each heal they gain 1-2 stacks.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:14 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Uniqed View Post
    My guild is starting on Gara'jal normal and my question is if you should start with a setup that involves three healers and see if we can beat the enragetimer or if 2 healing it is the way to go from the start.
    3 Healing is fine

    See my above post, Ensure you're utilizing DoT classes and not sending people in with stacks of the buff.

    Also ensure you're bomb healing those in the spirit realm.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:21 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by dk3790 View Post
    Hey Rax, I have another question. Is there a way to reliably steal the stun from Feng? I saw on heroic mode it's pretty much required so I'm trying to get our tanks to perfect it for hardmode. Whenever we do it, sometimes Feng just doesn't use his fists ability at all. We all stack at a point about 30 yards away from him and when he casts fist the tank turns the boss toward the person who's going to eat it and then we're good. However sometimes he just never uses it. Also here are our logs from elegon last night, we are taking alot of damage from the total anihilation if you have any tips http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-3d...ses&boss=60410
    Hiya

    We didn't spellsteal his fists, we just spellstole his Epicenter for bonus damage. On both normal and heroic Epicenter doesn't do high enough damage to worry about providing your healers are on the ball or you have very reliable raid cooldowns. We used null barrier on the entire group in Heroic, not just the melee allowing them to continue dpsing.

    We didn't wipe once to the lightning/epicenter phase on heroic - and he had stacks of increased damage by the time we got to him. I wouldn't say it's a neccesity to steal it, Epicenter provides such a HUGE damage gain.

    Elegon
    From reading your death logs and seeing things such as
    [23:57:11.988] Celestial Protector Total Annihilation Sherlok 300804
    [23:57:11.988] Celestial Protector Total Annihilation Sphork 299073
    [00:03:38.684] Celestial Protector Total Annihilation Chilidogg 298431 (O: 3116) (more)
    [00:03:38.726] Celestial Protector Total Annihilation Hermionie 256174 (O: 47528) (more)

    Either:
    1) People aren't reliably dropping stacks before a total annihilation.
    2) The protector is exploding on the platform.

    No-one should take any more than 200k damage from it, other than the tank who is holding the boss and obviously is unable to drop his stacks.

    Dropping stacks is CRUCIAL before you have a protector explode, at least for progressing guilds.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:23 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Sflame View Post
    You should 2 heal this. You will not be able to beat the enrage timer with 3 healers at our current item level. We tried and always got to around 10-12%. With 2 healers we beat the enrage by 12 seconds. There isn't really even a need for 3 healers. With the healers rotating going to the Spirit Realm they get full mana when they come back out. Only time it will suck is if the same healer keeps getting Voodooed and has to stay out.
    Incorrect. We beat the enrage by ~45 seconds with 3 healers on the first night the raid was released.
    Check my guilds logs if you wish, they can be found on the wow-heroes link in my signature.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:31 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Grundul View Post
    My guild put about 30~ attempts into H guards and never really made that much progress at all, partially because our offtank is incredibly undergeared or was at the time and if she ever had more then 1 dog on her she would get gibbed. As far as i understand it you are suppose to let unmitigated overloads go off in order to better control which dog is petrifying to break chains/pop mines when you may need to. Because for us we would just constantly get Jade or Cobalt and with 2 melee a lot of us would have to sit in melee and ended up either dying to chains from going two different ways around a mine or people just not being able to see mines because of the massive clump of spell effects/ground effects in the stack pile. Is it the correct way to let unmitigated's go off or just go about how we were doing it and try to avoid mines more?

    Also on Feng for the shadow phase we just cc'd bursted all the waves of adds down but occasionally one would slip through just heal all the dmg we had done to him. I've heard the barrier is used in some way during this phase so i assume its either used on the adds somehow or you use it on Feng when the adds are about to heal to negate the heal, which is it =D?
    Can you describe undergeared? I was 471 ilvl when I killed it (Main tank).
    I'm not sure how you are surviving an unmitigated Overload. They hit for 500k? You should never ever ever have an overload from a dog that isn't casting petrification.
    Avoiding mines is crucial. You should be popping them AS SOON as you enter a cobalt phase.
    Hunters can deterrence + rocket boots through mines in a non cobalt phase to clean it up.
    As can paladins (bubble).
    If people are dying to chains, they aren't stacking fast enough. They only tick for 35k for the first tick and only slowly increases. You have about 5 seconds before it becomes unhealable.

    I don't want to spoil how you do the null barrier. It's a crucial part of progression. It would effectively give away the hardmode.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:38 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Selkinor View Post
    My guild can't get Will of the Emperor down. We have wiped to the soft enrage several times. We tried two healing and found it impossible, so we are three healing. We are melee heavy. We start out well and are ahead on adds, then slowly fall behind. We're hitting the soft enrage at around 30%. We tank the bosses by the stairs and have a Rogue sitting on the boss. We prioritize Courage > Rage > Strength. Melee are mostly killing adds and ranged are the only ones who manage to get DPS on the bosses in between adds (until we fall behind). Tanks get an opportunistic about 75% of the time. The Rogue rarely gets the opportunistic. What can we improve on positioning and strat wise? I know the obvious: DPS need to do more DPS and people need to get better at opportunistics, but I don't feel like that alone will make up for 30% of the health still on the boss.

    Our raid makeup is as follows:

    BM Hunter
    Windwalker Monk
    Fire Mage
    Assassination Rogue
    Frost Death Knight

    Resto Shaman
    Holy Priest
    Resto Druid

    Prot Warrior
    Prot Paladin - a word on the Pally tank, he takes A LOT of damage. It's taking two of us healers spamming him to keep him up, and even then he'll die some times. What's going on here?
    We 2healed it with a disc priest/hpally.

    The Disc Priest did about 15k dps, and focused more on dpsing than healing. The hpally was fine for the most part.

    Myself warrior tanking, and a blood dk tank.

    I would tank my boss on top of the rages spawning point, and shockwave them as they spawned and piercing howl straight after.

    Our rogue focused on the rages as they were failing the dance too much and diverting too many heals to themself. This meant the rest of our dps could focus a lot more on the boss. Our rogue effectively solod the rages whilst all of our dps switched to strengths and to courages.

    I died on the kill attempt to a 230k melee swing, so your tanks do get hit hard. (This was without any armor debuff)

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:47 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    We're starting heroic progression this next week, and I'm doing some research on H-Guards. We're formulating our own strat for the specifics of our comp, but feedback is always appreciated:

    1) Crystal runners. I'm thinking at least our worgen feral because he has 3 sprints, and me, worgen hunter, cause I have double sprint (from his symbiosis) and disengage. Whether we do 2 or 3, idk, I've seen both in videos. The third runner would probably depend - either our DK using his talented 30s CD sprint, a mage, potentially our rogue (though he does insane cleave on this fight).

    2) questions on activating tiles: Does blink activate them all in a line, or will it skip them? Same question for: disengage, warlock gate, warrior leap, druid charge (the one which charges you to an ally in resto spec I believe).

    3) Exploding things outside of their petrification. Obviously don't plan on doing this with chains, but I've been exploding cobalts on CD with deterrence - still helpful in heroic? My DPS goes down as a result obviously, but normal modes haven't really been an issue with DPS. Obviously explode as many as possible during cobalt petrify.

    4) Where to stop with tile running? I've seen videos where at around 30ish% they just stop running tiles and if the guardian sucks them up, it sucks them up.

    5) Tank 2 on one side always, or switch which side has 2? We juggle them a bit more in normal to keep 2 on one side so melee don't have to move as much, but that obviously leads to more pools/mines, etc on one side, especially if we have chains and we have to go into melee with our chained ppl.
    Hiya

    1) We had basically everyone possible doing it. I would run tiles despite the color of the dog overloading. It's only a 60k tick and I can decrease that almost immediately. Our hunter and ret paladin (don't ask) were the main runners, as well as me and the DK tank. Our mage and boomkin were the main backups, and our spriest ran a few, too. Sprints are really overrated. As long as it's only your tanks taking the unmitigated crystal debuffs, the debuff won't tick hard enough to worry about getting rid of it asap. Obviously for progressing guilds - you can use sprints etc as it will increase your damage and spirit faster. But we just found it unnecessary.

    2) I'm not sure, Heroic leap doesn't activate them, I had to physically run over them. So i'm assuming only walking/running over them actually works.

    3) Our hunter rocket boots + deterrenced to blow up cobalts when they were confining our space and we hadn't had a cobalt phase in a while. Our pallies also bubbled and just ran through them aswell. This is an incredibly valuable tool to have.

    4) We went 50 - 60 - 70 (50 tiles until 75%, 60 tiles until 40% and then 70 tiles until dead). We popped hero after lighting up the 70th tile and burned.

    5) We just pulled them as they were. 2 Left 1 Right then tank swapped accordingly when it was needed. We moved the bosses a hell of a lot to cater for chains and bombs.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 12:54 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Feii View Post
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-e86q9xst9rua2ebz/

    Logs from tonights Elegon

    I know we had many lolwtf stupid wipes, but is there any chance you could point out what we are doing wrong, what changes should we make ?
    Right off the bat, your tanks dps is incredibly low. Take a look at my logs to see what sort of dps your tanks should be pulling. We use the same tank setup as you, also. (My logs are in my wow-heroes link in my sig)

    You need to practice on sparks, you really need to kill at least 8, especially with your groups dps. 10 is ideal. The more sparks, the faster P3 is.

    You need to rotate your healing cooldowns/defensive cooldowns better in P3, theres no need to reset stacks and everyone should be stacked under the boss zerging him down whilst ensuring that there are sufficient cooldowns going out and the healers are able to heal the damage. It should be easily healable for ~90 seconds.
    Last edited by Raxxed; 2012-10-15 at 12:56 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  11. #131
    The Patient BRACE FOR IMPACT's Avatar
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    So after afew nights of wiping on N10 Elegon I've decided to ask the masses on anything we should improve.

    Right now it feels like we're rather heavy on dps, considering we enter last phase with 10 stacks on the boss and 1min 30 seconds ~ until enrage. ( 2 adds first p1 then 3 adds second p1). But once we get into last burn phase we just can't seem to keep ourself alive.
    Our current raid group consists out of:
    Feral druid
    Blood DK
    Unholy DK
    Elemental Shaman
    Retribution Paladin
    Fire Mage
    Resto Druid
    Protection Warrior
    Holy Priest
    DPS Monk (this is his OS)
    With me and the Elemental shammy being at 90k dps before the last burn phase, everyone else ranging between 70k to 85k.


    We've managed to enter the burn phase 4-5 tries with everyone alive, both tries we pop BL instantly with me doing HOTW + Tranquility.
    On some tries we've tried to reset our stacks at ~ 5. But people ended up dying, so we tried just popping all defensive cooldowns and staying in, which resulted in a 5% wipe. (with 50 seconds left on the enrage).

    What we're considering now is going 3 healers, since the monk is OS dps and his dps is in the lower brackets of our raid.
    What we're afraid this might do is that we're going to have problems pushin 2 then 3 adds in phase 1 and we're afraid it's going to be alot harder managing orbs.

    Any ideas?
    You can say I'm just a fool, that stands for nothing, well to that
    I SAY YOU'RE A CUNT
    Formerly known as Eniah/Enyah

  12. #132
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eniah View Post
    So after afew nights of wiping on N10 Elegon I've decided to ask the masses on anything we should improve.

    Right now it feels like we're rather heavy on dps, considering we enter last phase with 10 stacks on the boss and 1min 30 seconds ~ until enrage. ( 2 adds first p1 then 3 adds second p1). But once we get into last burn phase we just can't seem to keep ourself alive.
    Our current raid group consists out of:
    Feral druid
    Blood DK
    Unholy DK
    Elemental Shaman
    Retribution Paladin
    Fire Mage
    Resto Druid
    Protection Warrior
    Holy Priest
    DPS Monk (this is his OS)
    With me and the Elemental shammy being at 90k dps before the last burn phase, everyone else ranging between 70k to 85k.


    We've managed to enter the burn phase 4-5 tries with everyone alive, both tries we pop BL instantly with me doing HOTW + Tranquility.
    On some tries we've tried to reset our stacks at ~ 5. But people ended up dying, so we tried just popping all defensive cooldowns and staying in, which resulted in a 5% wipe. (with 50 seconds left on the enrage).

    What we're considering now is going 3 healers, since the monk is OS dps and his dps is in the lower brackets of our raid.
    What we're afraid this might do is that we're going to have problems pushin 2 then 3 adds in phase 1 and we're afraid it's going to be alot harder managing orbs.

    Any ideas?
    Sounds like you guys have the fight down quite well.

    All I can offer as advice would be to be more vigilant on what raid cooldowns you use and when.

    You should be able to survive for a long time in Phase3 without dying, and you should never have to reset your stacks.

    Stacking up under the boss, rotating cooldowns when necessary and burning the boss like theres no tomorrow is what we did, and we killed him with everyone over 80% health.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  13. #133
    The Patient BRACE FOR IMPACT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raxxed View Post
    Sounds like you guys have the fight down quite well.

    All I can offer as advice would be to be more vigilant on what raid cooldowns you use and when.

    You should be able to survive for a long time in Phase3 without dying, and you should never have to reset your stacks.

    Stacking up under the boss, rotating cooldowns when necessary and burning the boss like theres no tomorrow is what we did, and we killed him with everyone over 80% health.
    From reading through the thread, I actually kinda know how we're going to kill it now.
    Our shaman is specced into healing stream totem, instead of Ancestral Guidance.

    So previously our healers have been having to pop CDs on the adds in p1, where as AG only has 2 minutes CD, so it could save some of them until then.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 03:27 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Raxxed View Post
    Sounds like you guys have the fight down quite well.

    All I can offer as advice would be to be more vigilant on what raid cooldowns you use and when.

    You should be able to survive for a long time in Phase3 without dying, and you should never have to reset your stacks.

    Stacking up under the boss, rotating cooldowns when necessary and burning the boss like theres no tomorrow is what we did, and we killed him with everyone over 80% health.
    Everyone above 80% health sounds extremly hard aswell, when we're on last phase everyone is on 20-30% health. (except when I tranquility, but after that we just seem to drop like flies, but I'm hoping our shaman speccing into AG will fix that)
    You can say I'm just a fool, that stands for nothing, well to that
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  14. #134
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eniah View Post
    From reading through the thread, I actually kinda know how we're going to kill it now.
    Our shaman is specced into healing stream totem, instead of Ancestral Guidance.

    So previously our healers have been having to pop CDs on the adds in p1, where as AG only has 2 minutes CD, so it could save some of them until then.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 03:27 AM ----------



    Everyone above 80% health sounds extremly hard aswell, when we're on last phase everyone is on 20-30% health. (except when I tranquility, but after that we just seem to drop like flies, but I'm hoping our shaman speccing into AG will fix that)
    Admittedly the start of the phase is the worst part. You're all running in after having a transition phase and will be very low health + adds to kill.
    We have our boomkin tranq + my rallying cry as we're running in and then pick it up from there.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  15. #135
    The Patient BRACE FOR IMPACT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raxxed View Post
    Admittedly the start of the phase is the worst part. You're all running in after having a transition phase and will be very low health + adds to kill.
    We have our boomkin tranq + my rallying cry as we're running in and then pick it up from there.
    Thanks for your help dude, We'll probably kill it next raid
    You can say I'm just a fool, that stands for nothing, well to that
    I SAY YOU'RE A CUNT
    Formerly known as Eniah/Enyah

  16. #136
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eniah View Post
    Thanks for your help dude, We'll probably kill it next raid
    No problem, glad I could help.

    Good luck!
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  17. #137
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/fjkjpprghelb0zht/

    Had the same trouble as last poster pretty much.. Not stacking for the last phase, trying really hard to push through but last phase is just too much..

    Might of not uploaded all the logs.. new to logs. hopefully they have enough datas. edit: I think because of the disconnect I had when I fell through the floor on a wipe that it wiped all the good attempts from the clog. How unfortunate..

    Best attempt was 5%, and last few attempts were all consistent 4th phases.

    I guess we just need to stack up last phase, everyone on melee except tanks and use our cds to be use Aura Mastery -> Spirit Link, etc :s
    Last edited by Acry; 2012-10-15 at 04:35 AM.

  18. #138
    Mechagnome
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    So I'm reading about Gara'jal and the "not sending people in with stacks" stuff and came to realize.... we've been doing it wrong all along. We were sending one designated DPS and a healer into the spirit realm, every time.

    However, we didn't have much trouble either. We killed him on the 9th try and beat the enrage by 24s. I (Aff Lock) was the one going into the spirit realm and solo'd (well, duo'd with the healer) all the adds in the spirit realm, every time. Sometimes even without a healer (an accident, but HS + Soul Harvest + Mortal Coil = win). Everyone else just nuked the boss for the entire duration. When I went back to the physical realm I would put up all the dots before re-entering the spirit realm immediately.

    As an Affliction Warlock this is possible because the adds in the spirit realm yield full Sould Shards when killed with Drain Soul. I would basically go in, use all shards on SB:SS, MG then DS one add to get Shards back, dot up adds, rinse and repeat until 30s approaches.

    We used 2 healers, and BL at around 30% when the healing got intense. Our DPS is alright, good for the gear I suppose (most everyone in the 460's, myself at 467). We are a casual raid guild with 3 nights/week 2-3 hours/night.

    Logs: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/b...?s=4721&e=5057
    Note that my DPS (the Warlock) isn't correct, as I spent most of the time in the spirit world.

    Some food for thought, maybe.

  19. #139
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaeh View Post
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/fjkjpprghelb0zht/

    Had the same trouble as last poster pretty much.. Not stacking for the last phase, trying really hard to push through but last phase is just too much..

    Might of not uploaded all the logs.. new to logs. hopefully they have enough datas. edit: I think because of the disconnect I had when I fell through the floor on a wipe that it wiped all the good attempts from the clog. How unfortunate..

    Best attempt was 5%, and last few attempts were all consistent 4th phases.

    I guess we just need to stack up last phase, everyone on melee except tanks and use our cds to be use Aura Mastery -> Spirit Link, etc :s
    Hiya

    Looks like your major problem is just a lack of dps.

    Your groups highest dps didn't each reach the amount of DPS the off tank did in my group - I'm not sure if this is because you're not killing enough sparks, or if the dps is just low in general.

    The more dps you do, the faster you'll be burning through the final phase. We popped hero as soon as we ran in, and he died before Hero finished. This was with 10 stacks.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-15 at 05:22 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Xami View Post
    So I'm reading about Gara'jal and the "not sending people in with stacks" stuff and came to realize.... we've been doing it wrong all along. We were sending one designated DPS and a healer into the spirit realm, every time.

    However, we didn't have much trouble either. We killed him on the 9th try and beat the enrage by 24s. I (Aff Lock) was the one going into the spirit realm and solo'd (well, duo'd with the healer) all the adds in the spirit realm, every time. Sometimes even without a healer (an accident, but HS + Soul Harvest + Mortal Coil = win). Everyone else just nuked the boss for the entire duration. When I went back to the physical realm I would put up all the dots before re-entering the spirit realm immediately.

    As an Affliction Warlock this is possible because the adds in the spirit realm yield full Sould Shards when killed with Drain Soul. I would basically go in, use all shards on SB:SS, MG then DS one add to get Shards back, dot up adds, rinse and repeat until 30s approaches.

    We used 2 healers, and BL at around 30% when the healing got intense. Our DPS is alright, good for the gear I suppose (most everyone in the 460's, myself at 467). We are a casual raid guild with 3 nights/week 2-3 hours/night.

    Logs: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/b...?s=4721&e=5057
    Note that my DPS (the Warlock) isn't correct, as I spent most of the time in the spirit world.

    Some food for thought, maybe.
    It's certainly possible to send a dot class in over and over again, but that does require a certain degree of RNG and the groups dps to be above par.

    Most people asking for help are progressing on the fight, and judging by their logs are barely meeting the enrage, if at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  20. #140
    The Patient
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    Just as an FYI, what sort of dps/dmg should each dps be pulling going into these fights? Obviously some of the later fights require more, but say for the first three what types of numbers should be they be? How about the healers? Just trying to get an overall idea =)

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