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  1. #1
    Brewmaster Playintrafic's Avatar
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    Lost art of the LOS pull.

    What is the deal with people these days not understanding, or wanting me to do LOS pulls to clear dungeons faster? It used to be required to get a smooth run in some TBC dungeons and heroics, but now people just dont understand what I am doing.

    Can't the dps just stand still and be patient so I can get us through the dungeon faster?

  2. #2
    Bloodsail Admiral Narshe's Avatar
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    DK's have Gorefiends Grasp for a reason mate, use it. Heroics are easy to the point of not needing LOS even if we didn't have GG.

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  3. #3
    Scarab Lord ViridianWRA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Narshe View Post
    DK's have Gorefiends Grasp for a reason mate, use it. Heroics are easy to the point of not needing LOS even if we didn't have GG.
    DKs represent 1/11 player classes, and that's only 1/3 talents.

    LOSing makes many pulls a looooooot easier, and little is more annoying than people who won't let an LOS pull be performed.

  4. #4
    so what if dks have grasp? what have other tanks? as said before in other topic, its much more controled if you do los pull. just take example of bored students in scholo. if you easy pull em outside there is no risk of extra pulls. didnt had once moonkinn or barrage hunter pull whole room and wipe us.

    Its not needed in most cases but brings enorumus ammount of control to the pull. yes everything is very very easy but why wouldnt be even more easeirt. its not like that dps is going to do more dmg then tank anyways

  5. #5
    Mechagnome Taiki420's Avatar
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    The last time I remember actually needing to LOS was that final Lich King 5-man. That being said, if it helps, do it. It only takes a few seconds longer and it's a lot cleaner fo a pull.
    "The Tol'vir people must be really shy considering they don't ever speak to us.." -Zneebor LOL

  6. #6
    Bloodsail Admiral Narshe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hunteromg View Post
    so what if dks have grasp? what have other tanks? as said before in other topic, its much more controled if you do los pull. just take example of bored students in scholo. if you easy pull em outside there is no risk of extra pulls. didnt had once moonkinn or barrage hunter pull whole room and wipe us.

    Its not needed in most cases but brings enorumus ammount of control to the pull. yes everything is very very easy but why wouldnt be even more easeirt. its not like that dps is going to do more dmg then tank anyways
    The OP is a DK, I merely pointed out we have GG, so I'm not sure why the OP would LOS pull to begin with. Even without it I haven't had to LOS pull more than once, and that was in Scholo because someone suggested it. Afterwards I realized it was pointless, not because I'm a DK, but because the damage output of heroic mobs is so laughable that the need to LOS doesn't exist in these dungeons. Healers in 430 gear equipped can heal just fine for any pull that supposedly needs LOS.

    Now if your talking about Challenge Mode LOS pulls then I understand.

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  7. #7
    LOS pulling potentially adds several seconds to a pull. If there is the risk of wiping, it's potentially a huge time-saver. If there is no risk of wiping, it just wasted time.

    This reminds me of the lost art of CC in general - CCing two adds will reduce stress on the healer but will potentially add complexity to the situation of tank and dps. Also the pack will live a tad bit longer.

    It's about the usage of appropriate tools - if your group is struggeling, fine use whatever means nescessary. If your group is steamrolling the dungeon anyway, don't be obsessed with using every tool available, even if it potentially wastes time.

  8. #8
    The real lost art is the hunter feign/split pull from Vanilla, namely in places like the second pull (dual firelords) in MC.

  9. #9
    Brewmaster Playintrafic's Avatar
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    I didnt spec GG, I specced RM. RM is a lot more control than GG when your not a crappy tank.

    Yes GG can be very useful, but 9/10s I use RM. Sometimes in CMs GG is better. Usually no. In heroics I can pull entire damn rooms if people let me LOS pull.

    Considering you can swap out talents to suit the situation now with the books, there is no reason not to have the right talent for the situation.

  10. #10
    Bloodsail Admiral Narshe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    DKs represent 1/11 player classes, and that's only 1/3 talents.

    LOSing makes many pulls a looooooot easier, and little is more annoying than people who won't let an LOS pull be performed.
    Not every class can tank, and the discussion is about tank pulling, which every tank in the game can do without the need for LOS.

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  11. #11
    I don't understand how you think its faster to los pull.. sure its easier.. But seems to me its just much faster to pull 2-3 groups and AoE the crap out of it

  12. #12
    Bloodsail Admiral Narshe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Playintrafic View Post
    I didnt spec GG, I specced RM. RM is a lot more control than GG when your not a crappy tank.

    Yes GG can be very useful, but 9/10s I use RM. Sometimes in CMs GG is better. Usually no. In heroics I can pull entire damn rooms if people let me LOS pull.
    So do I, but you know that the reasons talents can be changed out in between pulls so easily is for situations like these. It takes a few seconds to switch the talent instead of the amount of time to have to LOS 1 or 2 specific trash pulls.

    edit: the point I'm really trying to make is that we as tanks had to LOS pull back in the day because none of us had the abilities to silence range targets, which is really the only reason to even LOS to begin with. Nowadays we have those abilities so why bother doing it just for the sake of doing it?
    Last edited by Narshe; 2012-10-05 at 06:05 AM.

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  13. #13
    I LOS pull the packs in Scarlet Monastery (After the first boss) ... Pretty much every other Dungeon doesn't need LOS pulls, you can use them in Mogu'shan Palace, but it's not really necessary.

    But in reality, that's just me being Old School in my tanking style. All the Heroics are easy enough that you can do them without using any LOS pulls, you can just simply run in and if you agro another mob or pack, just Tank it all, pop a CD and you should have no problems.

    People don't like tanks doing it because they THINK it Wastes Time and because DPS are so gogogogogo these days that they simply don't care. LOS pulls only waste time if you are doing it just to stop a magic attack, if you LOS pull specifically so you can avoid a pack or patrolling mob, then it's saving time.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Playintrafic View Post
    I didnt spec GG, I specced RM. RM is a lot more control than GG when your not a crappy tank.

    Yes GG can be very useful, but 9/10s I use RM. Sometimes in CMs GG is better. Usually no. In heroics I can pull entire damn rooms if people let me LOS pull.

    Considering you can swap out talents to suit the situation now with the books, there is no reason not to have the right talent for the situation.
    Uh oh looks like we got trolled, 4/10. this kid ebayed, RM lmfao...

    Infracted~
    Last edited by Aciaedius; 2012-10-06 at 10:17 AM.

  15. #15
    Thre used to be a time when hunters had that job, an i will add were the ebst for it. is it ede in todays dungeons? not really, though when use properly, not ly did it make things easier, but more managed and faster.

  16. #16
    Brewmaster Playintrafic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magzilla View Post
    Uh oh looks like we got trolled, 4/10. this kid ebayed, RM lmfao...
    Hmm, so 6 seconds of not needing any heals and building bloodshield, then popping a cd, holding 20+ mobs, dealing more damage than the 3 dps together, and still being health cap after the pull is bad? KThnxbai.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Playintrafic View Post
    What is the deal with people these days not understanding, or wanting me to do LOS pulls to clear dungeons faster? It used to be required to get a smooth run in some TBC dungeons and heroics, but now people just dont understand what I am doing.

    Can't the dps just stand still and be patient so I can get us through the dungeon faster?
    Most people unfortunately did't play vanilla or TBC, and WotLK bred the whole just AOE nuke everything, preferably before the tank has aggro mentality. If they'd do that in TBC they'd be dead every pack. Too bad Blizzard made everything stupidly easy; now they will never learn. Instead they just blame the tank, or healer.
    Last edited by Cairhiin; 2012-10-05 at 06:12 AM.

  18. #18
    Brewmaster Playintrafic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lunarath View Post
    I don't understand how you think its faster to los pull.. sure its easier.. But seems to me its just much faster to pull 2-3 groups and AoE the crap out of it
    There is a difference between los pulling one group, and LOSing the entire room.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by lunarath View Post
    I don't understand how you think its faster to los pull.. sure its easier.. But seems to me its just much faster to pull 2-3 groups and AoE the crap out of it
    Because of Casters, and/or MoB's that don't move. LoS pulls are done to ensure an entire pack of MoB's stop, together, in one place, casters and all. Then you can "AoE the Crap" out of them. Initially they need to be centrally located for that to be effective.

    I believe Pack Make-up, and terrain are the keys to using, or not using an LoS pull. Casters packed, or one caster at the start it's cool to pull the melee's to the caster. More than one caster, especially if they are spread out, the LoS pull is faster. An advantageous set of walls, or other obstructions to Spells should certainly be utilized.

    The Op, as far as I could see, wasn't calling for all pulls to be LoS, but in the right situation they can make the run the fastest they can be.

  20. #20
    I remember the 2 hour long Strath runs at 60. Even longer with a bad group >< Was always quite proud of knowing how to pull everything in that instance on my hunter, made runs alot smoother.
    Most CC goes unnoticed these days and gets hit by aoe and picked up by the tank anyway, but i have had a couple monk tanks using good LOS pulls whilst dungeon leveling my own monk. So the art isn't completely lost its sadly just no longer completely necessary.

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