Page 5 of 7 FirstFirst ...
3
4
5
6
7
LastLast
  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Whenever Titans are mentioned it is said they travel, never is their homeworld even mentioned.
    That does not mean they are nomadic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Algalon was a failsafe Program, whose mission it is to purge the impure and to start a cycle anew if necessary, the signal would have meant yeah the world is toast you have to come back and to start from scratch.
    His mission was to alert the Titans if it needed purging, not to purge it himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    That is why I said it depends on their power even a mortal could in theory have a demonical army if he is strong enough to shackle them to his will.
    That is not 'following'. It is not the demon's choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    If Illidan could do it, why should an Old god not be able to do so? The Old Gods would most likely work together initially and go their separate ways after they disposed of Sargeras, the demons which they would have swayed would most likely splinter into camp N'zoth etc.
    Illidan was able to because Sargeras wasn't around. If this is a discussion about Sargeras versus the Old Gods, the Old Gods would have to show themselves a better leader than Sargeras. Considering Illidan proved his worth by defeating the commander of the demons who would later serve them, I don't see how they could sway them from Sargeras.
    Last edited by Lightfist; 2012-10-07 at 10:38 PM.
    By Blood and Honor We Serve!

  2. #82
    Warchief
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic, Euro-Atlantic civilisation
    Posts
    2,050
    I think people are overplaying Azshara, yes she was a powerful mage in her own right, but that was when she was leeching of the Well of eternity.

    More importantly she entered the service of the Old gods and there is nothing to suggest she retains her free will. Deathwing did not a he was a far more powerful being than she was.

    Chances are, she is just another puppet of the Old gods, a powerful one indeed, but still a puppet.

    As to why she did not directly help Deathwing, well perhaps the Old god controlling her did not want the Hour of Twilight to come.
    Quote Originally Posted by belfpala View Post
    This law abiding person doesn't consider taking your guns away to be a punishment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    Done. Now stop talking to me. Let the ban come now.

  3. #83
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Hanseatic City of Lübeck
    Posts
    8,442
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    That does not mean they are nomadic.
    It is heavily implied, while them staying in one place is never mentioned.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    His mission was to alert the Titans if it needed purging, not to purge it himself.
    Yeah I reread Algalon and yeah you are right, but it changes actually nothing the space Nazis would have had to purge the planet themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    That is not 'following'. It is not the demon's choice.

    Illidan was able to because Sargeras wasn't around. If this is a discussion about Sargeras versus the Old Gods, the Old Gods would have to show themselves a better leader than Sargeras. Considering Illidan proved his worth by defeating the commander of the demons who would later serve them, I don't see how they could sway them from Sargeras.
    The old Gods are incredibly powerful, they stood up to many titans and they still have vast armies of their own, many demons could see merit in joining up with them instead of Sargeras.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    It is heavily implied, while them staying in one place is never mentioned.
    I don't see how it is 'heavily implied'. Traveling vast distances doesn't speak much about a civilization when they have interplanetary travel.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Yeah I reread Algalon and yeah you are right, but it changes actually nothing the space Nazis would have had to purge the planet themselves.
    The point is that the Titans were watching over Azeroth, even if it was indirectly through sentient constructs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    The old Gods are incredibly powerful, they stood up to many titans and they still have vast armies of their own, many demons could see merit in joining up with them instead of Sargeras.
    They stood up to the Titans because they had to, and they were defeated utterly and terribly. By comparison, the Titans have been unable to stop Sargeras or the Legion.

    I mean, it's not even like the Legion would be surprised to learn of Azeroth's Old Gods. The two forces have clearly encountered each other on other worlds.
    By Blood and Honor We Serve!

  5. #85
    I don't think Azshara has a strong enough visual design to warrant her own expansion, all of her zones would be naga oriented, and there's only so much of that people can take. And to do a lot of things that seem to have nothing to do with the naga while still tied into her just seems off kilter. I expect it is possible Blizzard could dazzle with such a theme, maybe, but I don't see them ever using her as her own thing. She works best in conjunction with another villain.
    If you like my draw-rings. http://yig.deviantart.com/
    If you can't find them for some reason beyond that page. http://yig.deviantart.com/gallery/
    WOW screenshot and concept art gallery http://smg.photobucket.com/user/evilknick/library/WoW

  6. #86
    Dreadlord Rickmagnus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    The darkest corner with the best view.
    Posts
    992
    For the record, Algalon was suppose to be the person to start the reorigination process on Azeroth. It has been said by blizzard (don't have the referance on me atm sadly) that after he analyzed the Planet for corruption he was to go to the Halls of Origination and activate the reorigination device the Titan's left there. Never any mention to my knowledge of him doing anymore than simply informing the Pantheon that the planet was too far gone as far has their connection to his mission.
    "I don't believe in an afterlife, so I don't have to spend my whole life fearing hell, or fearing heaven even more. For whatever the tortures of hell, I think the boredom of heaven would be even worse."
    “Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'” - Issac Asimov

  7. #87
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Hanseatic City of Lübeck
    Posts
    8,442
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    I don't see how it is 'heavily implied'. Traveling vast distances doesn't speak much about a civilization when they have interplanetary travel.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    The point is that the Titans were watching over Azeroth, even if it was indirectly through sentient constructs.
    You are actually making my point you know, they might watch but they don't seem to leave Titans on their worlds. One of their given names is the travelers that pretty much sounds nomadic to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    They stood up to the Titans because they had to, and they were defeated utterly and terribly. By comparison, the Titans have been unable to stop Sargeras or the Legion.

    I mean, it's not even like the Legion would be surprised to learn of Azeroth's Old Gods. The two forces have clearly encountered each other on other worlds.

    It took quite some time until they were defeated and they are still alive,so are many of their soldiers they infested the Titans greatest creation. So I would say they were hardly ever terribly and utterly defeated.

    They seemed to be blissfully unaware during the WoA since Sargeras himself danced to their tune.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  8. #88
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Twitch & Youtube
    Posts
    18,208
    Quote Originally Posted by Yig View Post
    I don't think Azshara has a strong enough visual design to warrant her own expansion, all of her zones would be naga oriented, and there's only so much of that people can take. And to do a lot of things that seem to have nothing to do with the naga while still tied into her just seems off kilter. I expect it is possible Blizzard could dazzle with such a theme, maybe, but I don't see them ever using her as her own thing. She works best in conjunction with another villain.
    When it comes down to "either we use her as a villain or shut down the game" she will come.
    Unsubscribed as of 03/10/2014.

    If you dislike where WoW is headed in your mind, quit. Really. Sitting around complaining about "promises" that may or may not have been made isn't doing anything to help your cause. It's just making you look more and more like the constantly complaining and perpetually offended.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Yig View Post
    I don't think Azshara has a strong enough visual design to warrant her own expansion, all of her zones would be naga oriented, and there's only so much of that people can take. And to do a lot of things that seem to have nothing to do with the naga while still tied into her just seems off kilter. I expect it is possible Blizzard could dazzle with such a theme, maybe, but I don't see them ever using her as her own thing. She works best in conjunction with another villain.
    TBC had things that didn't have to do with Illidan, as did Wrath with LK. Azshara has more of enough warrant for her own expansion. And so what if all the zones would be naga oriented? MoP's zones are all based on Asia. Blizzard has shown they can create pretty much anything if they set their works on it.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by ThisWillNotStand View Post
    1. It was heavily hinted that she might have been saved by the Old Gods when the Sundering happened.
    2. She was pretty damned close to everything that was happening under the Maelstrom.
    3. Naga live underwater, they shouldn't care less what Deathwing does as cataclysm on the ground.
    4. The first expansion with truly underwater questing, Azshara isn't part of it as an important character?
    5. Seriously?
    1. It's rare that you come across the grand pu-bah of the enemy force. We don't run into Illidan at the intro zone. We didn't fight Garrosh in the Barrens. Simply put, the general isn't really on the front line where we are fighting.
    2. Fast running water isn't something most creatures can inhabit, so while she may have something to do with the Maelstrom, I doubt she was anywhere near it.
    3. the basic idea of tectonic plates and land masses should tell you why your statement is bit inaccurate.
    4. See number 1.
    5. Yeah. Seriously.

    Also, for the DW fight, if you fall in the water, you die, because apparently DW was making it boil, so that might also explain why the naga weren't present.

  11. #91
    It seemed simple to me. Both are servants of N'Zoth. N'zoth seems to be a fair bit more intelligent then Yogg-Saron and C'thun, even while 'asleep' as he is. To put it simply, N'zoth doesn't seem the type to use all of it's forces together. Why have Deathwing, Azshara and whatever other forces he has strike together? Just using Deathwing, he's ripped open Azeroth, disabling many Titan security measures and opened up new ways for Old God forces to be used, in addition to making the Dragon Aspects mortal. One pawn out of the two that we know of, and however many we don't know about, and he did all that. Just imagine what he's having Azshara and the naga do behind the scenes

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    You are actually making my point you know, they might watch but they don't seem to leave Titans on their worlds. One of their given names is the travelers that pretty much sounds nomadic to me.
    Once again, you don't have to be nomadic to travel. It doesn't make sense for such an advanced civilization to not have at least one base of operations. Hell, it could even be a mobile one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    It took quite some time until they were defeated and they are still alive,so are many of their soldiers they infested the Titans greatest creation. So I would say they were hardly ever terribly and utterly defeated.
    It took 'some time'? Relative to what?

    Also, they were cast down in shackles beneath the planet they previously ruled - with only one possible causality ever mentioned on the Titans' side. That sounds like a pretty utter defeat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    They seemed to be blissfully unaware during the WoA since Sargeras himself danced to their tune.
    How did Sargeras 'dance to their tune'? They might have had a plot involving him, but it coincided with his own goals.

    And the Legion might not be aware of the Old Gods of Azeroth, but the forces have obviously met before. Harbinger Skyriss mentions them by name, referring to them as the 'mighty Legion'.
    By Blood and Honor We Serve!

  13. #93
    Legendary! TJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    North Wales
    Posts
    6,192
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    How did Sargeras 'dance to their tune'? They might have had a plot involving him, but it coincided with his own goals.
    Indeed, he didn't. He has never even encountered an Old God as far as I'm aware. On that matter as well just because the Old Gods were confident they could beat Sargeras doesn't mean they could, Audley Harrison claimed he could beat David Haye and well.. you get the point

  14. #94
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Hanseatic City of Lübeck
    Posts
    8,442
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    Once again, you don't have to be nomadic to travel. It doesn't make sense for such an advanced civilization to not have at least one base of operations. Hell, it could even be a mobile one.
    That is nomadic you know.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    It took 'some time'? Relative to what?

    Also, they were cast down in shackles beneath the planet they previously ruled - with only one possible causality ever mentioned on the Titans' side. That sounds like a pretty utter defeat.
    Same goes for the Old Gods only one of them was ever actually killed, not to mention the Titans outnumbered the Old gods and no that is far from a pretty utter defeat, if their armies had been utterly destroyed and they themselves would have been killed by the Titans they would have been utterly defeated, but they weren't they are still around regaining their strength.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lightfist View Post
    How did Sargeras 'dance to their tune'? They might have had a plot involving him, but it coincided with his own goals.

    And the Legion might not be aware of the Old Gods of Azeroth, but the forces have obviously met before. Harbinger Skyriss mentions them by name, referring to them as the 'mighty Legion'.
    They were indirectly responsible, that the legion learned of the Dragon Soul, so that they would use it to bring Sargeras into the world, in the process freeing them all at once, so yes they used them as tools.

    Harbringer Skyriss also mentions the Old Gods are more powerful than the legion so what is your point?

    Quote Originally Posted by TJ View Post
    Indeed, he didn't. He has never even encountered an Old God as far as I'm aware. On that matter as well just because the Old Gods were confident they could beat Sargeras doesn't mean they could, Audley Harrison claimed he could beat David Haye and well.. you get the point
    The point being the old Gods battled the Titans before and many had been necessary to seal them, so given their experience their claim is not a foolish one.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  15. #95
    Legendary! TJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    North Wales
    Posts
    6,192
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    The point being the old Gods battled the Titans before and many had been necessary to seal them, so given their experience their claim is not a foolish one.
    The Old Gods also had near infinite minions so it wasn't like they were unaided, not to mention as I said before the Titans didn't lose anyone apart from a presumed lesser titan and even chained them which again is harder than just killing them which they could've done with ease. I'm betting they thought they were going to beat the Titans in the first war also, which was far from the case.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    That is nomadic you know.
    Nomads do not have a permanent home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Same goes for the Old Gods only one of them was ever actually killed, not to mention the Titans outnumbered the Old gods and no that is far from a pretty utter defeat, if their armies had been utterly destroyed and they themselves would have been killed by the Titans they would have been utterly defeated, but they weren't they are still around regaining their strength.
    Only one of them was killed because the Titans wanted to take them prisoners. Only one Titan was possibly killed because the Old Gods were unable to kill them.

    We don't know the exact forces on either side. The Old Gods also had their faceless armies and their elemental forces, and the Titans could have had constructs (though, as far as I know, these weren't mentioned). You can't say they were outnumbered.

    Also, I consider having all of your forces imprisoned a pretty utter defeat.


    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    They were indirectly responsible, that the legion learned of the Dragon Soul, so that they would use it to bring Sargeras into the world, in the process freeing them all at once, so yes they used them as tools.
    Again, you can't say they 'used them' if it coincided with his own plans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Harbringer Skyriss also mentions the Old Gods are more powerful than the legion so what is your point?
    My point is that they knew of each other. Again, which side thinks which could win is irrelevant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    The point being the old Gods battled the Titans before and many had been necessary to seal them, so given their experience their claim is not a foolish one.
    Once again, I must point out that we do not know how many Titans were involved, nor do we know how difficult the war was.

    Honestly, arguing they were hard to defeat is sort of silly considering the Titans could have just destroyed the planet.
    By Blood and Honor We Serve!

  17. #97
    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."
    —Herald Volazj
    Y'Shaarj was confirmed to be "extremely dead".
    Any relation? Does "dead" to an old God mean something other than what we know as dead? Was whoever said that quote specifically using the word dead to hint at some other meaning? Speculaaaationsss...

  18. #98
    Bloodsail Admiral Vayshan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Netherlands - Draenor (EU)
    Posts
    1,191
    Quote Originally Posted by ThisWillNotStand View Post
    1. It was heavily hinted that she might have been saved by the Old Gods when the Sundering happened.

    2. She was pretty damned close to everything that was happening under the Maelstrom.

    3. Naga live underwater, they shouldn't care less what Deathwing does as cataclysm on the ground.

    4. The first expansion with truly underwater questing, Azshara isn't part of it as an important character?

    5. Seriously?
    1. Not hinted, she WAS saved. At the beginning of the Sundering she heard the whispers of the Old Gods, offering to save her and her people if she pledged loyalty to them.
    2. Minding her own business or breeding plans that are not yet rdy to be implemented. She abducted Neptulon, possibly to siphon his power.
    3. They both have the same boss; N'zoth. She doesn't care about what DW does since he's her ally. He burns the world down, she then floods it.
    4. The chapter on Azshara is far from over or closed.
    5. Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Ragewing View Post
    Any relation? Does "dead" to an old God mean something other than what we know as dead? Was whoever said that quote specifically using the word dead to hint at some other meaning? Speculaaaationsss...
    There was a blue post saying he was "quite dead". The Sha are his remains since the Titans basicly 'dismembered' that Old God.
    Last edited by Vayshan; 2012-10-08 at 01:06 AM.

  19. #99
    Isn't it pretty obvious that the entire underwater zone in Cata was scrapped for good after the launch? I meant.. no raid.. the story ended with lots of loose ends..

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Vayshan View Post
    There was a blue post saying he was "quite dead". The Sha are his remains since the Titans basicly 'dismembered' that Old God.
    But how do you kill something that can't die? Seems odd to me.. face value dead doesn't seem quite right imo.

    Dead means.. PHYSICAL body is dead? Soul is dead (do they have souls? Is the planet it's soul)? What does "killing" an old god mean exactly? so many questions
    Last edited by King Ragewing; 2012-10-08 at 01:11 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •