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  1. #281
    The Patient Keyur's Avatar
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    looks like this thread turned out into 10 vs 25 and For the Paragon

    Lets get some real, If Paragon will get world first...

    Does it count as world 1st 25? - NO
    Does it count as world 1st 10? - Ofcourse
    Does it count as world 1st? - Absolutely Yes

  2. #282
    Immortal Ryme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archidamos View Post
    Lol, they just had the team ready for 25s...
    Regardless, they lost, no one remembers who came 2nd onwards.

    Quote Originally Posted by Archidamos View Post
    And think better before you talk.
    The irony.

    Quote Originally Posted by Archidamos View Post
    Cause the first heroic boss in Cataclysm expansion to be defeated, was Halfus Wyrmbraker, a boss that was the flagship of the arguments of 10 man lovers, regarding how ovetuned 10 mans were compared to 25s in tier 11!
    The irony eh?
    Ensidia roflstomped halfus in 10 heroic, and all 10 man guilds were complaining about how ovetuned he was :P
    I'm not sure how this is relevant to anything and I'm not even certain it's true, Maloriak was the only fight people complained was overtuned in my memory, but please, continue and explain for me.
    I am the lucid dream
    Uulwi ifis halahs gag erh'ongg w'ssh


  3. #283
    Thank god I put 15 hours into raiding last night so I can be better than all those scrubs who only raid 4 hours a night due to jobs. Like really guys you need to step up and get a sugar momma or daddy. Or hell use your own parents!

    And think about it I beat all of you twice. I beat you before the game came out when I was doing the beta bosses all the time.

  4. #284
    Quote Originally Posted by xlightning View Post
    10 do count, If a 10 man guild gets the world first they will have 1# in all sites and progress acknowledge by everyone or not it will be a fact. And no, i am not a Paragon fanboy. I never liked theme.
    They'll have the WF 10 man. Just like the 1st 25 man will have WF 25 man.

    I've cleared MV normal on 2 chars, one 10 one 25 and they're nowhere near the same difficulty on normals, they're just different. I expect the same on HCs. 25 man requires some more planning, 10 man requires good rosters. So far 10 was simpler but easier to wipe to. 25 just had some extra logistics issues to get over the required DPS (how to split your dps properly)

  5. #285
    Quote Originally Posted by stomination View Post
    Thank god I put 15 hours into raiding last night so I can be better than all those scrubs who only raid 4 hours a night due to jobs. Like really guys you need to step up and get a sugar momma or daddy. Or hell use your own parents!

    And think about it I beat all of you twice. I beat you before the game came out when I was doing the beta bosses all the time.

    u know that some ppl spend theire vacation to raid the first week? Some of them can be theire own boss? A your rly that jealous?

  6. #286
    Quote Originally Posted by stomination View Post
    Thank god I put 15 hours into raiding last night so I can be better than all those scrubs who only raid 4 hours a night due to jobs. Like really guys you need to step up and get a sugar momma or daddy. Or hell use your own parents!

    And think about it I beat all of you twice. I beat you before the game came out when I was doing the beta bosses all the time.
    Whats your point to troll with that shit in world first thread? Most people in hc guilds do have jobs or study anyways.
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRet

    "This server shutdown was so epic not even Illidan was prepared for it"

  7. #287
    I think it's about time you people started applying some logical thinking and stopped arguing about what counts and what doesn't. 10-man and 25-man are, among other things, very different, and you should just consider them to be two separate leagues, divisions or whatever term suits best.



    Manni | paragon.fi | Dota 2 forum | The golden rule: Listen to Lysah.

  8. #288
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryme View Post
    Regardless, they lost, no one remembers who came 2nd onwards.



    The irony.



    I'm not sure how this is relevant to anything and I'm not even certain it's true, Maloriak was the only fight people complained was overtuned in my memory, but please, continue and explain for me.
    Lol so there were no complains about halfus eh?
    And Maloriak was the only boss that 10 mans complained as being overtuned eh?
    Then what was all that fuss about most fights being harder in 10 in tier 11?
    Shouldnt it be "Maloriak was harder in 10 plz fix"?
    Twisting the truth to dodge the obvious!

    Ensidia, a guild that lost the race and because of that according to your logic nobody cares...
    A 25 that was not even the best 25 for that tier...
    Scored the first heroic kill in the world and in 10 man mode, on a boss that most of the 10 man supporters, were complaining for being overtuned!

    Now paragon will once more, after halfus incident, and Ragnaros heroic incident prove the obvious to the 10 man supporters.
    10 man could never win a race, cause 25 had the better teams, although the content was easier for them

  9. #289
    Quote Originally Posted by Archidamos View Post
    By the end of this tier the ratio of 10 to 25 will be much higher than 10:1. That means nothing, cause not all of those guilds are competitive guilds.

    As another poster said “10 man raiding guilds are struggling to even down the first boss on heroic” eh?
    Look at Paragon now :P

    You people are experts.
    The fact that Paragon steamrolled the first 3 heroics 16 hours after the race started for so many other 10 man teams proves the obvious.
    That 10 man content is not tougher. Quite the opposite!

    On one side I am sad that Paragon will get this world first 10/25 (there is no such race, but since blizzard is encouraging this false impression...), as a 10 man.
    It will mean that 25s will keep falling apart, only at an even faster pace.

    On the other side it will prove that during the past, 10 mans although severely outnumbering 25 mans, were losing the races not because their content was harder, but because 25s were the better teams.

    The margin at which Paragon will clear the content from the second fastest guild (obviously a 25), will define how much easier 10 man content actually is.
    Paragon will get blocked at Elegon where 25 man raiding guilds will have the advantage to play around with setups.

  10. #290
    Immortal Ryme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archidamos View Post
    Lol so there were no cmplains about halfus eh?
    And Maloriak was the only boss that 10 mans complained as being overtuned eh?
    Then what was all that fuss about most fights being harder in 10 in tier 11?
    Shouldnt it be "Maloriak was harder in 10 plz fix"?
    Twisting the truth to dodge the obvious!

    Ensidia, a guild that lost the race and because of that according to your logic nobody cares...
    A 25 that was not even the best 25 for that tier...
    Scored the first heroic kill in the world and in 10 man mode, on a boss that most of the 10 man supporters, were complaining for being overtuned!

    Now paragon will once more, after halfus incident, and Ragnaros heroic incident prove the obvious to the 10 man supporters.
    10 man could never win a race, cause 25 had the better teams, although the content was easier for them
    This will be my last response to you on this matter, you cannot form coherent sentences, and use phrase like "by your logic", incorrectly too, so I will say my peace here.

    You still have yet to come forth with what that even pertained to, you just spouted something out with no evidence and I called you up on what it was relevant to and if it was true. You've yet to answer either.

    Ensidia lost the race, yes. My point was nobody seems to care about who loses, just who wins. Can you honestly tell me who came 3rd during the Ulduar? Even if you can, I doubt many others could without looking up. People only care about the latest kill, once guilds moved past Ensidias world first boss kill, people stopped giving it much attention.

    Your last statement is utter conjecture, I think you need to rephrase or rethink it.
    I am the lucid dream
    Uulwi ifis halahs gag erh'ongg w'ssh


  11. #291
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryme View Post
    I'm not sure how this is relevant to anything and I'm not even certain it's true, Maloriak was the only fight people complained was overtuned in my memory, but please, continue and explain for me.
    Halfus was the easiest heroic on both 10 and 25 but some of the others were overtuned. I don't think a single 10man guild killed Magmaw until he got that big nerf which removed the add kiting (maybe a korean guild did with "clever use of game mechanics"). V+T was practically unkillable until they nerfed it by 20M hp or something too. The others were about the same. Al'Akir was a lot easier on 10 than 25 because of phase 1 damage being ridiculous in 25.

  12. #292

  13. #293
    Quote Originally Posted by Hermanni View Post
    I think it's about time you people started applying some logical thinking and stopped arguing about what counts and what doesn't. 10-man and 25-man are, among other things, very different, and you should just consider them to be two separate leagues, divisions or whatever term suits best.
    This I can agree with. Ive done both enough to know that they are very very different.

  14. #294
    Quote Originally Posted by Hermanni View Post
    I think it's about time you people started applying some logical thinking and stopped arguing about what counts and what doesn't. 10-man and 25-man are, among other things, very different, and you should just consider them to be two separate leagues, divisions or whatever term suits best.
    Any your opinion matters why?

    Only a Paragon member can come out and say that for it to be taken seriously. Otherwise go away please.

  15. #295
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthThrall View Post
    Paragon do count, it is as simple as that.

    Those who say otherwise are just wrong. If Paragon get world first they will be #1 in the rankings and there is nothing anyone can do about that.

    So stop trying to say Paragon don't count because they do. This is not an opinion, it's a fact. You are starting to sound like butthurt fanboys.
    You are the one that sound like a butthurt, 10 mans NEVER mattered in the past, and just as Ensidia was taken off the race once they went 10 man, Paragon will too.

    World first race is 25 man world first race, it has always been like that and it would be unfair to change it for Paragon when it wasnt changed for world first guilds that went 10 man in the past.

  16. #296
    Darththrall continues his vicious trolling cycle.
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRet

    "This server shutdown was so epic not even Illidan was prepared for it"

  17. #297
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Lol wut? That makes absolutely no sense. And in the context of your argument, they are the same thing. Please give me a situation where releasing content faster is not more frequent or v/v.

    I will follow that up by saying there is never a situation where 1 is 1.5. Your logic is invalid.
    Faster releases imply you will be able to make content for releases faster. More frequent releases do not imply you will be able to make content faster, only that you will be releasing what you make more often. For example faster release = I will release 10 boss raid in 5 months instead of 10 months. It will be faster release. More frequent release = I will release 5 bosses in 5 months and other 5 bosses 5 months later. I won't work any faster than before, but I will make releases more frequently.

    My part in this story has been decided. And I will play it well.

  18. #298
    Nihilium is a guild that just finished it's first raid week ever.

  19. #299
    Quote Originally Posted by Keyur View Post
    Which end game boss in cata? or it wasnt end game boss?
    It wasnt an end boss of course, it was one of the bosses in Tier 11, i dont remember which. Tier 11 race was not all about only the end boss, several bosses were hard, like Ala'kir for example.

  20. #300
    Quote Originally Posted by Duridi View Post
    It's okay, I misread it as your opinion at first anyways, so I were no better.

    As for seperate races... I think a large majority of the raiding community do not see any of the sizes superior to the other, which means a very tiny, but vocal majority make this out to be a huge problem. People say about 90% of the current raidingguilds are 10 man, which suggest close to 90% of those players do not see 25 man as the superior choice. Meaning they either prefer 10 man, or they do not care if it's 25 or 10 man. Notice I said "close to 90% of those players"(close to 90% of those 90% in other words). There is obviously a few people raiding 10 man that would much rather do 25, but if we were talking about a large % of them, we wouldn't be having this many 10 mans around.

    In general, people do not like being looked down on. In this case meaning they would pick the format that would benefit them but not belittle them. Being confident in their own choice, which for a large majority is 10 man, they consider themselves equal to those who have picked 25 and is obviously confident enough in this belief/themselves that they continue running the format no matter how much some 25 man raiders try to belittle them.
    That doesn't make sense at all. If I raid 10 man that doesn't mean I consider 25 man equal in the world first race.

    If a large majority (90%) thought they were equal then we wouldn't be here discussing it. It's about time these two got seperated because everyone knew from the start they were never going to be equal and we have been endlessly discussing 10 vs 25 man and it leads nowhere. If you think they are equal you are just ignoring the facts. It is impossible for them to be equal, impossible.

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