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  1. #1

    Guardian stat Prioirty Please help

    Hello, I have seen this question asked and so far I have found nothing consistent. I am trying to find out what is the best stat priority for a guardian druid in MoP. I always like to look at what the best guildes are doing and what their guardian tanks are gemed / reforged just for comparison sake.

    I have read guides at Icy Viens and the Inconspicuious bear and many other sites and they all seem to be similar:

    1.Stamina
    2.Agility;
    3.Dodge Rating = Mastery Rating;
    4.Critical Strike Rating;
    5.Hit Rating and Expertise Rating;
    6.Haste Rating.


    The problem is if you look at wow progress and look at the top 20 guildes very few of the Guardian druids in these guildes are reforged / gemed the same.. I see alot of people going all dodge, or Mastery, or pure crit and hit / exp caped it is all over the damn place.

    If there is truely a better way to gem and reforge what is it? I get it, every boss might be a little differnt and if thats the case so be it, I can switch my gems and reforing on a boss by boss basis.

    Any advice? Thanks.

    Currently I am reforged / gemed pure crit and I am Hit / exp capped. I am trying to maximize my rage generation so I can constantly use FR and SD when needed. For the first two bosses in vaults I was very mastery heavy.
    Last edited by Griz66; 2012-10-09 at 06:27 PM.

  2. #2
    This is what i notices Sejta was doing and i tried it out. You definitely want to go the Crit route if Rage Generation is your goal. (with hit/exp caps)

  3. #3
    Personally, I would put agility over stamina at this point. But then I'm disinclined to do the match to back up my preference. However health pools seem to be fine without seeking out stamina and more agility means more dodge and more rage.
    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.

    -Kujako-

  4. #4
    Thats exactly why I went the crit route Moveth because I have always tried to follow what Sejta does on some level and I noticed he has been going Crit , Hit / Exp all of MoP so far.

  5. #5
    Well I definitely found that i had an assload more rage through fights last night compared to the start of the week. With crit gems, I was able to hit something like 40% crit with buffs.

  6. #6
    Hello !
    I am a Guardian myself, you can armory me, Azgarde on Bloodhoof server.

    I chose to go all out mitigation for a couple reasons. First, if you go all-out stam, you're gonna be nothing less than a big sponge. In fact, healers are going to spend alot of mana just to top you off. Going avoidance can save healers mana (as well as going mastery).

    Agility is a good boost in terms of Dodge, and gives you AP and Crit. You shouldn't need to be exp/hit and crit capped in order to generate enough rage to use SD or FR. You have enough cooldowns to help you boost that.

    In the end, i'd have a talk with your healers and ask them if they think you're taking a lot of damage. If that's the case, then I'd go all-out avoidance/mitigation.

  7. #7
    With crit stacking, you can keep the theoretical 66.6% uptime on your Savage Defense, which to me, makes crit the best stat. Without going pure crit, I was only able to keep, maybe, a 40% uptime at best.

  8. #8
    Yea Moveth I like that idea which is why I am trying out the crit heavy build now. Only time will tell this week how it goes in normal 10 man.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-09 at 11:45 AM ----------

    Thanks for the reply Azgarde, the first two bossess I tried going more avoidance heavy but because of all the unavoiadable damage I opted to go a route that would hopefully give me more rage so I could constantly use FR when needed. I was using SD for the first two bossess but again the majority of the damage is Magic / bleeds which are unavoidable with dodge / armor which is why I opted for using FR as much as I could.

  9. #9
    Field Marshal Neji's Avatar
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    Like others above have mentioned it really depends on what you want to accomplish. If constant rage generation is what you're after then I'd go hit/exp/crit as my reforges of choice. For gems I try to stick with stamina, stamina/dodge or stamina/agility depending on what I have access to at any given moment.
    --
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    “All the world will be your enemy, Prince of a Thousand enemies. And when they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you; digger, listener, runner, Prince with the swift warning. Be cunning, and full of tricks, and your people will never be destroyed.”

  10. #10
    Lots of misinformation in this thread.
    Agi is no longer an attractive stat due to AP(the main gain from it) no longer increasing our survivability in any way.
    Dodge is good but the problem with it is that an equivalent amount of any other rating besides haste would result in higher returns whether it be healing or mitigation(Mast=more armor, crit/exp/hit= more rage) and it's inefficient to reforge to it.
    On stamina, it changes based on the fight, if you have the money you'd change your gems every fight to optimize it but since this is not practical for a large majority it is best to gem for Crit, Expertise or Mastery because overall the majority of the fights do not have a large amount of unavoidable damage.
    Fights with normal tank damage have a balance of crit/mast pulling ahead.
    For example, Stone Guards is a fight where stamina is very good due to the majority of tank damage being unavoidable(the bleed) and dodge/mastery is worth very little due to the Guards only meleeing for about 20k when the bleed ticks for 50k each second.
    The only other situation with stamina is optimal is when you are doing content undergeared and assuming you all are doing the content in gear that normals are intended for(463 ilevel) stamina is inferior.
    If you're one of the top guilds doing heroics the 2nd week than it is very likely that stamina is the optimal way since heroics are tuned around a raid of full normal-geared raiders or close to it.
    For once, the way Setja gears is actually relevant to what normal raiders should do.(Got really tired of people using him as justification to stack stam in Cata)
    Finh <Vodka>
    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological
    if only WoW had come out when I was a teenager. Back then online gaming consisted of text-based MUDs....I could type "kill orc" faster than any of my competition, brosephs, and played a mean giantman cleric.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerzek View Post
    Agi is no longer an attractive stat due to AP(the main gain from it) no longer increasing our survivability in any way.
    Dodge and crit are, and as far as I know have always been, the main point in agility.
    Last edited by Kujako; 2012-10-09 at 07:24 PM.
    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.

    -Kujako-

  12. #12
    just interested, what kind of stats are people seeing in their raid buffed environment? After discussions with my healers, I'm currently prioritising stam and mastery for 1st 2 bosses of vaults (we lacked dps this week so couldn't proceed beyond this).

    Raid buffed my stats are around:
    5% hit
    7.5% exp
    13.8% dodge
    about 580k hp
    around 87k armour (iirc)

    I have the on-use mastery/stam trinket from trash drop from vaults (lucky me), and the heroic moshugan palace trinket with stam/dodge.

    I'm thinking of dropping some stamina enchants and gems to get hit capped, and possible boosting crit for rage regen, but I worry that then I will become too squishy as I will lose a very large chunk of hp.

    also does anyone have any ideas what our stat priority should be for heroic vaults / terrace? I would like to spend my VP and gear appropriately for those rather than current content (if that makes sense)

  13. #13
    I'm not close to being raid ready, but self buffed I'm at the following.
    3.73% hit
    5.45% haste
    2.81% expertise
    15.28% dodge
    80k armor (63.42%)
    418k health

    thinking of dropping flower picking now that its not needed for alchemy (tillers farm provides all) to get another stat boosting trade skill.
    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.

    -Kujako-

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Kujako View Post
    Dodge and crit are, and as far as I know have always been, the main point in agility.
    Dodge and crit were nice, agi stacking in Cata was all about AP since our sheilds scaled with AP.

    Is anyone using unglyphed FR? I glyphed it right away and never looked back, but I have been thinking the self heal might be good to have. No matter how much I think though, I feel like 1 heal is not going to make up for what a 40% bonus will make to my incoming heals. NS+HT works as a heal, though it isn't the strongest.

    I was talking about this in guild yesterday and my GM said everything he read said Dodge>Mast>Crit>hit/exp>haste. I said rage is much more usefull, but he wasn't buying it since he found 3 sources on the internet to say that. Seems to me that unless the fight is super melee heavy, having FR up as much as possible is a win since the point of mitigation is to take low enough damage the healers can keep up, and boosting them 40% is better than taking a little less damage, provided you use it smart. This would be a more versitle way to gear as well, since if your goal is to keep FR up as much as possible, you can keep SD up for the max time. You then still have FR to help with big spikes, as well as our other cooldowns. Gearing just dodge/mast/agi is going to make you awesome at tanking something with physical, avoidable damage, but not spell damage. The only issue is if rage is so hard to come by that gearing for it doesn't provide enough of a return, but this thread seems to indicate it does.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by ajanu View Post
    Dodge and crit were nice, agi stacking in Cata was all about AP since our sheilds scaled with AP.
    (shrug) was never a focus for me, attack power just came with gear and vengeance.
    Is anyone using unglyphed FR? I glyphed it right away and never looked back, but I have been thinking the self heal might be good to have. No matter how much I think though, I feel like 1 heal is not going to make up for what a 40% bonus will make to my incoming heals. NS+HT works as a heal, though it isn't the strongest.
    I am unglyphed. Look at it this way, stock Frenzied Regeneration is the Savage Defense for non-physical attacks. You cant dodge a spell, but you can click to heal away the damage it deals.

    I was talking about this in guild yesterday and my GM said everything he read said Dodge>Mast>Crit>hit/exp>haste.
    That does seem to be the consensus by people willing to do the math (not me). Which I can understand as you want to reach a given amount or rage per second and our dodge is fairly weak at its base.
    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.

    -Kujako-

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Kujako View Post
    I am unglyphed. Look at it this way, stock Frenzied Regeneration is the Savage Defense for non-physical attacks. You cant dodge a spell, but you can click to heal away the damage it deals.
    What are you healing for right now when you hit it at 60 rage?

  17. #17
    Field Marshal Neji's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajanu View Post
    Dodge and crit were nice, agi stacking in Cata was all about AP since our sheilds scaled with AP.

    Is anyone using unglyphed FR? I glyphed it right away and never looked back, but I have been thinking the self heal might be good to have. No matter how much I think though, I feel like 1 heal is not going to make up for what a 40% bonus will make to my incoming heals. NS+HT works as a heal, though it isn't the strongest.
    Frenzied Regen was the highest healing I had incoming on Elegon. I wouldn't glyph it personally. Here's a log to show the healing I had done for myself with FR. 3.3 million healing in total. http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/0...?s=5178&e=5727 Click on "Healing by Spell" and scroll down to "Healing Taken."

    Average heal per cast of FR was 184k. That's nothing to scoff at.

    Quote Originally Posted by ajanu View Post
    I was talking about this in guild yesterday and my GM said everything he read said Dodge>Mast>Crit>hit/exp>haste. I said rage is much more usefull, but he wasn't buying it since he found 3 sources on the internet to say that. Seems to me that unless the fight is super melee heavy, having FR up as much as possible is a win since the point of mitigation is to take low enough damage the healers can keep up, and boosting them 40% is better than taking a little less damage, provided you use it smart. This would be a more versitle way to gear as well, since if your goal is to keep FR up as much as possible, you can keep SD up for the max time. You then still have FR to help with big spikes, as well as our other cooldowns. Gearing just dodge/mast/agi is going to make you awesome at tanking something with physical, avoidable damage, but not spell damage. The only issue is if rage is so hard to come by that gearing for it doesn't provide enough of a return, but this thread seems to indicate it does.
    You need the rage. Trust me. I'd question his sources saying that hit/exp are rated so low.
    --
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Nejji/advanced
    “All the world will be your enemy, Prince of a Thousand enemies. And when they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you; digger, listener, runner, Prince with the swift warning. Be cunning, and full of tricks, and your people will never be destroyed.”

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by ajanu View Post
    What are you healing for right now when you hit it at 60 rage?
    ~38k on a non-crit. But I often use it with less then 60 rage as well. In fact, just pounding on the key spending rage as quick as you get it isn't the worst thing you can do.
    Last edited by Kujako; 2012-10-09 at 09:18 PM.
    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.

    -Kujako-

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Kujako View Post
    ~38k on a non-crit. But I often use it with less then 60 rage as well. In fact, just pounding on the key spending rage as quick as you get it isn't the worst thing you can do.
    Context is required here. Do not forget that FR scales with Vengence. This means FR will heal for more the harder you are being hit. Questing FR isn't going to heal much. Being rocked for 50% of your life in 1 hit like what heroic raid bosses will do will make FR hit much harder.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinderhoof View Post
    Context is required here. Do not forget that FR scales with Vengence. This means FR will heal for more the harder you are being hit. Questing FR isn't going to heal much. Being rocked for 50% of your life in 1 hit like what heroic raid bosses will do will make FR hit much harder.
    True enough, the 38k is sitting in town.
    It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.

    -Kujako-

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