1. #1

    2x slow 1h's or 1x slow 1x fast?

    Hey guys, just got myself the 476 LFR dagger. I'm playing combat ATM so I've been wondering if 2x Gao's Keg Tapper or 1x Gao's Keg Tapper and 1x Dagger of the Seven Stars is best. Alternatively is Assassination better for singletarget? I would be able to craft one of the Klaxxi daggers for myself if so. Thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    From the front page of this forum, for your first question. I really do think we need to sticky an answer to this. Any of those linked threads (or the thread I quoted myself from) will contain the answer.

    As for what's ahead, it's really more fight dependent and how well you mold your spec to the encounter. Other than that, you should talk about what it is you're trying to DPS to pick a spec for... in the broadest sense, combat was simming behind assassination and subtlety, and with a better dagger, you're almost certainly better off in a non-combat spec (with the exception of TSG, because 100% cleave uptime is... silly).

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Mugajak View Post
    From the front page of this forum, for your first question. I really do think we need to sticky an answer to this. Any of those linked threads (or the thread I quoted myself from) will contain the answer.

    As for what's ahead, it's really more fight dependent and how well you mold your spec to the encounter. Other than that, you should talk about what it is you're trying to DPS to pick a spec for... in the broadest sense, combat was simming behind assassination and subtlety, and with a better dagger, you're almost certainly better off in a non-combat spec (with the exception of TSG, because 100% cleave uptime is... silly).
    Thanks man, and yeah I'm rolling combat for Stone Guards no matter what. Going to start on heroic progression today so I really can't be lacking behind.

  4. #4
    Mechagnome BigpapaBeef's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gooby View Post
    Thanks man, and yeah I'm rolling combat for Stone Guards no matter what. Going to start on heroic progression today so I really can't be lacking behind.
    starting heroic progression and still unsure what weapons to use??? are we talking heroic 5 mans?

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by bitterbrew View Post
    starting heroic progression and still unsure what weapons to use??? are we talking heroic 5 mans?
    Take a guess. Quite confusing since I hear a lot of mixed feelings about it and it's not exactly easy to test it myself since It would require a quite large sample size.

  6. #6
    The Patient Matutin's Avatar
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    Gooby plz.
    My Rogue

    Veni, vidi, vici.

    I like MoP now c:

  7. #7
    This thread is a giant trick question because the real issue isn't the weapon speeds but whether a higher ilvl offsets them. Pretty sure the entire tier worth of item levels on the dagger make it a good bit better oh.

    And like Muga said, assassination is already ahead single target, so epic mh blue oh assassination vs blue mh epic oh combat should be a pretty obvious choice.

  8. #8
    Going assassination for sure on singletarget fights, managed to get a heroic dagger from Stone Guard.

  9. #9
    you get heroic loot and ask these kind of questions? :/ please, was answered multiple times in other threads.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluegirl91 View Post
    you get heroic loot and ask these kind of questions? :/ please, was answered multiple times in other threads.
    What, I'm not allowed to get heroic loot because everything changes and there isn't much info about what's the best? All the threads linked above says 2x slow weps but it doesn't say which ilvl they have. I asked about this because i have the LFR dagger not 2x identical slow weapons.

  11. #11
    Going combat/sublety - sub dps sacels way more wih gear and when you get your hands on enough epics, it's single target dps will trump over assassination.

    Anyway, for combat you go for the highest dps weapn in offhand, no matter the speed. If you have equivalent weapons, a slow offhand is only a fraction of dps better.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Going combat/sublety - sub dps sacels way more wih gear and when you get your hands on enough epics, it's single target dps will trump over assassination.

    Anyway, for combat you go for the highest dps weapn in offhand, no matter the speed. If you have equivalent weapons, a slow offhand is only a fraction of dps better.
    I see, thanks. Going Assassination for single target fights since I have Heroic and LFR dagger opposed to 463 mace and Heroic dagger.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Going combat/sublety - sub dps sacels way more wih gear and when you get your hands on enough epics, it's single target dps will trump over assassination.

    Anyway, for combat you go for the highest dps weapn in offhand, no matter the speed. If you have equivalent weapons, a slow offhand is only a fraction of dps better.
    Same.

    I am going for a slow off hand for Combat on Stone Guard Heroic. Killing Spree got me killed twice last night when Cobalt Mines spawned underneath me whilst in the middle of Killing Spree. I am basically not going to use it except during Cobalt Petrification and would advise that everyone else exercises caution. I therefore think a dagger is better overall.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Going combat/sublety - sub dps sacels way more wih gear and when you get your hands on enough epics, it's single target dps will trump over assassination.
    What makes you so sure of that? I mean the sims showed assassination scaling the best with gear going from t14n to t14h gear. Sub was still simming ahead but assassination gained the most dps from the gear upgrades. Granted I'd say from the rather large dps gap right now that the sims weren't all that accurate for sub.

  15. #15
    Latest simcraft http://simulationcraft.org/505/Raid_T14H.html

    Tbh, i was expecting this kind of results. Cobat being behind in single target is compensated by the incredible strenght of BF, so when there's a cleave, its dps will be much much higher.

    Assassination has always the same problem - poisons don't scale so well as does the ability damage while gear (especially weapons) becomes better. It's a great spec for starters, but the usual behaviour is that weapon-related specs (combat and Sub) scale way better than Assa on the long run.

    I'm not saying anyway that Assassination is useless, its aoe is still king and the difference in dps with sub it's only minor.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Going combat/sublety - sub dps sacels way more wih gear and when you get your hands on enough epics, it's single target dps will trump over assassination.

    Anyway, for combat you go for the highest dps weapn in offhand, no matter the speed. If you have equivalent weapons, a slow offhand is only a fraction of dps better.
    Coldkil, sorry if this is a dumb question, but can you please explain the reasoning for highest dps weapon on the off-hand, i think im missing something...

  17. #17
    I was talking about OH only. MH is always the hardest-hitting slow weapon you can put your hands on. As for OH, if you have access to both a dagger and a slow weapon, go for the one that has the most dps. If they have the same dps, a slow one is only a little ahead of a dagger.

  18. #18
    Yes, but coldkill, did you see the normal mode list?
    http://www.simulationcraft.org/505/Raid_T14N.html

    Its showing assassination 10% behind sub. Considering that assassination is (on WoL) 5-10% ahead of sub, I find it hard to believe that getting the other half of your normal mode epics closes that 15-20% gap.

    Sub also only gained ~28k to assassination's ~33k going from normal to heroic (assassination is higher on percent gain as well). I'd say thats showing assassination scaling better in the sims.

    There are clearly problems with those sims. Assassination shouldn't pass combat until some point between full normal and full heroic gear, but it is clearly ahead at entry level blues.

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