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  1. #21
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    I have several comments:

    First off, I don't see any use of your level 30 healing talents - at all. For Stone Guard, I highly recommend Chi Wave. Use it on the tanks and keep it on cooldown. It does a lot of healing, and due to its smart nature, the overheal is very low. It's a great throughput spell.

    Second, give jabweaving a try. Keep your Blackout buff at x2 and stay in auto attack range. If you can manage it, keep your Tiger Strike stack at x3 as well. This coupled with a well placed statue is a lot of free healing that specifically addresses your Nourish type spell complaint. Keep in mind that Chi generation is magnitudes better this way, and all that extra Chi feeds directly into Uplift and Chi Wave which is more mana free healing. Chi Wave the tanks, and it'll do it's thing.
    I will definatly go for chi wave tonight, thank you, I didn't even realise how little I was using chi burst. As for jabweaving, I shall give it a good shot. I am not so sure that at the moment I will have the time with all the failing raid failness to do that (when I was complaining it was normals, now my raid finds ALL THE THINGS to die from..bless their cottton socks) But maybe as progression...em...progresses...? I will find moments to smack something

    I did wonder about mastery vs crit in a 10man situation, again I shall try that tonight Anyone have any objections if I post my logs again later ??

  2. #22
    I'd run a bunch of heroics to give you the opportunity to acclimate to how jabweaving works. At the very least, you'll need to fiddle with your binds and bars.

  3. #23
    Since people are advertising chi wave over chi burst I wonder whether they fixed it not bouncing as often as it should be

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by lauryn View Post
    Since people are advertising chi wave over chi burst I wonder whether they fixed it not bouncing as often as it should be
    Afaik it has been fixed and works as intended - and heals quite nicely.
    I'm still wondering when to use our lvl30 talents at all in a 25m raid, though. With RwM fully spread, Uplift should be more healing than any of them (except for Chi Burst maybe when the whole raid is stacked before me).

  5. #25
    Especially in elegon 10 i have found chi burst to be amazing , did never test chi wave again after it proved to not bounce properly. Zen sphere Is not in par with those after the nerf.

  6. #26
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    I'd run a bunch of heroics to give you the opportunity to acclimate to how jabweaving works. At the very least, you'll need to fiddle with your binds and bars.
    I have all of it sorted even with a timer for blackout kick and tiger palm, it is literally whether I have time. But you are right on one thing, I do need more practice at it

  7. #27
    Hi,

    I have seen both of your logs and your spec/character.

    Firstly your talents are not the best choices imo.

    2nd tier, you have chosen chi burst, yet you dont use it? I personally use chi wave, because if theres little AE dmg then i use it on a tank or a low raid member, and its a rather nice heal.

    3rd tier, we are not rogues that needs more combo points to do more dmg.... so we dont need 5 chi, we dont hoard the chi either, we generate it and then we use it. ie... get 2 chi to uplift... get 3 chi to thunder focus > uplift... get 3 chi to evenlope mists. there are times when we know that high ae damage is incoming, so get 2 chi, uplift to top, soothing mists to get 2 chi, renewing mists to get a 3rd, thunder focus > uplift. i personally went for chi brew. i found this really helpful in most fights, with the following rotation in high AE dmg (such as final phase elegon). renewing mists > generate 2 chi > thunder focus > uplift > chi brew > uplift > renewing mists > uplift.

    5th tier, i prefer healing elixirs, because its a free 10% heal (on yourself) for everytime you drink a brew, that's thunder focus, mana tea (use on cd if glyphed), chi brew, fort brew - this is a free heal and costs no mana, and does more then expel harm.

    Other tiers are personal choice.

    However what i mentioned above will help more with healing/output. I am still learning to and i dont use evenloping mists/spinning crane kick enough - so i hope this helps

    After Hours - Late Night 25m Raiding Guild - Silvermoon EU
    ToT 13/13 Heroic (Pre-Nerf) - SoO 12/14 Heroic - Currently Recruiting!

  8. #28
    I actually picked up Rushing Jade Wind so I could test out SCK a bit more. Uplift is fantastic and definitely what I prefer to go for but sometimes Renewing Mist isn't up on everyone or I need more healing on top of what Uplift can do. SCK is immediate healing at a higher mana cost, so situationally quite useful.

    I can only see SCK winning if there is a lot of mobs you can hit and it's used in conjuncture with Blackout, your statue, and RJW - but that requires about as much prep work as RM/Uplift. It's a bit of a head scratcher b/c if the fan is proverbially pooped on that much I just use Revival.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-11 at 02:45 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisKoe View Post
    Afaik it has been fixed and works as intended - and heals quite nicely.
    I'm still wondering when to use our lvl30 talents at all in a 25m raid, though. With RwM fully spread, Uplift should be more healing than any of them (except for Chi Burst maybe when the whole raid is stacked before me).
    I can confirm that Chi Wave has been fixed and bounces the full 7 times. Used on raid member, it's a 4x heal.

    Regarding the usefullness of the lvl 30 talents in a 25 man, that's a bit of a head scratcher. Since I'm doing 10m, I can't give too much feedback but the one thing I can point out is that Chi Wave has very low overheal and that shouldn't be ignored when comparing numbers. Uplift is definitely sexy, but if it has a 45%+ overheal...

  9. #29
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    I'm almost embarrassed to show my logs from tonight.... I think I might be giving mistweavers a bad name. Basically, I am tunnelvisioning and having to think about what to press next...so Hc Stone dogs..(have you noticed how much crap gets on the floor??) and linking and and and and....so I died a lot, my idea of more raid healing went out the window as the tanks were dying so much, I changed a few glyphs and some talents, and em...yeah.... My officers are so not proud of me...

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/k...=12814&e=13229

    Not sure if I need help right now or just a /pat on the head and someone telling me to just keep going :P

    Still, thank you all for all the helpfulness and everything

    On the same note...has anyone ever had a moment, looking at the screen seeing someone standing in bad things, and suddenly....you realise it's you and it's too late...? Brain fails !!!

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Solishe View Post
    I'm almost embarrassed to show my logs from tonight.... I think I might be giving mistweavers a bad name. Basically, I am tunnelvisioning and having to think about what to press next...so Hc Stone dogs..(have you noticed how much crap gets on the floor??) and linking and and and and....so I died a lot, my idea of more raid healing went out the window as the tanks were dying so much, I changed a few glyphs and some talents, and em...yeah.... My officers are so not proud of me...

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/k...=12814&e=13229

    Not sure if I need help right now or just a /pat on the head and someone telling me to just keep going :P

    Still, thank you all for all the helpfulness and everything

    On the same note...has anyone ever had a moment, looking at the screen seeing someone standing in bad things, and suddenly....you realise it's you and it's too late...? Brain fails !!!

    dude.. thats normal Stone guard.......
    But .. Use more uplift, less Surging mist..

  11. #31
    Fistweaving is so good, you should REALLY try it.

    Rem>Jab>Jab>Uplift>Jab>Jab>Chiburst then triage heal. It does wonders.

    Look my logs on Fend tonight :
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/5...?s=3109&e=3581

    Just sit right behind the melees. Jabx2 then Chiburst the whole group. Keep REM up, uplift if needed. SCK to generate chi when you are away from the boss. Also look my DPS ! 13k ! Its something, imagine in 10m ! Seriously the more I play, the more Im convinced that Soothing/Envelopping/Surging is just very situationnal (tank healing/triage), and fistweaving/raid-aoe healing is where we truely shine.

    I still got to perfect my use of Zen Sphere, it's an excellent AOE healing spell too.
    Last edited by Alianthos; 2012-10-12 at 01:01 AM.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Mushroomkin View Post
    dude.. thats normal Stone guard.......
    But .. Use more uplift, less Surging mist..
    No, that really is heroic Stone Guards. You can see that by looking at the buffs gained tab - all have Energized Tiles buffs. WOL has problems noticing the difference. We have the same issue.

    Solishe: I'd say the problems you describe are mainly caused by inexperience with the class/the level of difficulty of the encounter. MW is far from being a simple healing spec and much will come with practice over time.
    Myself, I run LFR once or twice a day just to train to get an optimal RnM uptime. That's ofc far from being a realistic hc-simulation but it helps me. MAybe give that a try?
    Also: /pat, hang in there
    Last edited by ChrisKoe; 2012-10-12 at 07:33 AM.

  13. #33
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alianthos View Post
    Fistweaving is so good, you should REALLY try it.

    Rem>Jab>Jab>Uplift>Jab>Jab>Chiburst then triage heal. It does wonders.

    Look my logs on Fend tonight :
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/5...?s=3109&e=3581

    Just sit right behind the melees. Jabx2 then Chiburst the whole group. Keep REM up, uplift if needed. SCK to generate chi when you are away from the boss. Also look my DPS ! 13k ! Its something, imagine in 10m ! Seriously the more I play, the more Im convinced that Soothing/Envelopping/Surging is just very situationnal (tank healing/triage), and fistweaving/raid-aoe healing is where we truely shine.
    I think I shall try this in the "looking for many raids" that I will do this weekend, till Sunday when we go Feng hc

  14. #34
    Pit Lord Alltat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    Knowing the durations of the Renewing Mists HoTs is very useful for well timed Thunder Brew + Uplifts.
    That's debatable. If you cast RwM on cooldown, you'll have the exact same number of misted targets every time RwM is available, and the optimal time to TFT+Uplift will always be the exact same number of seconds after your last RwM cast. Since the RwM duration lines up fairly well with double the cooldown, the buffs should actually fall off at the same time as the new buffs spread, and you'll end up with a situation where the timing of TFT+Uplift doesn't make much difference. At best you'll refresh it on nine targets, and at worst you'll refresh it on eight, and you have a 50% chance to get nine if you don't pay attention to it at all. The ideal time to cast TFT+Uplift should be any time within four seconds of casting RwM. This assuming you use RwM on cooldown, or more specifically that you used it on cooldown the last two times you cast the spell.

    Since the exact duration of RwM is haste-dependent, this will vary somewhat depending on your haste. You should actually end up with haste "anti-caps" where your older RwM buffs fall off before the new ones can spread, meaning that TFT+Uplift becomes less effective. If you bring the duration down below 16 seconds while not having enough haste to get the next additional tick, you'll end up with a situation where the older RwM buffs start to fall off right before you can cast it again, meaning you'll get a scenario similar to the one above, except that you'll get at best eight and at worst seven targets, with the optimal time to TFT+Uplift being in the four second window before RwM comes off cooldown again.

    Either way, the difference should be very small, as getting it right only refreshes RwM on one additional target and you'll "get it right" half the time purely by chance. So watching the timers means you get on average half of a RwM buff (single target HoT, no the spread-cast) per Thunder Focus Tea. It's also only really relevant in a 25 man, as you'll have RwM rolling on most of the raid anyway in a ten man, and TFT+Uplift does rather little.
    Diplomacy is just war by other means.

  15. #35
    And then they eata da poopoo

  16. #36
    I tried a more ranged approach the first night of 25 man and it was fail. My mana was awful ... just frustrated overall. Last night I went in and stayed in melee and did a rotation of ReM, Jab, Chi Burst and Uplift. Try to use Thunder Focus Tea on cd as well. Mana was significantly better and my hps was at least 10k higher, averaging in the 49-57k hps range. I don't know if it's good or not. Now, the overheal of Chi Burst was horrendous. I think I might try Chi Wave next time. I didn't do any spin to win moves and had the Xuen out. That approach worked for me with my mana issues.

  17. #37
    The Lightbringer vian's Avatar
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    Once you learn how to work all your Chi generating/spending skills, you'll be able to solo heal almost everything, or, atleast carry the other healer : )
    Quote Originally Posted by bizzy View Post
    yeh but lava is just very hot water

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