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  1. #1
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    Some help Mistweaving.

    So, this is me, not having had the benefit of any time on a mistweaver in beta, for various reasons I re-rolled to mistweaver for MoP release (smacks head....resto druids are so strong right now...*)

    I have a few questions about various things that I think I'm slightly failing on. First of all, here are my logs for Will of the Emperor
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/7...=17533&e=18208

    I have looked at other logs and I realise I wasn't using my healing sphere's enough, but...I have a question...when to put them down...like if tank is taking some dmg, put them underneath him, or beside him as something he can step into ? or do you just as you're running...spam them around the place on people who look like they are going to take damage ? I don't really get the mechanic, and they annoy me the way shrooms annoyed me on my resto drood.

    Secondly...what do y'all do on periods of downtime, I am having some mana troubles, but we don't seem to have a spamable spell like nourish, and the whole fistweaving thing, with the lack of eminence numbers and viable dps throughput, just seem....pointless. I am still coming to terms with the whole manatea, for lack of a better word right now, "thing".

    here is my char, I'm pretty sure I have many more questions...but right now, this hopefully will be enough to get some feedback from the wonderful mistweavers who know more about the class than I do Oh and let me know if you think I should take different talent for 10man, we're starting heroic modes tonight yay !

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...olishan/simple
    Last edited by Solishe; 2012-10-10 at 11:19 AM. Reason: spelling noob...

  2. #2
    High Overlord Chevelle's Avatar
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    In brewmaster gear on armory bro

    Allright, so I had a real quick glance at your logs and I can't believe you are at the bottom of the healing. In my guild I keep topping. Best I have done so far was 62k hps on Feng the Accursed on a 3% wipe.

    What you want to do is make sure you keep renewing mists on cooldown. And since I ain't that much of a fistweaver I tend to stand at range and cast. When you do this you want to make sure you keep generating Chi so you can uplift. Our aoe healing is sick as hell even after the SCK nerf I reckon we should still be topping on aoe healing. Just use your Tornado , then SCK and then uplift to top people off I personally found this to be most mana efficient.
    Last edited by Chevelle; 2012-10-10 at 12:24 PM.




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  3. #3
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    I fixed the gear

    I totally understand we are pro aoe'ers, but this was mostly single target fight, I hadn't had much practise at single target, and we were going to two heal it...but I wasn't confident enough. I'll upload some logs again tonight after a few tries on Stone guard.

  4. #4
    High Overlord Chevelle's Avatar
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    Single target healing you still keep your renewing mists up. And what I do is just channel soothing mists as a chi generator. When burst damage does come in the most mana efficient way to deal with this single target is in my opinion to throw out an Enveloping Mist and just keep on casting soothing mist. This is what I do i don't know what other monks do .. as far as I am aware there are like a million kind of healing styles. Just find the ones that suits you the best.




    Chevelle founder and Guild Master of<Divide and Conquer> @ Frostmane EU
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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Solishe View Post
    So, this is me, not having had the benefit of any time on a mistweaver in beta, for various reasons I re-rolled to mistweaver for MoP release (smacks head....resto druids are so strong right now...*)
    Yep, they're strong. Mistweavers wipe floors with them, though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Solishe View Post
    I have a few questions about various things that I think I'm slightly failing on. First of all, here are my logs for Will of the Emperor
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/7...=17533&e=18208

    I have looked at other logs and I realise I wasn't using my healing sphere's enough, but...I have a question...when to put them down...like if tank is taking some dmg, put them underneath him, or beside him as something he can step into ? or do you just as you're running...spam them around the place on people who look like they are going to take damage ? I don't really get the mechanic, and they annoy me the way shrooms annoyed me on my resto drood.
    The only time you use Healing Sphere (if at all) is before a pull at the tanking location to have some sort of buffer for the first couple of seconds. I haven't found any situation to use them infight yet. Imho, they're pretty useless for Mistweavers (and also for BrM and WW due to rediculiously high energy costs).
    Main thing I notice is that your Renewing Mist heals for too little. Have it spread around the raid as much as possible, extend duration with Thunder Focus Tea->Uplift. Whenever your raid's stacked up, Spinning Crane Kick, Uplift (or Chi Blast depending on positioning) and Renewing Mist on CD.

    Quote Originally Posted by Solishe View Post
    Secondly...what do y'all do on periods of downtime, I am having some mana troubles, but we don't seem to have a spamable spell like nourish, and the whole fistweaving thing, with the lack of eminence numbers and viable dps throughput, just seem....pointless. I am still coming to terms with the whole manatea, for lack of a better word right now, "thing".
    Whenever you can manage to stay in melee range of anything attackable, do so. Even if due to misplacement of your statue/ lots of movement/whatever you don't heal much with it, it's cheap Chi generation if nothing else. Don't underestimate Fistweaving. Just look at Elegon. A boss that takes increasing damage? That's meant to be smacked by Mistweavers!
    For mana regen, see if the fight allows you to channel Mana Tea for a couple of seconds. If not, glyph it and keep it on CD. That's really important since MW dont have any sort of burst Mana regen like Innervate. Once you're oom, you'll probably stay oom.

    Quote Originally Posted by Solishe View Post
    here is my char, I'm pretty sure I have many more questions...but right now, this hopefully will be enough to get some feedback from the wonderful mistweavers who know more about the class than I do Oh and let me know if you think I should take different talent for 10man, we're starting heroic modes tonight yay !

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...olishan/simple
    Not much to say about it except that you're 5 points under the 1350 haste plateau for an additional RM tic. Also, I find Windsong an utterly useless healing enchant. It's a pure throughput enchant with quite little uptime (irc about 2% for all 3 procs). Until I get a weapon worthy of Jade Spirit, I'll stick with Heartsong.
    Last edited by ChrisKoe; 2012-10-10 at 01:07 PM. Reason: spelling is hard :(

  6. #6
    Mechagnome Italiandk's Avatar
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    The problem is, you basically 4 healed it: those two tanks together did more healing than the shaman did...

    In this situation the class/player less reactive will suffer more the lack of healing, plus you got a really effective paladin.

  7. #7
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    Thanks all for the help

    Not much to say about it except that you're 5 points under the 1350 haste plateau for an additional RM tic. Also, I find Windsong an utterly useless healing enchant. It's a pure throughput enchant with quite little uptime (irc about 2% for all 3 procs). Until I get a weapon worthy of Jade Spirit, I'll stick with Heartsong.
    totally had it stuck in my head it was 1345....my bad, ty for pointing it out though, I'll post logs of tonight, hopefully with major improvement taking what y'all have said. Again, thank you all for the help

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisKoe View Post
    Also, I find Windsong an utterly useless healing enchant. It's a pure throughput enchant with quite little uptime (irc about 2% for all 3 procs). Until I get a weapon worthy of Jade Spirit, I'll stick with Heartsong.
    I am so glad someone else realized this as well

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisKoe View Post
    Also, I find Windsong an utterly useless healing enchant. It's a pure throughput enchant with quite little uptime (irc about 2% for all 3 procs). Until I get a weapon worthy of Jade Spirit, I'll stick with Heartsong.
    How can a pure throughput enchant be considered worthless? I agree jade spirit is gonna be vastly superior, but id still prefer an extra 1500 crit rating than i would a measily 200 spirit.

    OT: like other say its all about keeping those RM rolling and picking the right spell for the right time while always trying to have a chi-generation going. I see alot of monks who looks to be stagnating and be unsecure on what button to press. "should i SM? oh but my mana is low... but expel and RM are on cd.. should i jab?.. Arrrgh now i just wasted 8 seconds" . Keep expel harm and RM on CD _always_, use SM whenever you havent got anything to do. Sometimes you get 3 chi superfast and that can net you a quick enveloping and those things heal a tank from 20% to full in a few seconds.

    Keep up the good work

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Kendral View Post
    How can a pure throughput enchant be considered worthless? I agree jade spirit is gonna be vastly superior, but id still prefer an extra 1500 crit rating than i would a measily 200 spirit.
    Windsongs uptime (when not fistweaving) is extremely low (read: 4 proccs in 12 minutes Will of the Emperor fights).
    You can't count on such a highly RNG-dependant enchant, the reliability of Heartsong simply wins out for most.

    I don't know the proc rate of Jade Spirit, but it's probably going to be a lot more reliable.

  11. #11
    I also needed some opinions on my mistweaver set up. I have been viewing logs and up until my raid tonight, was udner the impression that jab > jab> uplift was the best mana conserving rotation. But from logs of mistweavers on stone guards, this doesn't seem to be the case.

    This is my mistweaver. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ithan/advanced

    and my guilds logs for the night, http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=6122&e=6537

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    OT: I also have noticed that windsong only seems to proc reliably when Jabing for chi but not so much when healing from range.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Solishe View Post
    Thanks all for the help



    totally had it stuck in my head it was 1345....my bad, ty for pointing it out though, I'll post logs of tonight, hopefully with major improvement taking what y'all have said. Again, thank you all for the help
    Many Guides state that its 1345... Not sure atm because i am not at home... Are you sure its 1350?

  13. #13
    haste cap is 1345.
    And windsong is kinda meh when youre relying on RM etc cause it does Not procc off of your hots.
    So spam that soothing mist and SCK a bit more or just fistweave which is currently the best way to get high hps at.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Kendral View Post
    How can a pure throughput enchant be considered worthless? I agree jade spirit is gonna be vastly superior, but id still prefer an extra 1500 crit rating than i would a measily 200 spirit.
    IMO uptime will be the factor - windsong might proc 1500 crit, but if its only a couple of times in a fight 200 spirit being up for a higher percentage of the fight will probably win out

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Tavin View Post
    haste cap is 1345.
    .
    I don't have any math of my own to back up it's 1350, but both the guide here on mmo and on ej state it's 1350 for additional ticks of RwM and EnvM:

    'Once you reach a point where you are satisfied with your mana pool, it is time to consider throughput stats. The first goal in gearing is to reach the raid-buffed Haste breakpoints that result in extra ticks from Renewing Mist and Enveloping Mist. This requires 1,350 Haste, which should be quite easy to reach. The next breakpoints are at 8,096 Haste, which currently is not reasonable to obtain'
    http://elitistjerks.com/f99/t129834-...ring_Decisions

    As for the enchant: I generally like regen procs more than throughput ones because you can always use regen but troughput might go to waste (I almost always used Heartsong over Power Torrent for progression during Cata).
    Ofc a 200 Spirit proc is pretty measly, but the extremely low uptime of Windsong is what makes Heartsong the winner for me.


    Edit: Apparently, Windsong has been hotfixed. Uptime for Mistweaver is much higher now as it seems to procc off all healing spells now. No concrete numbers yet, but Windsong now seems to be 2nd best Enchant after Jade Spirit.
    Last edited by ChrisKoe; 2012-10-11 at 09:39 AM.

  16. #16
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisKoe View Post
    Edit: Apparently, Windsong has been hotfixed. Uptime for Mistweaver is much higher now as it seems to procc off all healing spells now. No concrete numbers yet, but Windsong now seems to be 2nd best Enchant after Jade Spirit.
    Good to know thank you I'll try windsong again this evening, I went with heartsong last night.

    So here are my logs from Stone Guard hc last night, which we didn't manage to get past 50%, but we will get down tonight, this boss is a bitch for showing up personal fails.
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/b...2jq/details/6/

    It's the whole report for me, so any feedback is of course welcome, I have managed to up my game to the point where some fights I even healed more than the shammy. But I am still behind...I'm hoping it's due to me not having a weapon, and being slightly less geared than the other two healers...not to mention they have been playing their classes for years (I am still smacking myself a bit for re-rolling tbh, nvm :P)

    Wait, I did have one more thing to add, chatting to the shammy last night, and he says I don't really have anything for "spot healing" I guess in that situation one would have to SoothingM/EnvelopingM(if chi)/surgingM which kind of seems to take more time than a flash heal. Possibly something that just needs more practise...


    Anyway

  17. #17
    Renewing Mist uptime looks better but there's still some room for improvement. Do you use an addon to track its duration? In 25m, it's nigh impossible to track the number of HoTs you spread+their respective duration. Affinity has a very neat WeakAura for that. You can find its string here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B30Yywqd44U

    I'm wondering about your healing role in the raid. Are you assigned as tank healer? If so, you should urge your raid lead to let you focus on AE-healing as this is where MW really shines atm. We do have very good emergency spot heal, but as you already mentioned, it needs some time to set up and it's quite expensive and cannot be sustained for a longer duration (worst case: tank needs heal asap, you have 0 Chi, no Chi Brew ready. Soothing->Surging, Surging, Surging, Enveloping. That's a f**kton of healing, but also almost 100k mana).

    If you're raid healing, Soothing Mist and Enveloping Mist shouldn't be so high. You seem to use the majority of your Chi for EnM, while Uplift is much better HPS when you manage to spread RnM enough.

  18. #18
    Blademaster Solishe's Avatar
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    Thank you Chris, I don't have a "role" per say, but tanks do drop like a truck on that fight so I do end up doing what you mentioned...then wondering where my mana has just gone...:P And thank you I will get that addon, I am missing a lot of my RWM cd's. I will chat to my other healers tonight and convince them to let me raid heal more (I need the numbers to convince a certain officer that I am worthy of being in the raid, regardless of my impressiveness in Ds and the fact of changing class for the good of the raid...anyway, I'll shh on that) Thank you for your help

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisKoe View Post
    Renewing Mist uptime looks better but there's still some room for improvement. Do you use an addon to track its duration? In 25m, it's nigh impossible to track the number of HoTs you spread+their respective duration.
    Tracking duration shouldn't really be all that important. As long as you use it on someone every time it's up, it'll cover the raid nicely. Of course, casting it on someone with a lot of duration left is suboptimal, but I doubt you'll be able to get 100% coverage anyway. So just cast it on someone who doesn't have it yet.

  20. #20
    Knowing the durations of the Renewing Mists HoTs is very useful for well timed Thunder Brew + Uplifts. I set up Vuhdo to show the buffs.


    I have several comments:

    First off, I don't see any use of your level 30 healing talents - at all. For Stone Guard, I highly recommend Chi Wave. Use it on the tanks and keep it on cooldown. It does a lot of healing, and due to its smart nature, the overheal is very low. It's a great throughput spell.

    Second, give jabweaving a try. Keep your Blackout buff at x2 and stay in auto attack range. If you can manage it, keep your Tiger Strike stack at x3 as well. This coupled with a well placed statue is a lot of free healing that specifically addresses your Nourish type spell complaint. Keep in mind that Chi generation is magnitudes better this way, and all that extra Chi feeds directly into Uplift and Chi Wave which is more mana free healing. Chi Wave the tanks, and it'll do it's thing.

    I'd save Soothing/Surging/Enveloping for crazy moments when tanks dont have cooldowns and spike damage is coming.

    In general, you need to pull away from tank healing. MWers have pretty bad single target sustainability, it's only really suitable for some fantastic support burst while someone else does it. Focus more on the raid, and


    As far as itemization goes, after haste cap I'd focus on crit. Mastery is much more reliable in 25 mans, in 10 mans orb useage is spotty and random unless your raid is very well trained to stand within 3 yards of a few.

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