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  1. #21
    Dreadlord Primalthirst's Avatar
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    Just because certain developers aren't active on some forums doesn't mean they aren't active on others.

    Warrior DPS seems to be having the most issues at the moment, mainly Power management and inflated numbers, Rogues and Mages are looking very good, Warrior tanking mitigation is insanely well balanced right now and the only real Cleric problems are Puri and Warden being crazily OP from a pure numbers point of view and a little bit of people not knowing how they're supposed to play the new soul.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    Go tell that to players with disabilities getting left out in the cold by this silly move. Good luck getting a ten button rotation to work while dps'n with these melee hating bosses in Rift. We are pigeon holed into Paragon and that is that.

    If you want to play warrior then play Paragon or reroll. I am not dealing with the roller coaster again. Mage will be FOTM and I am not fighting it this time around. It led to aggravation and a perma ban from the forums last time.

    Harbinger plays close enough to a warrior with 10 TIMES more utility then warrior could ever dream of to be a suitable replacement. Hell ranged and melee DPS/support/Heals mage is the way to go PLUS ADD IN a dev who communicates with the player base.

    The expansion is badass and next BETA test I am not wasting time on my warrior. Atrius can keep the 3 people who will still be playing warrior after this goes live.
    I can easily manage a 10 button rotation, with movement. You act like only melee have to move. Ranged have to stay out of fire, stack and spread, switch targets, run to pillars for tethers all sorts of things as well. Difference is we can still do DPS while doing it and a melee can't(at least for now, Tempest changes that). 10-15 button rotations while moving are EASY for anyone with effective keybinds who knows how to play. Learn to play, learn to keybind, learn how to not stand in stuff on the floor(yes, I am referring to you dieing to dance phase on Iskaal in DH Wed night, I was in that PuG with you).

    I'll give you a couple hints:

    1) Do not turn with your keyboard, unbind these keys and you have 2 more buttons you can bind withing reach of your other movement keys. Turn with the right mouse button held down.
    2) Never backpedal, you could potentially unbind s and use it as well, but I wouldn't. Turn around quickly eith your mouse and move if you have to, as melee, if chasing a boss, you can also easily move forward by pressing both mouse buttons.
    3) You can bind keys to more than the default 1-0, good keys include 1,2,3,4,5,R,T,Y,A,D,F,G,H,Z,X,C,V. That's SEVENTEEN(17) keys within easy reach of your strafe and move forward keys that can be pressed at the same time with one hand. If you find 17 keys not enough you can shift everything over to the right one and that opens up an additional 4 keys on the left, giving you a whopping 21 keys, in easy reach of 1 hand that can all be pressed easily while you are moving. If that STILL is not enough, you have modifiers, Shift/Alt/Ctrl quadrupling the number of keys available. That means potentially having 84 keys to press while moving should be no problem. Now keeping track of an 84 key rotation would be a pain, but anything less than 20 should be manageable.

    Learn to play, learn to keybind and 10 button rotations are NOTHING, I repeat, nothing. I can run a 10 button rotation with my eyes closed. If you can't, practice your rotation on a target dummy until it is so ingrained in your muscle memory you don't have to think about it. Then you will be able to keep it up while moving at the same time. God forbid they increase the rotations and actually add some challenge. I prefer it that way, it separates the good from the bad. Makes it far more apparent who is good and who sucks. If you want easy mode, 2-4 button rotations, there are other games for that. You are more than welcome to go play them. If you want to play a game that isn't easy mode, requires a little bit more practice, thought and doing more than one thing at a time, then work at it and get better. There are tons of people who do not have problems and prove that it is possible. I repeat, if you want easy mode, go to another game.

    and really, gonna bring players with disabilities into this? I don't mean to be rude, but the vast majority of gamers do not have disabilities that would affect their hands. If they do, they accept they cannot play. Developers are not going to design games like this for people with disabilities. If they did, then the players who want the challenge(of which there are more) would not play. The majority of gamers are not cripples who can only press one button at a time. If you are, I am sorry, but you should probably find other activities besides attempting to play video games, then failing, then wanting devs to ruin it for the rest of us.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-11 at 11:24 PM ----------

    Against my normal nature, i decided to log on to PTS and check out builds for my rogue and I gotta say, it looks like all my rotations did get longer, and I gotta say I like it. Ranger had become 4 buttons and one buff on myself to monitor, the rest was handled by macros. Was pretty boring.

    Until firm numbers are out and theorycrafters can really crunch I am making a few guesses but have come up with what my tests show should be optimal rotation and it is bigger. At least 6 buttons. Gonna have to keep track of Shadowfire buff on self every 30s, up from 25. Quick Fire Shot no longer adds bleed, but does damage better than Swift Shot now, so is new filler. Still able to macro that with piercing shot to cast on CD. Splinter Shot is new and is a 10s bleed, so seems it will have to be cast every other finisher. Ace Shot is new and buffs pet damage for 60s. It seems like Shadowfire, Splinter and Ace Shots should not be in macros and manually watched and used when buffs are about to wear off.

    For finishers, It looks like Head Shot for the buff to you and your pet, as long as that is up, Deadeye Shot. Again, cannot be macroed or you will only cast Head Shot which is less DPS than Deadeye but provides a nice buff.

    None of this includes AoE or Feral Aggression CD, though AoE seems pretty simple still. Trick Shot to 5 CP, concussive blast. If 5 or less targets, continue Trick Shot, throw finisher on highest health target when you have 5 CP. If 6+ targets, Rain of Arrows.

    Again, there is no real theory crafting behind this, just my quick observations, but seems right. Either way, at least as Ranger, we too have more buttons to press, more buffs to monitor and a pet to manage still, which is good!!
    Last edited by Lathais; 2012-10-12 at 04:52 AM.
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  3. #23
    . They removed macro's when the only people bitching about this were WoW fanbois. Find me a single PAYING customer of Rift who was bitching about not needing macros and wanting them destroyed in SL.

    . They pigeon holed every single warrior into Paragon.

    Atrius is a complete fool. Alpha testers have proven to be completely useless if they did not notice in tanking builds that they were getting two shotted. Wtf were Alpha testers doing? Looking for artifacts??

    Did these super pro alpha testers not notice Rogue heals that healed for 100% of your health every tick? ID geared tanks getting two shotted in ROTP? This is what happens when you take a bunch of people who play with top fo the line equipment and put them in charge of designing our class.

    I honestly do not care. My warrior is officially shelved until we get a real class designer. You cannot fundamentally change our entire class playstyle and fix what is not broken.

    Source: http://forums.riftgame.com/rift-gene...ompendium.html

    This is how many competitive builds we had before 1.11

    [51.13.2 2H] - 51 Champion 13 Riftblade 2 Beastmaster - DESTROYED
    [51.9.6 2H] - 51 Champion 9 Paragon 6 Riftblade - DESTROYED
    [51.15.0 2H] - 51 Champion 15 Paragon 0 Riftblade - DESTROYED
    [38.28.0 2H] or [43.23.0 2H] or [44.22.0 2H] - RiftChamp - DESTROYED
    [40.26.0 2H] or [39.27.0 2H] - DESTROYED
    [38.22.6 DW] - 38 Paragon 22 Champion 6 Riftblade- DESTROYED
    [44.22.0 DW] - 44 Paragon 22 Champion 0 Riftblade - DESTROYED
    [51.15.0 DW] - 51 Riftblade 15 Paragon 0 Void Knight -DESTROYED

    I am playing my Mage now
    1. 10 times less bullshit
    2. A class dev who is competent and does not put me on a roller coaster every single patch
    3. Melee dps...ranged dps...heals...support

    In my opinion Trion needs to evaluate their pool of Alpha testers. It took all of 10 minutes on the Beta before there were multiple threads about macros being completely destroyed.

    They did not replace macro's with skill based and situational attacks. They just made it so that we would have a bunch of buttons to press now for no damn reason other then to have buttons to press. I play this game for fun and stability. Not to be jerked around every single patch.

    The evidence is clear. We had multiple competitive builds and Atrius just destroyed every single one of them with changes not a damn warrior was requesting. Warriors are already re rolling in droves right now. It is clearly pointless to give feedback to Atrius, since in his own little world he considers these changes good for the class.
    Last edited by Puremallace; 2012-10-12 at 02:17 PM.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    . They removed macro's when the only people bitching about this were WoW fanbois. Find me a single PAYING customer of Rift who was bitching about not needing macros and wanting them destroyed in SL
    <snip grumble grumble>
    Its a bit premature to be making these outlandish protestations until 1.11 eve, wouldn't you say? as it relates to tanking:

    Hey guys, I just wanted to stop by and address some of the concerns being brought up here.

    First of all, you are absolutely right, we dropped the numbers on a lot of the tanking abilities. This was done across the board to Warriors, Clerics, and Rogues. The reason we did this was to fix scaling issues we were seeing with tanks and mitigation.

    Second, and this is important so I am going to highlight it. We adjusted mob damage output in line with these mitigation changes so you tanks should be capable of tanking the same things you already do, your ability to consume content should remain unchanged.

    And third, we implemented changes to tank DPS across the board on Warriors. In many cases you should see an increase of almost three times the damage you had before. This should address threat generation issues as well as synergy with other souls and general non tanking usefulness.

    And fourth, the Warlord is no longer a tanking soul. He can be used to add some utility to tanks and can offtank in an emergency situation but is by no means a tanking soul.


    Source

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  5. #25
    Fluffy Kitten Azuri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antipathy View Post

    Patience, Patience.
    Hi, you must be new here.
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  6. #26
    Dreadlord Primalthirst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    Find me a single PAYING customer of Rift who was bitching about not needing macros and wanting them destroyed in SL.

    I pretty much refused to play anything other than my Mage for 18 months for the sheer simplicity. The macro system pretty much allowed me to play in my sleep.

    They pigeon holed every single warrior into Paragon.

    Untrue

    Atrius is a complete fool. Alpha testers have proven to be completely useless if they did not notice in tanking builds that they were getting two shotted. Wtf were Alpha testers doing? Looking for artifacts??

    There are some good artifact locations in Cape Jule.

    Did these super pro alpha testers not notice Rogue heals that healed for 100% of your health every tick? ID geared tanks getting two shotted in ROTP? This is what happens when you take a bunch of people who play with top fo the line equipment and put them in charge of designing our class.

    There's a difference between noticing and having enough time to fix before the higher-ups say to open things to the public.

    In my opinion Trion needs to evaluate their pool of Alpha testers. It took all of 10 minutes on the Beta before there were multiple threads about macros being completely destroyed.

    It was a major change to the playstyle for some people, of course there was going to be backlash. Having to push more than 3 buttons is too hard for some. I think I'd pick the people who have an issue with simple things like that to be my testers...

    They did not replace macro's with skill based and situational attacks. They just made it so that we would have a bunch of buttons to press now for no damn reason other then to have buttons to press. I play this game for fun and stability. Not to be jerked around every single patch.

    Maybe not so much for Warrior, for several Rogue specs definitely have much more active Energy management now.
    /12345678910

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Azuri View Post
    Hi, you must be new here.
    This is a fond welcome to the interwebz, where the voice of reason is called accused of being a newbie :P

    to be fair though, generally, this community is rather rational ad discourse is usually a pleasure.
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  8. #28
    Here is my point. WHAT PROMPTED these changes?

    Look if there were constant back to back threads bitching on the warrior forums crying about macro's destroying the game and so much disparity between the warrior builds. Up till now the entire damn consensus was that warriors had found a good spot with multiple builds that worked.

    I mean seriously who expected multiple cool down changes to warriors or any class for that matter when they logged into BETA. If you did then give me your guess for the lottery numbers because you have a gift.

    Mage is just more fun then this crap plain and simple. This patch is going live 10/17/2012. I have zero faith that Atrius will fix anything. He fixed a class that was not broken.

    I do not understand how Atrius reasons a year and a half worth of work being flushed down the toilet for absolutely no reason. Look at the thread. Warriors are completely disheartened right now.

    It is pointless to give feedback. We do not even know where to start. All the progress we made has been destroyed. I mean holy crap we are arguing power regeneration again. I mean seriously!?!??!

    If you think I am pissed I CANNOT imagine how pissed some of the warrior guru's are who spent countless hours on the pts for the last 14 months testing and giving feedback just to have everything they worked for trashed.
    Last edited by Puremallace; 2012-10-12 at 03:01 PM.
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  9. #29
    The Lightbringer Tarien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    Here is my point. WHAT PROMPTED these changes?
    They wanted to piss you off. Right now the entire Trion dev team is clustered around Elrar's desk, laughing heartily as they read through your frothing tantrums and over the top rants that are based on how you and you alone perceive things to be.

    Coincidentally what you find abhorrent the rest of the playerbase more or less agree's with, so Trion just implement whatever will upset you most and it's a guaranteed hit with the rest of the community

    Also not sure that I would consider the warrior developer to be anything other than pro, I mean warriors have had it good in PvE since HK, and PvP since ID, and they've always been the best tanks. Win win win. You think warriors are pigeon holed now, you should see what mages have been playing for the past year.
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  10. #30
    Fluffy Kitten Azuri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primalthirst View Post
    There are some good artifact locations in Cape Jule.
    Well, you clearly didn't report the artifact bugs. Fail.
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  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Azuri View Post
    Well, you clearly didn't report the artifact bugs. Fail.
    They were hard to see with the artifacts floating 20 feet in the air. I cannot blame him for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tarien View Post

    Also not sure that I would consider the warrior developer to be anything other than pro, I mean warriors have had it good in PvE since HK, and PvP since ID, and they've always been the best tanks. Win win win. You think warriors are pigeon holed now, you should see what mages have been playing for the past year.
    So you just proved my point. wtf was the point of the changes? Like Cartman says if you are going to fuck me can you atleast wear a condom and some lube first
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  12. #32
    Fluffy Kitten Azuri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    They were hard to see with the artifacts floating 20 feet in the air. I cannot blame him.
    That was an attempt at sarcasm btw which doesn't transfer well into text.
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  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Azuri View Post
    That was an attempt at sarcasm btw which doesn't transfer well into text.
    I countered with my own. Since I have been shown the light and re rolled all I have to say is this:

    BUFF MAGES!!!
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  14. #34
    Did anyone else have a "Dat patch" face on when they read this?
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  15. #35
    The Insane DeltrusDisc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azuri View Post
    That was an attempt at sarcasm btw which doesn't transfer well into text.
    /sarcasm
    /sarcasmoff

    Works well too. ;p

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    I countered with my own. Since I have been shown the light and re rolled all I have to say is this:

    BUFF MAGES!!!
    Now that you said that Trion is going to nerf mages. When it happens, mages thank Pure.
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  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Lathais View Post
    Now that you said that Trion is going to nerf mages. When it happens, mages thank Pure.
    Shit I never considered this. The obvious next step of Trion is to screw up Mages in some way to cause me to rage.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-13 at 07:08 PM ----------

    So think I can live with 44BM. Just not a big fan of having a pet again, but it will work. I was posting some pretty decent number with no buffs.
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