1. #1

    There is two world raid races and two world firsts..

    Sop comparing 10 and 25 man.

    The obvious solution is this. The first to clear in 25 man is the world first in 25 man, the ones to clear 10 man are the world first in 10 man. There are enough differences and logistics where the two cannot be compared logically or scientifically ( if we are talking peer review which is directly what scientific aspires to)

    They both have unique challenges and quirks different from each other so they cannot be put as the same. Again, the first to clear in 25 man is the world first in 25 man, the ones to clear 10 man are the world first in 10 man. You can say differently but that is wrong. Science for the win.

  2. #2
    Scarab Lord Raiju's Avatar
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    You can say science for the win but in the end World First is World First and regardless of setting that is what most will remember.

  3. #3
    Wrong. They are separate and should be treated as such. It is not opinion, it is fact. Again, science for the win.

  4. #4
    Scarab Lord Raiju's Avatar
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    I never said they are the same and I never said how they should be treated. I said how they ARE treated. Even among the forum posters the majority in the thread stated world first is world first regardless of size (see poll in this forum). The even more casual players who are ofcourse majority 10man raiders due to it's ease to create will obviously more often than not see it as legitimate.

    Science? try logic.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Grogo View Post
    Wrong. They are separate and should be treated as such. It is not opinion, it is fact. Again, science for the win.
    What you stated is an opinion, not a fact. World first means by definition the first group to do it. It does not matter if it was 25, 10 or 1. First is first. There are no ifs ands or buts. FIRST IS FIRST. Paragon was WORLD FIRST. THAT is a fact. Now, there can be a first to kill it on 25 and a first to kill it on 10 but the WORLD FIRST was Paragon. Again, that is fact. You can only care about world 25 first all you want but the achievement "world first" belongs to Paragon because it is not specified what setting. Someone posted this in another thread and I'll post it here.

    World First: Paragon
    World First (10man): Paragon
    World First (25man): ???

    The above is FACT.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by NightZero88 View Post
    What you stated is an opinion, not a fact. World first means by definition the first group to do it. It does not matter if it was 25, 10 or 1. First is first. There are no ifs ands or buts. FIRST IS FIRST. Paragon was WORLD FIRST. THAT is a fact. Now, there can be a first to kill it on 25 and a first to kill it on 10 but the WORLD FIRST was Paragon. Again, that is fact. You can only care about world 25 first all you want but the achievement "world first" belongs to Paragon because it is not specified what setting. Someone posted this in another thread and I'll post it here.

    World First: Paragon
    World First (10man): Paragon
    World First (25man): ???

    The above is FACT.
    I agree with this poster, World first is world first no matter if it were 10 or 25

  7. #7
    Mechagnome Akarui's Avatar
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    they should be different, however world first is world first regardless of 10 or 25 man, since outside of the social problems of making sure 25 people are doing there job,the modes are fairly balanced, so really it doesn't matter since its the same raid with the same tactics just more health damage and the odd spell being done 5 times not 2 :P

    This is logic as Raiju said, world first hc kill and world first normal kill are different for a reason, world first 10/25 kills however are not.
    You can say you got world first 10 man, but you did not get THE world first.
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  8. #8
    Scarab Lord Raiju's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akarui View Post
    You can say you got world first 10 man, but you did not get THE world first.
    Unless you're paragon

  9. #9
    The fact is : they couldn't do it in 25 mans, so thay have to choose the " poor and sad easier way ". If you think that Paragon's members are happy, then you are wrong...
    GC : We try very hard not to monkey around with things just for the sake of changing, but it's easy to play the "I didn't see feedback on X, therefore there wasn't feedback on X" card.

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  10. #10
    The Patient Wolftusk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akarui View Post
    they should be different, however world first is world first regardless of 10 or 25 man, since outside of the social problems of making sure 25 people are doing there job,the modes are fairly balanced, so really it doesn't matter since its the same raid with the same tactics just more health damage and the odd spell being done 5 times not 2 :P

    This is logic as Raiju said, world first hc kill and world first normal kill are different for a reason, world first 10/25 kills however are not.
    You can say you got world first 10 man, but you did not get THE world first.
    Is your signature implying that everyone on 4chan is a brony?

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  11. #11
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