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  1. #401
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena View Post
    Garithos did screw over the blood elves, but not all humans are like that, and Jaina's anger came from not the fact they were blood elves but that she had twice been betrayed by the sunreavers with lethal results.
    My guess is those Sunreavers, who betrayed the Kirin Tor were among those who were sentenced to death by Garithos in Dalaran and all they want is the Kirin tor to suffer, that is the most logical conclusion.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  2. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    My guess is those Sunreavers, who betrayed the Kirin Tor were among those who were sentenced to death by Garithos in Dalaran and all they want is the Kirin tor to suffer, that is the most logical conclusion.
    Possible but we don't know that. Ah the good old cycle of hatred. I like cases like this Dalaran mess and the Camp Taurajo situation, good ways to stir the war up without using a flat out evil character or someone like Garithos.

  3. #403
    Bloodsail Admiral Rivyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    lol best thing that Blood Elf ever said, if he ever said anything.

    The Horde exists because of the Alliance
    Actually, the horde which began on draenor invaded azeroth where at the time there existed no alliance, only the individual nations of each race. So one could say that in all seriousness the alliance exists because of the original horde influnced by the burning legion

  4. #404
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    My guess is those Sunreavers, who betrayed the Kirin Tor were among those who were sentenced to death by Garithos in Dalaran and all they want is the Kirin tor to suffer, that is the most logical conclusion.
    or maybe they just want their faction to win?
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  5. #405
    Mechagnome Akarui's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by supersykke View Post
    oh dear, i think i had a nerdgasm
    I think i did too.... I want Garrosh dead, and i want the blood elves out of the horde. The Blood Elves have suffered so much and now all this, finally Lor'Themar is getting of his ass :3

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-12 at 09:34 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Rivyr View Post
    Actually, the horde which began on draenor invaded azeroth where at the time there existed no alliance, only the individual nations of each race. So one could say that in all seriousness the alliance exists because of the original horde influnced by the burning legion
    I think he was talking about the new horde, and more recently garrosh's horde. Since with all the racists like Tryande and Varian; although he seems to have calmed down quite a bit now, more character development.
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  6. #406
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    or maybe they just want their faction to win?
    Yeah right, blood elves actually interfering into a full scale world war, that brings them pretty much nothing, the only reason they helped was because they owed the horde, but that is down the drain now it seems.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  7. #407
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akarui View Post
    I think i did too.... I want Garrosh dead, and i want the blood elves out of the horde. The Blood Elves have suffered so much and now all this, finally Lor'Themar is getting of his ass :3
    You don't honestly think that do you? Do you realize the number of blood elf players on the horde side that are part of guilds and have friends on that faction. You think blizzard would split the blood elves from the horde and break up friendships and guilds.

    See, that arn't going to happen, the blood elves are not going anywhere. And please listen to the audio, Lor'themar makes it clear he's done with the alliances bigotry, and yet its just Garrosh he hates, not the horde.

  8. #408
    Quote Originally Posted by dannypoos View Post
    Does that mean dalaran will be off limits to the horde?
    It probably will end up one of those, if it matters to you that is, game breaking inconsistencies that we currently have akin to outland. The story that takes place currently always is completely inconsistent with previous versions. It's understandable though, it would be insanely difficult to have to redo the whole world for every expansion to make sure it flows smoothly.

  9. #409
    Shit just got real
    That guy (>'.')>


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  10. #410
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Yeah right, blood elves actually interfering into a full scale world war, that brings them pretty much nothings.
    Its a hell of a lot better than losing a world war.
    Look at Japan and Germany as an example of the cost of losing.
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  11. #411
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thetruth1400 View Post
    It probably will end up one of those, if it matters to you that is, game breaking inconsistencies that we currently have akin to outland. The story that takes place currently always is completely inconsistent with previous versions. It's understandable though, it would be insanely difficult to have to redo the whole world for every expansion to make sure it flows smoothly.
    I've said this dozens of times on other threads.

    The reason why the game feels so inconsistent, its because the developers are trying to make an RTS story from an Mmorpg, All previous wc games were streamline RTS stories that made them consistent and straight forward. Wow is a world your meant to explore, but as a result it leaves massive holes that stop making sense after a time.

  12. #412
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    on another note, i am very interested in the black temple scenario. It is kind of sweet to see old content pulled back into the game in a way that makes it relative to whats going on. Now I can only wonder what they intend to do with it. Wonder if we will get some clues or hints that Illidan isnt really dead =D

  13. #413
    Mechagnome Akarui's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    You don't honestly think that do you? Do you realize the number of blood elf players on the horde side that are part of guilds and have friends on that faction. You think blizzard would split the blood elves from the horde and break up friendships and guilds.

    See, that arn't going to happen, the blood elves are not going anywhere. And please listen to the audio, Lor'themar makes it clear he's done with the alliances bigotry, and yet its just Garrosh he hates, not the horde.
    I want that, i know it won't happen
    And hell no, the Blood elves are more likely sick of both factions by now anyway. My main point was Lor'Themar was actually doing something.
    Last edited by Akarui; 2012-10-12 at 08:49 PM.
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  14. #414
    Mechagnome Lotharfox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    Its a hell of a lot better than losing a world war.
    Look at Japan and Germany as an example of the cost of losing.
    There's a saying, "There's nothing more profitable than losing a war to the US." This is highly demonstrated in both Japan and Germany. After WWII, the US pumped money into them and built them into economic powerhouses. Whereas, say, Vietnam, who you might say beat the US, did not have money put into it for rebuilding, and is far below a lot of the other first world countries.

    Don't get me wrong, the wars were awful. Many lives were lost, and there is nothing that makes up for the atrocity of dropping nuclear bombs. I'm not saying it was a good thing for the countries. I was just point out that winning a war isn't always a lot more beneficial than losing a war.

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  15. #415
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    Its a hell of a lot better than losing a world war.
    Look at Japan and Germany as an example of the cost of losing.
    Oh I know what Germany lost during their world wars, but the blood elves were barely involved at all and it was still possible to solve this dilemma through diplomacy now that is pretty much impossible.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  16. #416
    Something to keep in mind when looking at characters, is that they don't have the same birds eye view we do. As a player, I can look at the blood elves and admit they've been wronged by the Alliance. I can look at the orcs and know that they aren't just mindless demon crazed monsters. But the characters don't get that benefit. They're actually down in azeroth, in the thick of things, with a limited perspective. Most humans weren't there at the climax of the third war fighting side by side with redeemed orcs. As a player I can understand Garrosh's motivations to provide a better future for his people even if I disagree with how he goes about it. I can understand why Jaina boots out the sunreavesr and cheer at the return of the Kirin Tor to the Alliance while admitting she overreacted. (Though on this issue I'm reserving final judgement until I can actually play it all through.) Just look at the real world. There's more to people on Earth than racism and bigotry, but despite whatever strides we may have made in the last century it's still very much a part of our world. A battle or war being fought over something dumb doesn't mean it's unrealistic, just look at our own history. I think it's actually interesting that both sides of this war feed eachother. The original horde drove the Alliance together. The Alliance's treatment of the orcs after they were bested eventually lead to Thrall's rebellion and the foundation of the new horde. Thrown in people intentionally stirring the pot like demons, Onyxia and the Twilight's Hammer and I don't think the ongoing war bad storytelling.

  17. #417
    Bloodsail Admiral Rivyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lotharfox View Post
    Vietnam, who you might say beat the US
    there is a difference in loseing a war being ordered to pull out. The war in vietnam was not our war, we where there to aid south Vietnam but due to political differences, US troops where pulled out.

  18. #418
    The idea of the horde and the alliance having factions change sides sounds pretty unbelievable doesnt it...

    But how this as an alternative. Blizzards been opening up the game and evening the sides so much lately that what i do see as a possible alternative for maybe the next Expansion would be to completely remove the barriers that define horde and alliance. Lets say the burning legion invades...both sides are going to have to work together to survive. I can totally see blizzard making it a selling point of the expansion that guilds can now have members from ANY faction, and the language barrier gets removed. The implementation of scenarios and the brawler arenas seem to be taking the pvp to more formalized settings. If both Wyrm and Garrosh are killed during this expansions storyline, then the 'alliance' and the 'horde' titles could simply vanish into losely tied factions with individual reasons to either hate or not hate the other side.

    If it was a demon invasion, they might have bigger things to deal with then old hatreds, but the idea of unformalizing the war between horde and alliance and turn it into more of anyone against anyone could have some pretty interesting quest and lore repercussions.

    As it is, if it was up to Garrosh, he probably would prefer the orcs stand mostly without the rest of the horde, same with the blood elves.

  19. #419
    Elemental Lord Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lotharfox View Post
    There's a saying, "There's nothing more profitable than losing a war to the US." This is highly demonstrated in both Japan and Germany. After WWII, the US pumped money into them and built them into economic powerhouses. Whereas, say, Vietnam, who you might say beat the US, did not have money put into it for rebuilding, and is far below a lot of the other first world countries.
    The only reason Germany didn't become an argrar nation was solely so the US would have a meatshield in Europe against the Soviets, not because of the kindness. But that is off topic.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  20. #420
    Elemental Lord Haven's Avatar
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    Woah woah woah WOAH WOAH now shit's hit the fan, MAN I LIKE IT! And finally, Lor'themar is in the spotlight! Best patch ever.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Metzenphrenia. As defined in the DSM: "To be so badly written, that it drives the character into insanity." It's symptoms are similar to schizophrenia but even crazier.
    "There are no answers, only choices" - Solaris.

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