Jaina and Dalaran in 5.1 [Heavy lore spoilers]

**Infernix** · 2012-10-16, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by FireMageAl

WoW MOP: Tyrande = (Major Spoilers)

Lemme see if I understand this correctly: Tyrande, a former immortal with over ten thousand years of experience, is going to get a lesson in patience from a creature less than fifty years old...

And because of this single lesson that makes NO DAMNED SENSE, she's going to call him High King...

What does an aneurysm feel like?

**RyanEX** · 2012-10-16, 05:25 PM

Originally Posted by Infernix

Lemme see if I understand this correctly: Tyrande, a former immortal with over ten thousand years of experience, is going to get a lesson in patience from a creature less than fifty years old...

And because of this single lesson that makes NO DAMNED SENSE, she's going to call him High King...

What does an aneurysm feel like?

Kinda like how the question of how do the orcs ambush and outshoot Sentinels in their own damn forest.

**Shedeo** · 2012-10-16, 05:38 PM

Lesbian forest orgies; they didn't practice sneakery or archery during those 10,000 years of not having men.

Seriously though? The whole invasion of Ashenvale only makes sense if the Horde is acting purely out of numerical superiority against a force which I would assume has a rather abysmal population growth.

In regards to Jaina breaking the neutrality of the Kirin Tor.... Who cares? Horde blew up her city and she was then given control of the single most powerful organization of mages on the planet. So she made them not-neutral. Horde killed her family and then she was handed a gun. Gun was neutral. It wont be for long.

Also, I am of the opinion that the Kirin Tor were always pro-Alliance. The Ambermill Mages might have been said as being a splinter faction, but honestly I think its a Dalaran operation which they CLAIM is a splinter faction, but in all actuality, is them working against the Forsaken. And honestly, who can blame them? The Forsaken are douchebags.

**Scummer** · 2012-10-16, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by Infernix

Lemme see if I understand this correctly: Tyrande, a former immortal with over ten thousand years of experience, is going to get a lesson in patience from a creature less than fifty years old...

And because of this single lesson that makes NO DAMNED SENSE, she's going to call him High King...

What does an aneurysm feel like?

Pretty much.
The only thing going for her atm with this whole High King deal is that Elune's telling her to follow him, but this doesn't mean they had to write her as an idiot to prove Varian right.

**Florena** · 2012-10-16, 06:45 PM

I think there's a diminishing return on wisdom and skill when you reach a certain point. Once you reach your peak, being there for 10000 years, especially with that time span being between major conflicts, doesn't make you inherently superior to younger races that peak earlier.

**Shedeo** · 2012-10-16, 06:53 PM

Originally Posted by Scummer

Pretty much.
The only thing going for her atm with this whole High King deal is that Elune's telling her to follow him, but this doesn't mean they had to right her as an idiot to prove Varian right.

The idea that Elune is telling her to follow him is kind of intriguing. I really wish that they would have just focused on that, instead of making her aggressive to the point of stupidity.

**Scummer** · 2012-10-16, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by Florena

I think there's a diminishing return on wisdom and skill when you reach a certain point. Once you reach your peak, being there for 10000 years, especially with that time span being between major conflicts, doesn't make you inherently superior to younger races that peak earlier.

But no matter how you look at it it shouldn't cause you to become an idiot and want to just charge headlong at the enemy with no forethought.

**Frontenac** · 2012-10-16, 11:24 PM

Originally Posted by Shedeo

The idea that Elune is telling her to follow him is kind of intriguing. I really wish that they would have just focused on that, instead of making her aggressive to the point of stupidity.

To be honest that new found aggressivity is welcomed. It is much closer to what Tyrande was in WC3. She was almost reckless and quick to shoot her arrows at humans and orcs alike if Malfurion wasn't there to stop her. Besides, we don't know what exactly is happening and what Varian says. So I'll wait before calling her stupid. Although I must admit that Darnassus is HER city and that Varian should not be giving orders there. She should lead the attack.

**SteveeRoo** · 2012-10-17, 01:08 AM

I want Tyrande to become a really genocidal bitch ala warcraft 3. She has tried playing silent and now she is just bored. YAY at psycho Tyrande

**Dreknar20** · 2012-10-17, 01:12 AM

Originally Posted by Shedeo

Seriously though? The whole invasion of Ashenvale only makes sense if the Horde is acting purely out of numerical superiority against a force which I would assume has a rather abysmal population growth.

Are you saying the Horde has zero military experience and strategy?

But yeah, Ashenvele was the main focus of the Horde, it was the whole point the Horde started the war.

**Trassk** · 2012-10-17, 01:14 AM

Tyrande's became a housewife and mother.. except.. you know... without the kids...

Is Malfurion firing blanks? Well, thats something Varian and Thrall got that his 10k years can't fix.

**Golden Yak** · 2012-10-17, 01:22 AM

Tyrande has been needing some character advancement since WC3, far as I'm concerned. I liked the friction between her and Malfurion that was there at first - Tyrande had become more cold and ruthless in the 10,000 years she's been fighting throughout Kalimdor while Malfurion slept and his memories of their early life together were fresher. But all that frost suddenly melted right before they fought Archimonde, which was reasonable sure, but frankly kind've uninteresting.

Wouldn't mind seeing her return as warrior queen of the feral elves - 10 years of 10,000 years doesn't matter if you've adopted the mindset of the predator. Your mind is also in the 'Now' and your first response is 'pounce!'

**Reppu Kishin** · 2012-10-17, 01:42 AM

Originally Posted by Dreknar20

Rofl
"in the name of peace", does that not seem funny to you? You gonna kill people who are killing people to show just how much killing people is wrong?

Peace is wrought in blood. It's only when peace is wrought with the blood of the innocent, that peace becomes a lie. Peace must always come at the cost of the blood of the wicked.

Don't be ignorant of reality, just because you scream "For the Horde!" at the top of your lungs. As much as I support Anduin's proposal of peace with out bloodshed, that just isn't a reality.

Rabid dogs need be put down, least you risk infecting all.

**Trassk** · 2012-10-17, 01:45 AM

Originally Posted by Reppu Kishin

Peace is wrought in blood. It's only when peace is wrought with the blood of the innocent, that peace becomes a lie. Peace must always come at the cost of the blood of the wicked.

Don't be ignorant of reality, just because you scream "For the Horde!" at the top of your lungs.

Actually, if I may, he's deluded himself into believing that Garrosh's form of leadership is the only one that represents the horde as a whole.

I am glad to say I've gotten a lot more perspective on this.

**Dreknar20** · 2012-10-17, 01:59 AM

Originally Posted by Reppu Kishin

Peace is wrought in blood. It's only when peace is wrought with the blood of the innocent, that peace becomes a lie. Peace must always come at the cost of the blood of the wicked.

Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity. They cant really go together.

---------- Post added 2012-10-17 at 02:01 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Scummer

But no matter how you look at it it shouldn't cause you to become an idiot and want to just charge headlong at the enemy with no forethought.

well, that's what anger, frustration, and whatever else does to people.

**Bananarepublic** · 2012-10-17, 02:20 AM

I just hope they kill Garrosh.

And I REALLY REALLY hope they did NOT really kill Anduin, I say this as a horde player, I like that character.

**Dreknar20** · 2012-10-17, 02:42 AM

Originally Posted by Trassk

Actually, if I may, he's deluded himself into believing that Garrosh's form of leadership is the only one that represents the horde as a whole.
I am glad to say I've gotten a lot more perspective on this.

your snide remarks are always welcome

**spectrec130** · 2012-10-17, 03:23 AM

On the Jaina decision, as a BElf horde player, she is spot on with her response to the Horde targeting Nexus (Focus Iris) Theramore (Mana Bomb) n Darnassus (Bell) in their advancement of war versus the alliance. Irregardless to actions of the Kirin Tor, it is what it is n Aethas really looks inept and, it can be argued, impotent in a position of leadership with the council and the sunreavers as a whole. TBH would LOVE to see what Rommath would do to the KT in response vs the Sunreavers. Anywhooooo, the question must be asked "Is Garrosh THAT devious?" or "Is Aethas THAT much of a pawn?" We'll soon find out. But overall, I have to give Blizz some serious Kudos on the turn of events and if Anduin gets killed, as a longterm Horde player, am very curious to hear Varian's reaction.

The bottomline for me is Garrosh and this turn in Lore, along with the very much anticipated Varian reaction, was the best thing Blizz has come out with flat out period. Shyiat is gonne hit the fan! Epic!

Nicely done!!!

**Amonra** · 2012-10-17, 04:10 AM

Awwww yeah, those spoilers are so freaking good I got wet. Cause I spilled my cocoa in excitement.

I personally believe that Aethas had nothing to do with the use of the Dalarani portals to ferry Garrosh's forces, but one of the Sunreavers must have. As innocent as Aethas might be, his inability to keep his people in check is a liability to the Kirin'Tor. Jaina tried to play nice well beyond her personal feelings and keep the faction neutral, but Aethas now reiterating negligence cost the Alliance another tragedy.

This obviously gave Jaina all she needed to say "screw this, we are going full on Alliance, bitches" Because if Aethas can't keep his people in check, what's the point of the illusion of neutrality? Aethas its at best guilty of gross negligence.

Still, even understanding Jaina's position, I gravely feel for the Blood Elves. You can make the case that it was a rogue sunreaver agent should not taint the whole perception of the faction, and that is a point open to debate, and that could lead to the re-neutralization of the Kirin'Tor in the future; but that might be long from now. Lor'themar ended up loosing a lot of his people because of Garrosh' disregard for sindorei lives, knowing well that his plans would lead to the ostracization of the Sunreavers in Dalaran; basically branding them as the patsy, the fall guy. Lor'themar truly is at a defining moment in his leadership, and to whom he might be reffering as old allies is an interesting question. Nonetheless, I am intrigued to see how will his role develop. And above all, I just freaking excited by all the blood elven lore brought up by this patch!

Anduin can't be dead; he is the future of the alliance, and his dead would destroy the new-founded humanity on Varian. He couldn't be the High King if he really losses his beloved son, how could he overcome that without being filled by hatred? he could not get trough it for a second time. Maybe besides a new Warchief, there will be a new High King.

BEST PATCH EVER!!

**7seti** · 2012-10-17, 04:18 AM

Originally Posted by Amonra

Anduin can't be dead; he is the future of the alliance, and his dead would destroy the new-founded humanity on Varian. He couldn't be the High King if he really losses his beloved son, how could he overcome that without being filled by hatred? he could not get trough it for a second time. Maybe besides a new Warchief, there will be a new High King.

I've been thinking about that. There's an alliance quest in Krasarang that reeks of foreshadowing (http://www.wowhead.com/quest=30445). Basically, there's a sacred spring that transfers life from one person to another, even to the point of killing someone to rez someone. What say Varian sacrifices himself to rez Anduin? We get rid of this "High King Lo'gosh" nonsense, and Anduin gets to be king of Stormwind and play his role in the future Burning Legion expansion. Works for me.

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