Why does Blizzard always contradict the lore; Old Gods?

[bionics]

The idea that the Titans are "good guys" seems kind of flawed I think. They care about as much for us as a scientist does his creation, if it's found to be flawed, destroy it and start again.

Exactly.

Or nigh-omnipotent kids holding a magnifying glass over a line of marching ants.

[Granyala]

I don't know if Titans are suposed to be oniscient and onipotent... It is very possible they are blind to most things happening in Azeroth...

It's been stated by Blizzard that the titans are neither invulnerable nor omnipotent.
Also: The universe is infinite.

These two facts combined makes it logical that they actually NEED Algalon to report in order to know whats really up. So far: Algalon studies us.
So, grab a beer and wait what happens.

They care about as much for us as a scientist does his creation, if it's found to be flawed, destroy it and start again.

Your opinion.
My opinion: re-origination = last resort when one part of their creation endangers the other.
Remember: Azeroth is not the only planet structured by them, and the old gods want all planed to drown in chaos.

Until Blizzard spits out more stuff, we can argue till kingdom come. :<

[Soulwind]

So if the construct can be taught the value of life, don't you think the Creators are aware of it?

He did talk about that, but I think the real reason he didn't reset Azeroth was because of his miscalculation. Our victory was impossible, yet, he was defeated. If a system is flawed, then it must not be trusted: he could not work based on his own analysis since those could be wrong, too.

I haven't seen the video, but I don't think they are removing any power from the Old Gods, on the contrary, they are showing the Titans as much more powerful beings. Do they even say all of those Old Gods were on Azeroth? They may be expanding their lore to a millenary war where only a few planets like Azeroth have been spared by not killing -all of- the Old Gods that inhabitated them.

[Freeasacar]

So 11 pages later, the community even cannot agree on "the lore". Does Blizzard really contradict themselves. But wait..maybe things change as new things are discovered, kinda like our history changes when new things are discovered. Or things are interpreted because we do not have all the facts?

Nope, here's the lore. You don't kill an old god without destroying Azeroth. All references to "killing" an old god (Y'Shaarj and other old gods "killed" in the war between the titans/old gods before recorded history) are the same thing we did to both Yogg and C'thun. We put them to sleep, possibly for millenniums, eons, or even longer. Saying that anyone has ever killed an Old God on Azeroth is just another way of saying someone put them out of action for the foreseeable future, since not many races have even existed long enough to see them wake up again.

The whole of Azeroth is just one big prison that the current races happen to live on. That's why Algalon was so eager to just annihilate it at the first sign of trouble. It's also the reason that as long as the current races still live on Azeroth, the Titans are not our gods. They're just our jailors and they won't hesitate to destroy the jail if we fail at our attempts to suppress the old gods.

[Madruga]

He did talk about that, but I think the real reason he didn't reset Azeroth was because of his miscalculation. Our victory was impossible, yet, he was defeated. If a system is flawed, then it must not be trusted: he could not work based on his own analysis since those could be wrong, too.

I haven't seen the video, but I don't think they are removing any power from the Old Gods, on the contrary, they are showing the Titans as much more powerful beings. Do they even say all of those Old Gods were on Azeroth? They may be expanding their lore to a millenary war where only a few planets like Azeroth have been spared by not killing -all of- the Old Gods that inhabitated them.

I think making the Titans appear much more powerfull is their intent. Just that the Old Gods do appear weaker when their antagonist is shown as having killed "lots" of them without too much trouble.

The interview doesn't say where the Titans killed the Old Gods. The dev just says this, "the Titans actually killed a lot of Old Gods". Afterwards, the dev does confirm that Y'shaarj is dead, and he makes it appear as something quite natural. We can assume only Y'shaarj was killed in Azeroth.

My guess is, all these Old Gods were killed in other places. To counterattack this, the Old Gods that came to Azeroth found a way to get so deeply connected with the world that killing them would be a bad idea. The death of Y'shaarj caused an effect the Titans had never seen anywhere around... His influence stayed in the form of Sha. So the Old Gods found a way to preserve themselves, and they were successfull. Instead of killing all Old Gods here and spreading corruption everywhere, the Titans decided it was best to imprison them.

[Granyala]

To counterattack this, the Old Gods that came to Azeroth found a way to get so deeply connected with the world that killing them would be a bad idea

That's an interesting thought. The Enemy, reacting to it's losses and developing strategies to preserve, in this instance, intertwining with the creation the titans seek to protect in the first place... that's mean.

I like it.

[ijffdrie]

So 11 pages later, the community even cannot agree on "the lore". Does Blizzard really contradict themselves. But wait..maybe things change as new things are discovered, kinda like our history changes when new things are discovered. Or things are interpreted because we do not have all the facts?

Unlike actual history, we get our lore from developer interviews and manuals. When we do get information in-universe, its from a reliable source, like the databases created specifically for the titan facilities. Warcraft is actually a pretty rare case (at least in the more popular fantasy universes) of the backstory being extensive and non-ambiguous. In my opinion, it's one of warcraft's strengths and something that sets it apart. However, it does remove most of the "we didn't have all the facts" excuses for changing lore.

Also, disagreement does not mean that it was never set in stone. Fans remember stuff weirdly sometimes. To pull a random example out of my shapely buttocks, I'm going to bring digimon into this. I know a couple of guys who swear by the japanese version of that show. They don't take anything from the english series as canon. Yet, whenever one of the characters, Yolei (going with english name for ease here), is discussed, they refer to events from one of the final episodes that make her look to be a total psychopath (her fondest wish being that her siblings would disappear so she wouldn't have to share dessert). An event that never happened in the japanese version.

My guess is, all these Old Gods were killed in other places. To counterattack this, the Old Gods that came to Azeroth found a way to get so deeply connected with the world that killing them would be a bad idea. The death of Y'shaarj caused an effect the Titans had never seen anywhere around... His influence stayed in the form of Sha. So the Old Gods found a way to preserve themselves, and they were successfull. Instead of killing all Old Gods here and spreading corruption everywhere, the Titans decided it was best to imprison them.

Heh, actually had an idea similar to that once in a fan theory. It actually fits all the known facts really well, as it takes care of the incongruity between the in-game books and the Ulduar dialogues (the former stating that the old gods were on azeroth before the titans, the latter stating that the old gods only infected the planet after the titans came to azeroth).

[Deleted]

Titans... it's like god irl... they can't create themself, so the primal order have changed because Titans are the so called new " king of the universe "....

Maybe the old gods are some " primal order children " who just want to kick those heretics from this " false universe ".

[Venziir]

Titans... it's like god irl... they can't create themself, so the primal order have changed because Titans are the so called new " king of the universe "....

Maybe the old gods are some " primal order children " who just want to kick those heretics from this " false universe ".

But they can create. They created Sargeras - the strongest of the Titans, and they've created quite a few other races as well.

[Mormolyce]

Titan/Old God/etc lore has been retconned a lot, remember even Sargeras was just some random Daemon in the original Warcraft lore? The entire Burning Legion was invented in Warcraft III. The Old Gods were first mentioned in the WC3 manual I believe? But they didn't actually appear until WoW (unless you count the "forgotten one" in TFT). Pretty much all the lore you're interested in has been a massive retcon.

They need to change the lore to keep expanding the story. In Warcraft I the only two races were Orcs and Humans (thus the title), and demons were just minions you summoned like water elementals.

Also, I found this on Wowpedia:

Krasus speculated that should the Old Gods open the gates of their prison even Sargeras would find himself pleading for the peace of death

It comes from a Knaak book so... ignore it.

[Rheckameohs]

And we needed the help of the Watchers, extremely powerful Titan constructs, to even survive engaging Yogg-Saron.

So my no-lights kill isn't canon?

[Granyala]

It comes from a Knaak book so... ignore it.

*chuckles*

[ijffdrie]

Titan/Old God/etc lore has been retconned a lot, remember even Sargeras was just some random Daemon in the original Warcraft lore? The entire Burning Legion was invented in Warcraft III. The Old Gods were first mentioned in the WC3 manual I believe? But they didn't actually appear until WoW (unless you count the "forgotten one" in TFT). Pretty much all the lore you're interested in has been a massive retcon.

There is a bit of a difference. Warcraft I had a crappy story. No one cared about it. Warcraft II was a bit better, as the factions were at least somewhat defined, but the actual events were rather meh as well. Retconning these two to create a universe that's actually unique and interesting is a good thing. Then continuing to retcon the unique and interesting universe is where it gets annoying.

[Gereorth666]

I am just sticking by the usual: It's Blizzards game, if they want to eventualy turn the Old Gods into sheeps, and it was just a stupid illusion. They have the full right to do so. As it's their IP, owned by them so therefore any Lore made up, if you like it or not, is always true. Unless when you stated in WC3 that Humans are the gods of turtles, and then later state turtles have always been the gods of the Humans.