So Destro locks are getting a new AoE Immolate...

[Annesh]

Time for Shadow dot spread mechanic.

I say we build an army to storm the official forums. Shadow AoE sucks very bad, and their intent that we multidot to supplement is just wrong.

Give us some way to spread SWP at least. In our current state I'm not even sure this would be OP.

In situations of 3-5 mobs it might save us 2-4 GCDs every 18 seconds, which MAY put us in the top 1-3 slots for those situations, and that is where we would really shine. Warriors, ele shamans, and others would still easily rival or even beat us but we would be competitive at least.

In true AoE situations of 9+ mobs, Sear is just pitifully bad, so getting that boost might actually itself bring us on par.

I don't want to brainstorm anything specific, because they tend not to listen to specific suggestions. "A spell or use of a spell to spread SWP" seems specific enough - we want better AoE, and most of us even agree that spamming Mind Sear can be boring.

Thoughts?

[Bonkura]

Seed of Pain?

[Ananaias]

Isn't Mind Sear getting a 25% buff in 5.1?

Also, Multidotting is fine. idk why people bitch about it.

Oh wait. "OH NO I CANT PUSH ONE BUTTON AND WIN ANYMORE."

[Karshda]

Isn't Mind Sear getting a 25% buff in 5.1?

Also, Multidotting is fine. idk why people bitch about it.

Oh wait. "OH NO I CANT PUSH ONE BUTTON AND WIN ANYMORE."

I would be fine with Multidotting+Mind sear to be our aoe. What makes me mad is how GC talks about how he wants Aoe to be more then just one button. But then leaves all the other specs with one button aoe that far surpasses our own.

[Nekrosislol]

we already have a way of spreading immolate to all targets, this new ability isnt going to replace it or be apart of aoe.

[Veyne]

A) Destruction Warlocks can already spread Immolate to multiple targets with Fire and Brimstone, costing 1 Burning Ember (a very valuable resource - what Warlocks use to cast Chaos Bolt).

B) This is a utility spell, and will be by no means a rotational AoE damage spell. It is primarily a knock back, with a slightly different than usual damage component. The 10 yard range and point-blank nature will be unpractical for rotational use, not to mention it's inefficient casting mechanics.

C) Shadow AoE's getting a pretty hefty buff.

I would be fine with Multidotting+Mind sear to be our aoe. What makes me mad is how GC talks about how he wants Aoe to be more then just one button. But then leaves all the other specs with one button aoe that far surpasses our own.

Destruction Warlocks have a far more complex AoE rotation than Shadow, and it's probably has the WEAKEST effort-to-outcome ratio of all AoE rotations, requiring a semi-intelligent use of resources and spell timing/positioning.

[Soulstrike]

would like to see some sort of aoe burst with shadow orb mechanic

[Inshabel]

AFAIK Cataclysm doesn't actually apply Immolate, it's just the wording of the tooltip, even if it did we already have a way of spreading Immolate that doesn't require us to stand within a 10yd range so I don't really understand why you're bringing this up now instead of during beta.

[Karshda]

A) Destruction Warlocks can already spread Immolate to multiple targets with Fire and Brimstone, costing 1 Burning Ember (a very valuable resource - what Warlocks use to cast Chaos Bolt).

B) This is a utility spell, and will be by no means a rotational AoE damage spell. It is primarily a knock back, with a slightly different than usual damage component. The 10 yard range and point-blank nature will be unpractical for rotational use, not to mention it's inefficient casting mechanics.

C) Shadow AoE's getting a pretty hefty buff.



Destruction Warlocks have a far more complex AoE rotation than Shadow, and it's probably has the WEAKEST effort-to-outcome ratio of all AoE rotations, requiring a semi-intelligent use of resources and spell timing/positioning.

I guess I should've put "most" instead of "all" specs. A few specs have some difficult aoe, just tired of seeing all the one button aoe just craping on my aoe dps.

[Strykie]

Isn't Mind Sear getting a 25% buff in 5.1?

Also, Multidotting is fine. idk why people bitch about it.

Oh wait. "OH NO I CANT PUSH ONE BUTTON AND WIN ANYMORE."

When has mindsear ever been good besides the first few weeks of wotlk?

Stop spewing shit.

[Gilian]

Isn't Mind Sear getting a 25% buff in 5.1?

Also, Multidotting is fine. idk why people bitch about it.

Oh wait. "OH NO I CANT PUSH ONE BUTTON AND WIN ANYMORE."

It's actually more fun to multidot. I hope it's not going to be mind sear spam after 5.1.

---------- Post added 2012-10-22 at 09:12 AM ----------

When has mindsear ever been good besides the first few weeks of wotlk?

Stop spewing shit.

Where did he say mind sear was good? lol

[Frmercury]

For Priests at least what you're seeing in the 5.1 Patch Notes have been hotfixed live according to CMs' Twitters so Mind Sear is buffed now. Multi DoT + Mind Sear is pretty boss.

[Volitar]

I think Mind Sear should spread dots.

There I said it.


Maybe make the dots that are spread only have a short duration so if you want to keep dots rolling on all targets you have to channel Sear not just let it tick once and go back to doing single target DPS.

[yurano]

I think Mind Sear should spread dots.

There I said it.

Maybe make the dots that are spread only have a short duration so if you want to keep dots rolling on all targets you have to channel Sear not just let it tick once and go back to doing single target DPS.

Or... or... Mind Sear ticks on a DoT target will cause the dots to erupt at 50% damage to all targets within 15 yards but has a 50% chance to consume a tick. Basically an AoE Malefic Grasp for Shadow Priests?

And then you have the DoT procs such as DI and FDCL work with AoE. When you use a DI Mind Blast, your next Mind Sear tick erupts dots at 100%. When you FDCL a Mind Spike, increases the damage of your next Mind Sear tick by 100%. This is assuming that the 'erupt' dots do not proc DI or FDCL.

OMG an AoE rotation? That works with all of the current SP mechanics? OMFG!

[Veyne]

I guess I should've put "most" instead of "all" specs. A few specs have some difficult aoe, just tired of seeing all the one button aoe just craping on my aoe dps.

Sorry if it seems like I went off on a tangent, there. I was sticking to Destruction Warlocks because it was the spec specifically being compared in the original post.

Truthfully speaking, though, there aren't a ton of classes that have a 1-button-spam AoE rotation anymore, though the ones that do are probably a little too powerful: Monks and their Spinning Crane Kick, Feral Druids with their Thrash -> Swipe spam, Elemental Shaman with their Chain Lightning, and possibly Survival Hunters with their Improved Serpent Sting/Serpent Spread/Multi Shot and Explosive Trap.

When has mindsear ever been good besides the first few weeks of wotlk?

Stop spewing shit.

Mindsear was pretty strong for a pretty good chunk of WotLK whenever there were large groups of AoE. I particularly remember specifically being put on Rubble duty, with one or two other people, and Mind Sear was pretty strong there.

Personally, If I were to get back to my Shadow Priest, I'd prefer for Multi Dotting to be superior with anything less than, say, 6 targets, but Mind Sear just barely edge past it at 6 or more. I'd also have Mind Sear damage have a chance to generate Shadow Orbs, so the more targets being hit by it, the more chances a Shadow Orb is generated. Even after the buff, it would take roughly 14 targets for Mind Sear's damage per second to break even with a single Devouring Plague.

Considering how strong Devouring Plague is, you should probably be casting Mind Blast on cooldown, regardless of which AoE rotation you're using.

[Jervaise]

I want to approach this from a different point of view.

Multi dotting adds that are gonna live for 15 seconds is not fun.

Mind searing everything you see is not fun either.

Shadow abilities lack insane amount of synergy. I would like to use one spell to trigger another that buffs another one. Maybe it shouldn't be that complicated, but I would love some sort of

cast swp on target, activate a 15 second cooldown ability called "psychic reverberate, a sinister infectious thought is attached to your mind blast ability, spreading a weaker copy of the pain on your target to all targets around", use mind blast

have weaker swps on all targets that do not trigger divine insight, do lesser damage.

So it would be, SWP, Psychic Reverberate, Mind Blast, Mind Sear


there you go, a satisfying, fair detailed and not a no brainer way to aoe.


How hard was this for me?

10 seconds.

[Mctriple]

Isn't Mind Sear getting a 25% buff in 5.1?

It was hotfix buffed by 25% on the 12th.

[Veyne]

I want to approach this from a different point of view.

Multi dotting adds that are gonna live for 15 seconds is not fun.

Mind searing everything you see is not fun either.

Shadow abilities lack insane amount of synergy. I would like to use one spell to trigger another that buffs another one. Maybe it shouldn't be that complicated, but I would love some sort of

cast swp on target, activate a 15 second cooldown ability called "psychic reverberate, a sinister infectious thought is attached to your mind blast ability, spreading a weaker copy of the pain on your target to all targets around", use mind blast

have weaker swps on all targets that do not trigger divine insight, do lesser damage.

So it would be, SWP, Psychic Reverberate, Mind Blast, Mind Sear


there you go, a satisfying, fair detailed and not a no brainer way to aoe.


How hard was this for me?

10 seconds.

Don't like it at all.

1) Spreading DoTs to all targets is a cop out. Plus it's a mechanic that already exists for another class, and it's a pretty iconic mechanic for that class.
2) Triggering an ability, then triggering another ability to accomplish one task is clunky as fuck. It's an unenjoyable mechanic for a Destruction Warlock (Fire and Brimstone) as it is.
3) This whole post has an attitude to it that's become popular in the WoW community. Everyone thinks they can design a better game. As you can see, you can't please everyone.

If I had it my way, and I really, really felt that Shadow needed more AoE, I'd set Devouring Plague up to deal damage equal to a 1x Shadow Orb Devouring Plague to nearby targets. But that's just me. No additional abilities to trigger, no additional mechanics to fuss with. Plague implies a widespread infection anyway.

[Jervaise]

Don't like it at all.

1) Spreading DoTs to all targets is a cop out. Plus it's a mechanic that already exists for another class, and it's a pretty iconic mechanic for that class.
2) Triggering an ability, then triggering another ability to accomplish one task is clunky as fuck. It's an unenjoyable mechanic for a Destruction Warlock (Fire and Brimstone) as it is.
3) This whole post has an attitude to it that's become popular in the WoW community. Everyone thinks they can design a better game. As you can see, you can't please everyone.

If I had it my way, and I really, really felt that Shadow needed more AoE, I'd set Devouring Plague up to deal damage equal to a 1x Shadow Orb Devouring Plague to nearby targets. But that's just me. No additional abilities to trigger, no additional mechanics to fuss with. Plague implies a widespread infection anyway.

that idea sucks


the whole point of the post is that,


there can be solutions to this situation. I'm not surprised you didn't get it at all,


the last sentence of the post says it all: 10 seconds is all that is needed to come up with an idea. A good idea can only be found when you throw infinitely many ideas on the table and evaluate them all.

This is the mentality that has overtaken players,

if the publisher isn't trying to do anything to overcome obvious playgrade issues, they think it is normal and stop acting like customers, and start acting like citizens.


Come up with more ideas,

everyone in the design team, every single player, every customer... including me.

It can be a bad idea, it can totally suck. The point is: Blizzard is not trying to do anything about it other than numbers balancing.

And our evidence is that: "Mind sear is not fun, multi dotting is. We'll only adjust numbers" post.


I hope it is clear.

[Veyne]

Words words words words and moar words

Ah, I see what you're getting at. I mistook your "10 seconds" comment as being able to come up with a better solution that quickly.