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  1. #161
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verain View Post
    And "pve" players don't get this stuff for free either. While enchanting mats DO drop in raids (as a consolation mostly once people stop needing gear), that's about the only thing. Raiding doesn't produce a steady stream of income, it's a GIANT gold sink, as raiders need all the same stuff a pvper needs, but also needs food, flasks, tons of potions, and much larger repairs.

    None of my raiders profit from raiding in gold. Never once in any tier! Raiders often have to slug through more tiers of fully enchanted gears than pvpers, as well.

    The point is, raiders get gold from doing stuff like:

    -> Farming Herbs
    -> Mining
    -> Skinning
    -> Clever combinations with tradeskill professions
    -> Playing the Auction House
    -> Farming mobs for materials

    None of these things are raiding. They are only barely "pve", by our definition at least, in that they are a time sink, and are a service to other players, exchanging time, moxie, and cleverness for an in-game resource that we can use to better our characters, which lets us do the content we want to do- which is raiding, but also pvp.

    So no, a pvp player who is running around in WoW is part of the same economy, and shouldn't get a free pass here. The fact that some of you think raiding is profitable in gold is pretty damned hilarious to begin with.
    I never said raiding was profitable, even though it actually is. It was easily possible to at least make 1 milion gold per player if you sold runs after having everything on farm in tier 12 and 13 (and even top 1000 guilds did this). PvP'ers doesn't have anything remotely comparable. It was removed when season 3 ended, and even less now that it requires wins to get conquest points. That is assuming you dont count in account sharing.
    However, if you compare casual BGing and arena playing with casual LFD/LFR, then it will quickly become obvious to you that casual LFD/LFR is far, far more profitable than casual BGing, and by the end of a tier you will have earned a positive net income by doing casual PvEing whereas if you PvP'ed the whole season you will have less gold than you started with.

    Case closed.

  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by Conor View Post
    You can easily make god between bgs anyway, however I do think there should be some small gold reward when you kill a player or get a killing blow, maybe 1-5 gold per killing blow, at least that would counteract the gold pve players get, and at the same time add more competition to the battleground. And make you want to be able to play better.

    However what you need I take into account is, pve players have repairs to pay for.
    So.. healers wont get anything then? :P And this will only make every BG a farm fest
    Norwegian and proud if it, not really. But I am. Too bad beer and tobaco is so damn expensive here.

  3. #163
    You know the community has gone to shit when people start complaining and arguing over making gold to PvP.

    "There are two types of guys in this world. Guys who sniff their fingers after scratching their balls, and dirty fucking liars." -StylesClashv3
    "Elo Hell is where the Ego is greater than the Elo." -Bystekhilcar

  4. #164
    [QUOTE=-Apathy-;18868683]

    Oh wait I get it you haven't seen or been in a top tier guild have you doing wipe after wipe after wipe struggling to finish the race, ~Points at Paragon's 500+ Wipes on Heroic Ragnaros how much total gold did they spend I wonder?

    I rest my case

    /QUOTE]

    Based on your Armory of both your toons you too have never been in a "Top Tier Raiding Guild" Watching those guilds on Youtube to try and learn a strat that you wipe on over and over because your guild blows does not make you "Hard Core or Top Tier" BTW to educate you on Paragon to be in paragon you have to come to the guild with atleast 250k gold. All of thier mats, enchants and everything you can think of are paid for bye the guild. They have an unlimited ammount of gold and get perks from the Dev Teams to allow them to be ammong the top ranked guilds in the world. Just this expansion they went from 25 man to a 10 man raiding guild.

    Now to turn this back to the actual topic of the thread. This expansion there is no Toll Barad, PVP bases quests or even mats you can buy from a vendor with pvp honor. I myself am not just a pvper I am a "Hard Core Raider in a Top Tier Guild" I spend most of my time raiding but I also have a 2500 MMR in 3v3 and RBGS. My guild pays for most everything I would ever need. I am lucky because as we all know during a new expansion the auction houses are very expensive for mats, enchants and gems. A person who just PVPs in pandas is kind of screwed because there is no true pvp outlet to earn gold. In comparison to the last 2 expansions where there was ample ways to earn hundreds in gold a week to offset the expenses of gearing up and lvling professions. You can not use your professions without access one of the following: Gold to purchase mats off the AH or Farming mats through doing pve related actions. Now if you were not lucky enough to have oodles of gold before the expansion hit you are looking at about 4k to lvl from 85-90. Being that you really need flying in order to get to the PVP vendor in pandaria (Another BIG F to the PVPers) You are looking at 2k of the 4k in order to get there. So that leaves you with 2k to spend on repairs gemming and gearing. That is if you were broke at the start. Good Luck gearing up on that budget. Just saying provide the pvpers with the same access to gold as the people who do PVE remember PVE is not just raiding. It encompasses the remainder of the entrire game such as questing, dungeons, challenges, farming, auction house. PVPers do have access to them but they will have to move into a lifestyle they are just not happy with doing.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by genmyster View Post
    Based on your Armory of both your toons you too have never been in a "Top Tier Raiding Guild" Watching those guilds on Youtube to try and learn a strat that you wipe on over and over because your guild blows does not make you "Hard Core or Top Tier" BTW to educate you on Paragon to be in paragon you have to come to the guild with atleast 250k gold. All of thier mats, enchants and everything you can think of are paid for bye the guild. They have an unlimited ammount of gold and get perks from the Dev Teams to allow them to be ammong the top ranked guilds in the world. Just this expansion they went from 25 man to a 10 man raiding guild.

    Now to turn this back to the actual topic of the thread. This expansion there is no Toll Barad, PVP bases quests or even mats you can buy from a vendor with pvp honor. I myself am not just a pvper I am a "Hard Core Raider in a Top Tier Guild" I spend most of my time raiding but I also have a 2500 MMR in 3v3 and RBGS. My guild pays for most everything I would ever need. I am lucky because as we all know during a new expansion the auction houses are very expensive for mats, enchants and gems. A person who just PVPs in pandas is kind of screwed because there is no true pvp outlet to earn gold. In comparison to the last 2 expansions where there was ample ways to earn hundreds in gold a week to offset the expenses of gearing up and lvling professions. You can not use your professions without access one of the following: Gold to purchase mats off the AH or Farming mats through doing pve related actions. Now if you were not lucky enough to have oodles of gold before the expansion hit you are looking at about 4k to lvl from 85-90. Being that you really need flying in order to get to the PVP vendor in pandaria (Another BIG F to the PVPers) You are looking at 2k of the 4k in order to get there. So that leaves you with 2k to spend on repairs gemming and gearing. That is if you were broke at the start. Good Luck gearing up on that budget. Just saying provide the pvpers with the same access to gold as the people who do PVE remember PVE is not just raiding. It encompasses the remainder of the entrire game such as questing, dungeons, challenges, farming, auction house. PVPers do have access to them but they will have to move into a lifestyle they are just not happy with doing.
    Questing in Tol Barad and Wintergrasp were both PvE things, and the rewards in Tol Barad were PvE items that were used in raids, not in PvP. How does this help the PvP'ers that want a PvP way of progression? It just seems like you're missing the point.

    Secondly, PvP'ers do not need that high of an income anyway, seeing actual Rated PvP does not take up the same upkeep that PvE does (Repairs/flasks/potions/food), so they don't need the same amount of income as someone who solely PvE's.

    Thirdly, if you want Gold, start working for it. Do you really think PvE'ers like to do the dailies? Fuck no, they're boring shit after the first time you do them. But they're forced to do it because there is no other way to get the best enchants or to spend your valor points. How would you like it to have to grind 5 reputations just to be able to buy your conquest items? Don't think you would enjoy it one bit.

    And that last argument you have about PvP'ers having to move into another lifestyle, please man, don't spew that kind of shit. You're making PvE'ers out to be the sort of person that gladly accepts daily quests / farming mats. The PvE'ers you're talking to at the moment are raiders. And I seriously think that they are in the same boat as PvP'ers in that they don't want to go and do dailies to get enough mats / gold to raid. They'd rather do something that's akin to raiding, not a dumb snoozefest fetch some bear asses and Hozen dung.

    This is coming from a PvP'er that also PvE's.
    Last edited by Pickwickman; 2012-11-16 at 09:07 PM.

  6. #166
    The Unstoppable Force Hysteria's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=genmyster;19099359]
    Quote Originally Posted by -Apathy- View Post

    Oh wait I get it you haven't seen or been in a top tier guild have you doing wipe after wipe after wipe struggling to finish the race, ~Points at Paragon's 500+ Wipes on Heroic Ragnaros how much total gold did they spend I wonder?

    I rest my case

    /QUOTE]

    Based on your Armory of both your toons you too have never been in a "Top Tier Raiding Guild" Watching those guilds on Youtube to try and learn a strat that you wipe on over and over because your guild blows does not make you "Hard Core or Top Tier" BTW to educate you on Paragon to be in paragon you have to come to the guild with atleast 250k gold. All of thier mats, enchants and everything you can think of are paid for bye the guild. They have an unlimited ammount of gold and get perks from the Dev Teams to allow them to be ammong the top ranked guilds in the world. Just this expansion they went from 25 man to a 10 man raiding guild.

    Now to turn this back to the actual topic of the thread. This expansion there is no Toll Barad, PVP bases quests or even mats you can buy from a vendor with pvp honor. I myself am not just a pvper I am a "Hard Core Raider in a Top Tier Guild" I spend most of my time raiding but I also have a 2500 MMR in 3v3 and RBGS. My guild pays for most everything I would ever need. I am lucky because as we all know during a new expansion the auction houses are very expensive for mats, enchants and gems. A person who just PVPs in pandas is kind of screwed because there is no true pvp outlet to earn gold. In comparison to the last 2 expansions where there was ample ways to earn hundreds in gold a week to offset the expenses of gearing up and lvling professions. You can not use your professions without access one of the following: Gold to purchase mats off the AH or Farming mats through doing pve related actions. Now if you were not lucky enough to have oodles of gold before the expansion hit you are looking at about 4k to lvl from 85-90. Being that you really need flying in order to get to the PVP vendor in pandaria (Another BIG F to the PVPers) You are looking at 2k of the 4k in order to get there. So that leaves you with 2k to spend on repairs gemming and gearing. That is if you were broke at the start. Good Luck gearing up on that budget. Just saying provide the pvpers with the same access to gold as the people who do PVE remember PVE is not just raiding. It encompasses the remainder of the entrire game such as questing, dungeons, challenges, farming, auction house. PVPers do have access to them but they will have to move into a lifestyle they are just not happy with doing.
    I'll bite for once in awhile, I may not have been in super super top tier guilds but I've been in respectful ones that I've gained enough feats from doing my entire raiding history to know the experience of wiping again and again and again and again compared to even you who registers on the site just to counter me how adorable and obnoxious at the same time sad isn't it?

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Funkthepunk View Post
    I never said raiding was profitable, even though it actually is. It was easily possible to at least make 1 milion gold per player if you sold runs after having everything on farm in tier 12 and 13 (and even top 1000 guilds did this). PvP'ers doesn't have anything remotely comparable. It was removed when season 3 ended, and even less now that it requires wins to get conquest points. That is assuming you dont count in account sharing.
    However, if you compare casual BGing and arena playing with casual LFD/LFR, then it will quickly become obvious to you that casual LFD/LFR is far, far more profitable than casual BGing, and by the end of a tier you will have earned a positive net income by doing casual PvEing whereas if you PvP'ed the whole season you will have less gold than you started with.

    Case closed.
    I would disagree. You're forgetting about potions / flasks / repairs. Although I know you meant "casual LFD/LFR" where you point a finger at people that rather not play at their max, but we're making comparisons between good players, not slackers. And if you account for just Flasks and Repairs I would really argue that the net gain that you're talking about would actually be a loss.

    [QUOTE=-Apathy-;19127091]
    Quote Originally Posted by genmyster View Post

    I'll bite for once in awhile, I may not have been in super super top tier guilds but I've been in respectful ones that I've gained enough feats from doing my entire raiding history to know the experience of wiping again and again and again and again compared to even you who registers on the site just to counter me how adorable and obnoxious at the same time sad isn't it?
    Ah damnit, I didn't see that it was a trollposter with only one postcount. Damnit wasted several minutes of my life typing a counterargument to an insignificant fool. :/

  8. #168
    Well if you mainly PvP, there really shouldn't be a need for gold. You do not get a ton of repair bill costs, the only thing you need gold for are enchants & gems. If you want gold as a PvP'er, do dailies, farm, or work the AH.

  9. #169
    I really don't get how people can be this stupid. Do you think PvErs get their money from PvE? I do both, PvP and PvE and all I do to get money is use my professions. Do you think a pure PvPer can't do the same? Are you saying that playing the ah and using your professions to make gold is a PvE thing? All I do is repost some auctions for 15 mins every day, spend 1 hour crafting and looking for cheap mats for like 2-3 hours once every week and I can easly keep a good income of gold. I don't think this concept is rocket science even for the average PvPer.

  10. #170
    Scarab Lord Thelxi's Avatar
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    Enchanting can help a lot making some gold with surplus honor. Should cover all expenses and even give some profit.

  11. #171
    Anyone who claims dailies are strictly PvE must try this out on a PvP realm.

    Suddenly, a lot more fun has to be had doing failies!

  12. #172
    PVP can be as lucrative as raiding to be honest, for a guild that is.
    RBG boosts are being sold all the time on my server by several guilds, there's endless demand for rating & achievements, no deadlines on mount drop rates like in raids etc. Buyer chooses rating he wants, pays gold and there you go.

    I don't really get why they are so frowned upon. Buying a PvP RBG carry is the same thing as buying mount run in heroic raid from on-farm guild, you don't earn it yourself but buy it with your gold.

  13. #173
    Daily s, farming and AH aren't really part of the pve content in the grand design even if it's technically pve.

    The thing is if you want to progress your character then you have to do instances or arena/(rated) bg

    Daily quest do often some sort of progress but it is such a slow progress that it hardly 't counts and often it isn't even enough.

    Also the reason why you don't get gold in strict pvp content is simple, you could probably do pvp for a year and don't really have to worry about money. Because whats the repair cost in pvp anyway? Can't be to much since the biggest culprit (getting killed by mobs) doesn't happen so at best you have to pay some gold for using your gear.

  14. #174
    they remove the ability to convert honor to trade mats?

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