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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Archaeon View Post
    I went raid finder for the first time this week on my warrior, and I think I can honestly say that Vaults is the worst raid in wow. I don't mean the fights, or tactics or whatever, but the overall theme and lore aspect.

    I mean... who are these clowns and why should I care? Where's the conflict? What am I doing there?

    I find it really weird that no one has pointed this out. I mean... I was bashing Dragon Soul for being stupid as hell, but I think this is just so... bland that it's just... I don't know. Even Crusaders' Coliseum was more interesting.
    I found the problem.

    Also the conflict was done in a questline in Kun-lai summit or w.e

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Archaeon View Post
    Hahaha... why are people getting so offended and defensive? I've been playing since vanilla 2005, so I have certain expectations as far as raid designs go. Vaults just doesn't cut it. I never said the fights are bad. The fights themselves seem fine as far as abilities and tactics and whatever. My issue is that the raid itself is pretty much 3 rooms involving some pretty boring bosses (again, not boring from a gameplay standpoint). After fighting such important warcraft characters in the past, I'm just not impressed by some dead mogu, a troll, a titan tech dragon and a bunch of stone soldiers. You guys are pretty quick to say I bought my account or powerleveled, but I actually remember the previous raids, and they were definitely way more epic than Mogu'shan Vaults.
    Six rooms, all different, plus connecting passages. Aside from that quibble, the rest of your points are completely subjective. Let's play a game to illustrate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Archaeon View Post
    Hahaha... why are people getting so offended and defensive? I've been playing since vanilla 2005, so I have certain expectations as far as raid designs go. Ulduar just doesn't cut it. I never said the fights are bad. The fights themselves seem fine as far as abilities and tactics and whatever. My issue is that the raid itself is pretty much 3 rooms involving some pretty boring bosses (again, not boring from a gameplay standpoint). After fighting such important warcraft characters in the past, I'm just not impressed by some robots, giants, dwarves(lol), a titan tech statue and a tentacle thing. You guys are pretty quick to say I bought my account or powerleveled, but I actually remember the previous raids, and they were definitely way more epic than Ulduar.

  3. #43
    Mogushan Vaults has been pretty awesome so far. It feels epic to me. No, not as epic as Black Temple or ICC, but damn, its an awesome raid. All the fights are very exciting and fun and I find the environment to be very epic. The mogu have a ton of lore behind them, not sure how you missed it.....but your ignorance is hardly a reason to say its a bad raid.

  4. #44
    It cant be worse than Dragon Soul, that shit was FOR SURE worst raid in wow history.
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  5. #45
    Warchief Szemere's Avatar
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    Only disappointing thing so far is some of the Raiders I had to do these Raids with, and Blizzard's "MUST GATE MOAR" attitude. Other than that, no problem, but we're totally back to ICC-style gating here, and I'm finding it dull... (I mean, you need to clear one instance before you can do the next, protecting the easily overwhelmed player that way, rite?)
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  6. #46
    Your arguments are all over the place. Your initial questions have been answered and you then switched to how it just doesn't impress you.

    "Titan tech dragon"? I take it that Algalon, a boss from Ulduar - one of the most (if not THE most) popular raids according to most raiders seemed like a glorified quest mob to you?

    "The Klaxxi... are doing their whole war thing." What the hell is that even supposed to mean? Couldn't think of a better sentence to make it look unimportant?

    Farming.... are they supposed to stop and starve to death? Not sure. If NPCs were supposed to act all serious because of some worldly threat, then there wouldn't have been any holiday events in WoW at any time either. (Brewfest, Hallow's End, etc.).

    Equating how easy a boss is in game (Sha of Anger) to its lore place/impact is dumb to say the least. Kinda like questioning how a mob like Vezax doesn't squash any tank with one stomp and how plate bikinis protect female toons.


    All I'm seeing is someone who doesn't like MoP or a specific part of it for some reason, and wants to paint everything else black because of it.

  7. #47
    I find Mogushan Vaults are no Ulduar or Karazhan, but they aren't ToC or Dragon Soul either. They are middle of the road, and since they are just the introductory raid for a tier encompassing 3 raids in total this is pretty much fine.

  8. #48
    Mogu'shan vaults isn't my favorite raid, but I like it.

    I like the feeling of exploring an ancient, highly guarded vault as a slight change of pace to 'storming the enemy's lair.' And we're getting that with Heart of Fear and Terrace of Endless Springs. Keep in mind that MS is really only 6/16 raid fights this tier. It's only the beginning.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Lokoz View Post
    Clearly OP doesnt read lore and waits for the NPC to say it out loud..
    Believe it or not, that's why the NPC's say stuff out loud . . . :-P

    All this TOC hate . . . I never understood it. I liked it and thought it was a good segway to ICC, just came too quickly before a lot of people were done with Ulduar and seemed tiny in comparison.

  10. #50
    im actually looking forward too heart of fear, since the mantid lore leading up too that has been far more clear then it was with MSV.
    well unless you skipped every quest text/dialogue in the dreadwastes ofcourse, but if you did that you have no right too complain about HoF lore :P

    now Terrace of Endless Spring is my personal lore wise biggest concern, i havent found any real information about it except it was mentioned a few times.
    i suspose the biggest thing is that is really close too wrathion. but thats all i got about it/

  11. #51
    Pit Lord Slavemaker's Avatar
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    The Mogu are using an ancient Titan structure as a weapon and they were also using part of titan technology to make an infinite number of Mogu for an endless army, we were there to stop that from happening and we did.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by jason1975 View Post
    Believe it or not, that's why the NPC's say stuff out loud . . . :-P

    All this TOC hate . . . I never understood it. I liked it and thought it was a good segway to ICC, just came too quickly before a lot of people were done with Ulduar and seemed tiny in comparison.
    The problem with TOC was it was a raid tier of 4 bosses in a box and then a fifth boss in the basement. The bosses themselves were fine imo, but it was a FIVE boss tier, the lack of content only bearable because there were four separate lockouts to work on. Maybe it would have gone over better if ICC had come out faster.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-26 at 06:38 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by felhunter View Post
    im actually looking forward too heart of fear, since the mantid lore leading up too that has been far more clear then it was with MSV.
    well unless you skipped every quest text/dialogue in the dreadwastes ofcourse, but if you did that you have no right too complain about HoF lore :P

    now Terrace of Endless Spring is my personal lore wise biggest concern, i havent found any real information about it except it was mentioned a few times.
    i suspose the biggest thing is that is really close too wrathion. but thats all i got about it/
    Well in MSV Cho narrates the whole thing and explains what's going on. If someone ignores him then that's their fault, though I can agree having a quest that sends you there could be interesting. But part of the charm is you DON'T know going into those vaults exactly what's locked inside. You don't even learn there's a weapon until after the second boss, and you don't find out exactly what it is until the 6th, the titan tech isn't found until the 5th. You get to discover it as you go along, and I like that.

    For the Terrace, since the story of HoF leads into Terrace, I assume we'll have something to go on, since we're chasing the Sha of Fear there after killing the Empress and it fleeing her body.

  13. #53
    Stood in the Fire Killaim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by felhunter View Post
    im actually looking forward too heart of fear, since the mantid lore leading up too that has been far more clear then it was with MSV.
    well unless you skipped every quest text/dialogue in the dreadwastes ofcourse, but if you did that you have no right too complain about HoF lore :P

    now Terrace of Endless Spring is my personal lore wise biggest concern, i havent found any real information about it except it was mentioned a few times.
    i suspose the biggest thing is that is really close too wrathion. but thats all i got about it/
    If I understand correctly, the Sha of Fear is influencing Gand Empress Shek'zeer and I guess(?) we will notice him in the fight. Then afterwards the Sha of Fear goes to the Terrace of Endless Springs and starts corrupting everything there, which we obviously have to put a stop to it. I just hope there will be a good story connection between HoF and ToES so it "makes sense that the Sha is there".

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Killaim View Post
    If I understand correctly, the Sha of Fear is influencing Gand Empress Shek'zeer and I guess(?) we will notice him in the fight. Then afterwards the Sha of Fear goes to the Terrace of Endless Springs and starts corrupting everything there, which we obviously have to put a stop to it. I just hope there will be a good story connection between HoF and ToES so it "makes sense that the Sha is there".
    I think it will be similar to the Sha of Hatred.

    In Shado-Pan Monastery, Taran Zhu is possessed by the Sha of Hatred. You fight him, and when he's defeated, the Sha flees his body, and you eventually chase it down in Townlong Steppes.

    We'll go in, kill the Mantid Empress, and the Sha will noticeably leave her body and flee to the Terrace. I'm sure blizzard will give us some sort of link there, especially since they're requiring you finish HoF to do ToES.

  15. #55
    Brewmaster Marston's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena View Post
    I think it will be similar to the Sha of Hatred.

    In Shado-Pan Monastery, Taran Zhu is possessed by the Sha of Hatred. You fight him, and when he's defeated, the Sha flees his body, and you eventually chase it down in Townlong Steppes.

    We'll go in, kill the Mantid Empress, and the Sha will noticeably leave her body and flee to the Terrace. I'm sure blizzard will give us some sort of link there, especially since they're requiring you finish HoF to do ToES.
    According to the WoWpedia NPC dialogue during the battle, the Sha of Fear basically tells her to fight the intruders (us) or he will kill her himself. He also leaves the body and tells us to come chase him if we dare.

  16. #56
    Well LFR isn't challenging at all but I find the normal/heroic raids quite fun and challenging, specially for tanks! Finally we get something fun to do like avoid damage in a different way (dance @last boss).

  17. #57
    The Lightbringer MasterHamster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archaeon View Post
    I went raid finder for the first time this week on my warrior, and I think I can honestly say that Vaults is the worst raid in wow.
    You haven't been around long huh?

    Why we're fighting the mogu, or the story of the vaults... read, and you'll find your answers.
    Last edited by MasterHamster; 2012-10-27 at 12:30 AM.
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  18. #58
    So you walked through the leveling process with your eyes closed to the story and firmly focussed on the XP bar. Then you come here to express your ignorance to the world at large. Grats OP.

  19. #59
    Brewmaster Raxxed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marston View Post
    According to the WoWpedia NPC dialogue during the battle, the Sha of Fear basically tells her to fight the intruders (us) or he will kill her himself. He also leaves the body and tells us to come chase him if we dare.
    When I saw that on beta I nearly pee'd myself. I don't want to spoil the visuals of the post-Shek'Zeer encounter, but holy moley.
    Everyone will enjoy killing Shek'zeer.
    Even just re-reading that now, my hair is standing on end.
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    Blizzard offered cardboard cut outs with poster pictures of bosses stapled on them upside down and sideways and many players now feel that is raiding.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by ganush View Post
    Do you think that may be a fault of RF and not of the actual instance design? When you queue up for something rather than travel there, go in and stomp through bosses without any resistance and spend an hour beating on loot pinatas with total strangers, how do you expect there to be a sense of story, goals, progress or accomplishment. Progressing through raids at a slower pace with friends gives you more time to think about why you're there and why you are fighting various bosses. LFR doesn't offer any of this, it's basically get in, collect loot, get out.
    This is ridiculously incorrect. LFR has nothing to do with what the OP is talking about. Paying even the most minimum amount of attention while leveling to 90 gives you an idea of what it is and why you're there.

    It has nothing to do with LFR, loot pinatas, or anything of the sort. Wiping to a boss several more times or even hundreds more times in heroic will not give you more of a sense of why you are there and what you are trying to accomplish it will only give you better loot.

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