So alliance win the war?

[Frontenac]

I do not doubt Varian needs lore, in fact I'm very happy that he's receiving the story he's getting - that of a good uniting leader. But there is space for more character development and there is need of non-human development. If he's supposed to be uniting the Alliance then it should be just limited to Tyrande being told that she made a boo boo about her battle tactics.

No I'd like to see Velen show up with Anduin. I'd like to see Muradin leading a Dwarf Brigade with his brother Brann as they discover further titan artifacts. I'd like to see Mekkatorque show up with a bad ass robot and blow the Horde to bits and show that his people can do more directly in the conflict. I want to see Genn being more involved with Varian as the two people and races clicked with each other at the end of Wolfheart.

Varian getting development is great. But it shouldn't be all about him, especially if his story is meant to directly involve him getting support from the other leaders.

(Sorry if it sounds like I'm bashing the Alliance story, I'm really not. There are just some annoying flaws atm that are preventing a good story from being a great story)

Like I said, this expansion is young and we're only at the first patch. I agree with you on that point : I would like to see all Alliance races get their time in the light in future patches. Especially Night Elves, since they are the biggest force for the Alliance in Kalimdor and that most of the Horde is on that continent (ok, I admit I also love Night Elf lore). However, if they want to show the Alliance as a unified force (considering what Wrathion says about the Alliance), they must first show Varian's qualities as a unifying leader, leading several nations to reach a common goal.

So far, I think this expansion is full of promises for good story developpement.

[Scummer]

I think my personal dream leader to see some attention in MoP is Genn and ofc the Worgen.

Of all the races who suffered during the aftermath of the Cataclysm due to the Horde it was the Gilneans who suffered the most. Heck because of the Horde they lost their home, of which is still being fought over. They really should be there in the fight trying to enact some sort of vengeance for the Horde's actions.
Then in Wolfheart with have Varian basically proclaim them as the Alliance's elite fighting force and becoming buddy buddy with Genn and his people again.
Also they did kinda get left out in Cata after their 1-12 zone.

[Deleted]

Yes, alliance wins.

[Scummer]

Both factions win. By the time the Siege of Orgrimmar occurs both the rebelling Horde and Alliance are on good terms with each other and are effectively on the same side. Neither side at that point are fighting each other and are there to resolve the problem that is Garrosh.

I don't mind this although I would appreciate some sort of obvious Alliance victory somewhere in near future. Most importantly though I'd also/instead like to see the Horde actually give some sort of official recount of their actions to the Alliance and some sort of repayment in land that was taken, as they did start a war and kill hundreds if not thousands of Alliance.

[Brandon123]

tHIERS NO WInners, we all just have fun

[Skizzit]

Patch 5.1 Spoilers:

If you look at the speeches Wrathion gives the Alliance and Horde players in 5.1, there is an obvious distinction. He makes the both of telling the Alliance players they will have to band together behind Varian in order to achieve victory where as he tells the Horde players that you (the player) are the soul of the Horde and your actions will define your people.

The Alliance is a much more clearly defined group then the Horde. The Alliance has a clear leadership and hierarchy. The Horde follows the Warchief really only because that was Thrall's title and he brought all the races of the Horde together. Each Horde race is more independent then each of the Alliance races. Taking out the Warchief of the Horde would be a major blow, but the Horde would still exist because it is the various races of the Horde that are the real power. They would not dissolve because Garrosh is dead, especially if Thrall comes back in some manner. Even if he does not take the mantle of Warchief again, whoever he puts his support behind will have the full support of the Horde.

No one "wins" in wars.

"A strange game. The only winning movie is not to play."

Am I right?

[Deleted]

Please keep in mind that the "horde" that was during war 1-2 is not the same "horde" that is in this war.

And no from what i can see, the war will end up being kinda even.

[Chrysia]

The difference between what the Alliance is achieving, and what the Allies achieved during WWII, is the Alliance is not destroying the Horde's ability to wage war. When the Nazi's were overthrown, there was no authority to immediately take the party's place. The Horde has a plethora of valid choices to replace Garrosh and continue persecuting the war for their survival.

[Immitis]

the alliance wins the pandaren expedition. no one wins the war.

[EyelessCrow]

What wars exactly has the alliance/horde lost/won against each-other. Together they have beaten the big bads of expansions but the war has always been going on, I think you are confusing winning/losing wars with winning/losing battles.

[Dristereau]

The main issue most people had with Cataclysm to do with lore was that in nearly every battle between the Horde and Alliance the Alliance always were retreating or loosing land. Even Alliance territory like Westfall ends up being lost again to the Defias and Thermaplugg, Dwarven Council, Tyrande, Varian and Greymane have no involvement beyond level 14. For Horde they push territories, have internal conflicts, have Garrosh venture around and show tension with Vol'jin and Sylvanas and advance the characters. Also Thrall (despite being labelled neutral) is a major character and central to the Horde who plays a very central role in the Patches and Cataclysm Content.

With MoP so far up to 5.1 we see Thrall, Garrosh, Vol'jin, Lor'thermar, Varian, Tyrande, Jaina and Anduin all in action. It seems much more balanced with advancements for both sides in relatively equal terms of advancement. Hopefully this trend will continue in patches.

[Deleted]

Actually both Horde and Alliance win in the end, as Garrosh is basically no longer part of the actual Horde, though he undoubtedly thinks he is.

[Deleted]

What wars exactly has the alliance/horde lost/won against each-other. Together they have beaten the big bads of expansions but the war has always been going on, I think you are confusing winning/losing wars with winning/losing battles.

The Horde lost the Second War against the Alliance.

Now that I think about it, the Horde never won a war against the Alliance.

[Durandro]

The Horde lost the Second War against the Alliance.

Now that I think about it, the Horde never won a war against the Alliance.

First war.

Next.

[steveyboy]

Actually both Horde and Alliance win in the end, as Garrosh is basically no longer part of the actual Horde, though he undoubtedly thinks he is.

No garrosh is a loss.

You people just don't like good characters.

[Deleted]

The Horde lost the Second War against the Alliance.

Now that I think about it, the Horde never won a war against the Alliance.

Actually they did win the First War, by laying waste to Stormwind and killing King Llane (props to Garona on the latter).

[Deleted]

Actually they did win the First War, by laying waste to Stormwind and killing King Llane (props to Garona on the latter).

Against the Alliance, by the time of the Fall of Stormwind, there was no Alliance.

[Florena]

Bringing Garrosh to justice will be a victory for the Alliance. But not really one against the 'horde.'

[ShadowJester]

Lets be honest, the alliance win the war. We all know that warcraft leads to starcraft and there are no orcs in starcraft. Only humans. and maybe draenei if you want to believe that Protoss are evolved from them. So BE WARY ALLIANCE at some point the humans will betray and murder you. Just like they did with the Horde. DUN DUN DUH. Also silithids become the zerg if you were wondering

[jonte912]

kinda lame how now that warcraft is an mmo that no side will ever win, the only thing we'll get is a truce