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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Dcruize View Post
    Why? If you're new to PVP you're unlikely to face anyone with T2 weapons cause of MMR - on the off chance that you do (boosting etc) you wouldn't stand a chance of winning anyway so it doesn't matter what gear they have. WoW PVP is very beginner friendly - MMR is a great way of putting beginners into matches that they stand some chance of winning.

    On topic, hell no - the concept of PVP stats is fine. I don't want to have to PVE at all and making the gear comparable would force me to raid so I could gear up quicker. I'd sooner wowquit than PVE, it was bad enough farming weapons for the start of the season.
    The concept of pvp stats may be fine, but their implementation is flawed. Resil does almost nothing, and pvp power has made healers damn near unkillable.

    I agree, also, you should not need to pve to get gear for pvp. However, I'd be inclined to say that there is no more or less accessibility to someone wanting to break into the pvp scene as there was before pvp power and the like. And the game at current is very imbalanced, which is even more likely to turn away someone new to pvp after they get globaled a few times or sit through 10-15 seconds of CC every fight. This game is not new player friendly for pvp, and gear, at this point, does nothing to help that.

    The thing is, if pvpers truly cared about balance, then they would be clamoring for NO gear for pvp, just throw everyone on the same playing field a la challenge modes. Rewards can be transmog sets, mounts, trade goods, what have you. Putting everyone on the same playing field would make it all about skill (or whos class is more OP, of course, but that's imbalance problems and this talk is about pvp gear). I can really only see backlash being from people who LIKE being ahead of people, not through skill, but through gear.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Redlikemyrage View Post
    The concept of pvp stats may be fine, but their implementation is flawed. Resil does almost nothing, and pvp power has made healers damn near unkillable.
    Healers are not unkillable unless you are talking about Random BGs with a decked out healer vs garbage undergeared players, healers die all the time in Arena and RBGs. Furthermore PvP Power also has nothing to do with healers being "unkillable" since all healing specs are currently having stronger heals with Int, not PvP Power. It takes about 28k Spell Power for PvP Power to start being more beneficial than Int. There are always complaints, from bad players I might add, about healers being unkillable and it has historically been wrong a lot more than it has been right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redlikemyrage View Post
    The thing is, if pvpers truly cared about balance, then they would be clamoring for NO gear for pvp, just throw everyone on the same playing field a la challenge modes. Rewards can be transmog sets, mounts, trade goods, what have you. Putting everyone on the same playing field would make it all about skill (or whos class is more OP, of course, but that's imbalance problems and this talk is about pvp gear). I can really only see backlash being from people who LIKE being ahead of people, not through skill, but through gear.
    This is a bogus statement, the game is still an MMO and gearing up is a part of that. That does not mean that PvPers do not care about balance. There is an Arena Pass for exactly what you are talking about and it is separate from the live realms, as it should be.

    The current problems with the game have everything to do with certain mechanics and nothing to do with gear. A 15% (or whatever number) cut across the board would not fix anything. Doing a cut like that would fix 4 specs while making the other 30 specs not able to compete, essentially leaving everything the same but with lower numbers. What needs to change are mechanics and certain abilities, once those are fixed everything will be fine.

  3. #103
    If the implementation is flawed, it can be fixed without having to remove a massive aspect of the game (the grind for gear).
    Stormscale Horde EU | http://lastrogue.com

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Redlikemyrage View Post
    The thing is, if pvpers truly cared about balance, then they would be clamoring for NO gear for pvp, just throw everyone on the same playing field a la challenge modes. Rewards can be transmog sets, mounts, trade goods, what have you. Putting everyone on the same playing field would make it all about skill (or whos class is more OP, of course, but that's imbalance problems and this talk is about pvp gear). I can really only see backlash being from people who LIKE being ahead of people, not through skill, but through gear.

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaozu View Post
    I have already stepped it up and am already raiding, but the fact is that Malovent is nearly identical in strength to normal raiding gear (only 6 item level difference) and has two additional stats on top of that. PvE gear is a little bit stronger than PvP gear in PvE, but PvP gear is a LOT stronger than PvE gear in PvP. That difference there, is the problem. You want them to be separated and good on their own field? Sure, no problem, for as long as it's the same on both fronts, which it currently isn't.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-28 at 08:43 AM ----------


    It is bullshit, because reversing the situation is not fixing it.
    Getting a headache by your posts. -.-

    Do you even realize that you compared blue dungeon gear(not even 5 man hc) with honor gear?

    Do you realize that raids after mogu vaults have in general higher itemlvls?

    Do you realize heroic raids that the itmlvls should be compared to conquest point gear and not normal raid ones?

    Do people here realize the difference of RBG and ARENA and that healers are a major issue in RBGs, where they have cummulative healing and more cc support and BURST is rather an issue in Arenas, only?

    While i sometimes think it would make it easier to just remove pvp power and pvp resilence, it would just forcing ppl to do pve again for the best items in pvp, especially considering trinkets and weapon.

    I like the solution in mop AS IS.

    Deal with it.
    Last edited by Tyrannica; 2012-10-29 at 11:19 AM.

  6. #106
    Just another point about this PvP gear vs PvE gear stats nonsense:

    The absolute best PvP gear is only comparable to MSV LFR level gear. I don't see the issue. If you're 2200+ rated in PvP, I think it's acceptable that your gear should be at least comparable to the items slobbering retards can obtain while afk in an LFR raid.

    Second, the tier bonuses on LFR gear far outweigh anything the PvP gear can offer.

    Third, most PvP gear is not statted at all to be usable in a full set in PvE. Wearing a full set of Malevolent Gladiator's armour (Boots, Pants, Gloves, Chest, Shoulders, Helm, Belt, Wrists) will give you around 950 Hit and 950 Expertise. That means you're going to have to pour roughly 3200 worth of secondary stats into nothing but Hit and Expertise to meet raid caps. That means almost every other item you use will either have Expertise/Hit on, or be reforged for it and will severely limit what items will be usable with the PvP gear.

    As noted, the *best* PvP gear in the game will get you below entry level raid dps. The setup is fine and the PvP gear having two extra stats - Resi/Power means nothing compared to PvE items.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madus View Post
    Very funny.. Not.. You're a moron. They already implemented this with the tournament realms, the only difference is that it costs money to participate. It wouldn't hurt any player if they implemented a specific gear set for arena and RBGs, just like the TR, of course being zone restricted.
    Of course if you would rather just do your mindless daily quest farming, then by all means go ahead, but it shouldn't restrict a widespread game as WoW, just because one aspect of it is all about grinding.
    Last edited by Funkthepunk; 2012-10-29 at 03:49 PM.

  8. #108
    You are moron too if you think that all pvp players dont like to grind pvp gear.
    If you dont like grind pvp gear you can go tournament realms they implemented it for people like you.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Madus View Post
    You are moron too if you think that all pvp players dont like to grind pvp gear.
    If you dont like grind pvp gear you can go tournament realms they implemented it for people like you.
    Lol what? I certainly didn't enjoy the grind for my gear, and neither did any of my friends. It's just a necessary evil and basically just an entry fee paid in time put in to grinding out bgs. A bg here and there with friends is great, but sitting in them for 3-4 days nonstop to get yourself a set of gear while dealing with people who have no idea how to stand next to a flag is not.

    I prefer it as it is, where you have to earn your stripes instead of walking up to a vendor and being handed a set of pvp gear for no effort whatsoever. You can already do that to a lesser extent with the crafted pvp set.

  10. #110
    What kind of conquest cap you have when you need 4 days nonstop grind ? Or you mean honor aka afk farm gear, bcs farming that is like farming hc dungeon gear... read: irelevant

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madus View Post
    You are moron too if you think that all pvp players dont like to grind pvp gear.
    If you dont like grind pvp gear you can go tournament realms they implemented it for people like you.
    So you have realised that all parts about WoW is not about grinding? Ok, great. Then keep your silly memes away from this forum, as it is obviously not allowed.
    Second of all I never said that everyone wants to play competetively in arena, or that every player doesn't enjoy the grind aspect of the current honor farm, or the artificial gating and weekly restriction for the conquest gear farming. That is why we have the tournament realm. For players like me.
    Last edited by Funkthepunk; 2012-10-29 at 03:54 PM.

  12. #112
    Ok go play competetively on tournament realm where you can play parts of WOW without grinding and gl in competetive game called wow.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmmmmmmBacon View Post
    Lol what? I certainly didn't enjoy the grind for my gear, and neither did any of my friends. It's just a necessary evil and basically just an entry fee paid in time put in to grinding out bgs. A bg here and there with friends is great, but sitting in them for 3-4 days nonstop to get yourself a set of gear while dealing with people who have no idea how to stand next to a flag is not.
    You must be new to the MMO Genre.

  14. #114
    Tbh that would be bloody retarded... Who would want to do pve to get pvp gear? and visa versa... TBH this is not a good suggestion.
    Rather tweak pvp power / pvp resilience to a prober level. Currently PVP power is the best stat, aka it needs nerf... Which it will i think.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Embodier View Post
    You must be new to the MMO Genre.
    Look at you trying to be cute, thinking he's a mmo superstar.

    After playing the same battlegrounds for 7 years, and going through a grueling 3 months to get rank 13, it begins to become taxing to find enjoyment from them.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by mmmmmmmBacon View Post
    Look at you trying to be cute, thinking he's a mmo superstar.

    After playing the same battlegrounds for 7 years, and going through a grueling 3 months to get rank 13, it begins to become taxing to find enjoyment from them.
    Stop playing then?

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Baphomette View Post
    The new system is the best they've ever come up with:

    * PVP gear is lower ilvl than its PVE equivalent, making PVE gear BiS for PVE
    * Resilience and Power are there so PVP gear is BiS for PVP
    * Resilience and Power not being part of the item budget means "ilvl = DPS"
    I heartily agree with this.

    The amounts of pvp power and resilience can be scaled differently. If the current gaps between ungeared vs. honor or honor vs. conquest are too large, then adjust the amounts of pvp power and resilience. But the actual system is as (if not more) elegant then anything they've had before.

  18. #118
    nothing wrong with the gear at all its the best its ever been.

    and removing pvp power from heals is beyond dumb, classes like ele/moonkin/spriest etc relying on heals...ele the most due to lack of abilities to stop damage, gets weaker and weaker heals eventually "pures" like warlocks massively outheal a hybrid....oh wait they do already.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmmmmmmBacon View Post
    Look at you trying to be cute, thinking he's a mmo superstar.

    After playing the same battlegrounds for 7 years, and going through a grueling 3 months to get rank 13, it begins to become taxing to find enjoyment from them.
    This makes your rant hilarious, actually. Then you should just quit I guess?

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by Suizid View Post
    Stop playing then?
    Like I said,

    Quote Originally Posted by mmmmmmmBacon View Post
    It's just a necessary evil and basically just an entry fee paid in time put in to grinding out bgs.

    I prefer it as it is, where you have to earn your stripes instead of walking up to a vendor and being handed a set of pvp gear for no effort whatsoever. You can already do that to a lesser extent with the crafted pvp set.
    it's not the end of the world for me, it's just an entry fee to have the best gear in a pvp setting. Crying about having to do bgs to get gear to effectively compete in arena/rbgs would be like someone wearing questing greens crying about needing to do heroics/LFR before having the gear to go into normal mode raids.

    It doesn't mean that grinding bgs are anymore enjoyable though.

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