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  1. #1

    How can I improve in PvP? (Vids Included!)

    Hey guys

    So im pretty bad at arena, but its all i like about wow and i badly want to get good.

    I play 2v2 with a balance druid as a destro lock.

    I cant get above 1300 rating : l and i know its because im playing wrong.

    I will be uploading a series of vids in the hope that people can offer me tips to improve and hopefully i will see some progression.

    My current thought are respeccing and learning demonology based of my experiences.

    My armoury is here: http://eu.battle.net...outxuk/advanced

    And my team mates: http://eu.battle.net...shface/advanced

    Is all this fine?

    And now below are the vids done today when playing to get to my cap of 1350, i have more i will upload tomorrow. Theres no sound as i didnt want to record my system music playing! (we had skype on and i will record that when i get time to set it all up!)

    So here are the games!











    Thanks for any time and help / tips so i can atleast work toward 1500!

    edit: New games uploaded!



    Last edited by infernouk; 2012-11-01 at 12:46 PM.

  2. #2
    Having watched the first 2 videos, i've a couple of things to note;

    Havoc
    Your usage of Fear
    Curse of Enfeeblement
    Immolate

    --

    Havoc, I never see you use it, use it to double up on your chaosbolts, or to generate more embers by cleaving fel-flame (if on the move) or incinerate.

    As you're using Blood Fear, you'll want to be using it off cooldowns (almost anyway) either to alleviate pressure, or to CC the healer, in your 2nd video, you rarely used it on the druid. Infact there was more than a 30sec period you went without casting it at all.

    Curse of Enfeeblement is never used, this is strange as it effectively reduces enemy caster DPS by 30% and also enemy melee damage by 20% (up to).

    Immolate, you're spending FOREVER casting this pointless spell, spend the time using incinerates, or refresh is with fel flame.
    Magnificence personified

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by qu1rex View Post
    Having watched the first 2 videos, i've a couple of things to note;

    Havoc
    Your usage of Fear
    Curse of Enfeeblement
    Immolate

    --

    Havoc, I never see you use it, use it to double up on your chaosbolts, or to generate more embers by cleaving fel-flame (if on the move) or incinerate.

    As you're using Blood Fear, you'll want to be using it off cooldowns (almost anyway) either to alleviate pressure, or to CC the healer, in your 2nd video, you rarely used it on the druid. Infact there was more than a 30sec period you went without casting it at all.

    Curse of Enfeeblement is never used, this is strange as it effectively reduces enemy caster DPS by 30% and also enemy melee damage by 20% (up to).

    Immolate, you're spending FOREVER casting this pointless spell, spend the time using incinerates, or refresh is with fel flame.
    all valid points, though generally i do us fear on CD, could it have been due to DR or the druid having CC up?

    Havoc i never use as im not quick enough at assigning it to 1 enemy while casting and trinketing.

    Enfeeblement is something i need to use, should i just throw it up on both as an opener?

    So dont ever cast immolate? only ever incinerate or shadow bolt when i get time?

  4. #4
    keep immolate up but refresh it with fel flame
    I play many games. WoW, Rift, D3, PoE, SC2 I will not criticize your game choice if you don't mine.

  5. #5
    Destruction's GCD is so short, you can use Enfeeblement whenever possible, at the start of the fight, after a spellcast, while moving etc.

    As for havoc, just using it would be a game-changer for you, knowing how to use it well comes with practice (i.e. putting it on a warrior and executing his skull banner with shadowburn)

    Immolate, you should only refresh with Felflame or if you have low mana and arent being focused, just hardcast it.

    As for the fear comment, I saw your fear icon on your toolbars, it hadn't been cast, that's all. Perhaps you thought you cast it but hadn't? Check the 2nd video you'll see what I mean.

    In addition, pay attention to when you use shadowfury, don't use it randomly, don't use it during DK ams or his stun immune CD, also don't use fear during ams or lichborne, you'll want to either just try to escape/tank his damage, or nuke through it.

    One more thing, do not ever use chaosbolt at the start of the encounter when you have only one ember, you'll leave yourself out of choices for doing something else, always build embers before burning them out, never empty yourself at the start hoping for a quick win... You're not a warrior or bm hunter.
    Magnificence personified

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by qu1rex View Post
    Destruction's GCD is so short, you can use Enfeeblement whenever possible, at the start of the fight, after a spellcast, while moving etc.

    As for havoc, just using it would be a game-changer for you, knowing how to use it well comes with practice (i.e. putting it on a warrior and executing his skull banner with shadowburn)

    Immolate, you should only refresh with Felflame or if you have low mana and arent being focused, just hardcast it.

    As for the fear comment, I saw your fear icon on your toolbars, it hadn't been cast, that's all. Perhaps you thought you cast it but hadn't? Check the 2nd video you'll see what I mean.

    In addition, pay attention to when you use shadowfury, don't use it randomly, don't use it during DK ams or his stun immune CD, also don't use fear during ams or lichborne, you'll want to either just try to escape/tank his damage, or nuke through it.

    One more thing, do not ever use chaosbolt at the start of the encounter when you have only one ember, you'll leave yourself out of choices for doing something else, always build embers before burning them out, never empty yourself at the start hoping for a quick win... You're not a warrior or bm hunter.
    again all fair points, its like it all makes sense reading it but i cant execute it!

    So...

    Enfeebelment ALL THE TIME

    Learn to use havoc (is there a macro where i can havoc arena 2 whilst i am still targeting arena 1?

    Never hardcast immolate, use fel flame more (if immolate falls off due to forgetting do i hard cast it again or just leave it off?)

    Im sure there must of been a reason for not using fear then, i always make sure im using it, my bad if im wrong.

    Im not very good at knowing other classes so dont know what lichbourne looks like, or warrior stuff, i generally only realise when i get an 'immune' message or something...

    With chaos bolt i often use it at the start to try and get pressure on someone, its worked a lot recently thought it can go horribly wrong!

  7. #7
    You're going to have massive problems if you can't relate to your opponents cooldowns, I dont have an addon to warn me of such things but i'm certain they exist - Get one!

    I also don't use a macro for Havoc, but if you scour the forums you'll find ones for Focus Targets.

    You should be using Felflame almost entirely if you are the nuke target, try to gain distance while spamming it. It eats your mana, but... well that's just how it is.

    Yes, enfeeblement all the time, 5% dmg from elements is negligible.

    Do not be afraid to use your darksoul/trinket with havoc and using incinerate then 2x conflagrates, it's much easier to pull off and it will put massive pressure on the enemy team without leaving you empty for embers.

    It'll also allow you to snipe a shadowburn if you're luck and your incinerate&2xconflags all crit.

    I would advise opening with havoc, incinerate into 2x conflags, fearing one of your enemies and chaos'ing or shadowburning the other teammate, this will force a trinket/cooldown at the start of the game, which will definitely be in your favour.

    Use shadowfury to interrupt or to alleviate pressure, it can also be used to open a cast window for chaosbolt, though your druid friend should be able to help in that regard (Typhoon/Ursol's Vortex/Bash/Disorient Roar/Roots/Solar Beam) etc.




    As far as your usage of fear, go to Video #3, skip 1 minute into the fight where you're nuking the Balance druid and you get him relatively low.

    The resto druid uses his pvp trinket and you haven't used fear, in fact you don't use fear for another 20 or 30seconds.

    Had you reacted to his trinket and feared him, you'd have killed the balance druid or at least forced him to pop all cooldowns.
    Last edited by qu1rex; 2012-10-31 at 11:57 PM.
    Magnificence personified

  8. #8
    Like other people mentioned, you cast too much unncesary Immolates while there's still an Immolate on target, using CDs with only 1 ember. You also trinket extremely slow or you decide way too late to trinket...

    Also, reforging everything to crit like you did is wrong, you get maybe 1,5% crit chance by reforging everything to crit... Same for haste, reforging everything on haste won't get you more than 2% wich is pointless... Reforge into mastery regardless of spec, after you get hit capped.

    Anyway, the easiest way to improve in WoW PvP regardless of class, is to understand every single class/spec ingame, their mechanics, abilities, etc, and to key bind every single ability, or at least important ones in the beggining and get used with them.

  9. #9
    In PvP it is important to know the enemy and to have a good overview to be able to react to their actions. By watching your vids I had the impression that you lose a lot of time targeting the enemies.

    In 2v2 you have only 2 opponents which makes it easier to watch their actions. I would recommend you to start using Focus target. You set one enemy to your focus target and target the other that you try to kill.
    Having a focus target allows you to quickly CC it. For this you can use focus macros, which will cast whatever spell you want to the focus target without losing your current target. To start with, I would create a macro for you CC abilities with the following line:
    Code:
    /cast [target=focus] Fear
    replace Fear with whatever CC you want to be able to cast on the focus target.

    It is a nice way to get fast CCs. You DON'T want every spell to be castable on the focus target, you would need too many key bindings for that. Usually CCs are enough, this includes counter spell (Spell Lock). You should be capable of interrupting for instance the healers cast, for this you don't have time to switch to the target and use your spell lock.
    You will see very soon that it is extremely nice to watch casters, because you see whenever they cast something, but it also helps on melee targets to fear them.

    Another possibility would be to use arena1 or arena2 macros, but for the beginning you should stick to the focus target.

    EDIT: You have to set the focus target with /focus or by right clicking on the arena frame, in your case gladius if you didn't change this option in the config of gladius.
    Last edited by sshika; 2012-11-01 at 02:13 AM.

  10. #10
    thanks guys ill write all this down and practice it today in my games, is it really mastery over crit? i thought that was decided against on arena junkies?

    ill work on setting focus and being more away of trinkets vs fears as well!

    Any more advice guys?

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by infernouk View Post
    thanks guys ill write all this down and practice it today in my games, is it really mastery over crit? i thought that was decided against on arena junkies?

    ill work on setting focus and being more away of trinkets vs fears as well!

    Any more advice guys?
    Yes, it is, by far. See the armory of some really high rated Warlocks, or you can just test it yourself. Warlock mastery means damage, unlike other class mastery where there's procs, or other stuff... The amount needed for 1% mastery is insanely lower than for haste/crit, therfor, instead of getting 1-2% crit or haste by reforging, you can easily get around 10% mastery.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bogdan View Post
    Yes, it is, by far. See the armory of some really high rated Warlocks, or you can just test it yourself. Warlock mastery means damage, unlike other class mastery where there's procs, or other stuff... The amount needed for 1% mastery is insanely lower than for haste/crit, therfor, instead of getting 1-2% crit or haste by reforging, you can easily get around 10% mastery.
    ok thanks ill reforge, i have 2 more games ill put up now and will cap some tonight with changes advised here made.

    How is demonology in 2v2? i was thinking of trying it out

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-01 at 12:46 PM ----------

    2 new games added to the OP!!!!!

  13. #13
    your comp is pretty terrible specially in an unbalanced bracket like 2v2. Don't expect to get very high.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by alemaite View Post
    your comp is pretty terrible specially in an unbalanced bracket like 2v2. Don't expect to get very high.
    warlock and druid is meant to be a good come from everything ive seen, my servers dead anyway so my only other easy choice is a pve geared BM hunter... please be more constructive...

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by infernouk View Post
    warlock and druid is meant to be a good come from everything ive seen, my servers dead anyway so my only other easy choice is a pve geared BM hunter... please be more constructive...
    There is nothing more constructive than telling you no matter how well you play you're just going to lose a lot once you get higher because of 2v2 and your comp. If you're really serious about getting higher rating then consider a server transfer if there is nobody on your dead server however if you just want to be the best warlock playing boomking/lock go right ahead.

    To give you an idea though as a warrior I win 1v2 games quite often on that rating and as soon as you face things like BM/Warrior you're just going to get stomped and it will have nothing to do with skill.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by alemaite View Post
    There is nothing more constructive than telling you no matter how well you play you're just going to lose a lot once you get higher because of 2v2 and your comp. If you're really serious about getting higher rating then consider a server transfer if there is nobody on your dead server however if you just want to be the best warlock playing boomking/lock go right ahead.

    To give you an idea though as a warrior I win 1v2 games quite often on that rating and as soon as you face things like BM/Warrior you're just going to get stomped and it will have nothing to do with skill.
    yea i understand the comp isnt ideal but thats something i would worry about when i am playing to the best of my ability, when i do all i can then loose due to the comp then id consider changing it up, i thought druid was meant to be an ok partner? what else would i use? spriest?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by infernouk View Post
    yea i understand the comp isnt ideal but thats something i would worry about when i am playing to the best of my ability, when i do all i can then loose due to the comp then id consider changing it up, i thought druid was meant to be an ok partner? what else would i use? spriest?
    There is no point learning how to play Boomking/Lock if it's not something you want to play later on. You play completely different depending on your comp and if your intention is to play 3v3 later on that is COMPLETELY different from 2v2, spec, glyphs, how you react, just everything.

    It's a noble thought that you want to get better before playing with other people more seriously but honestly I just don't think it's possible to learn how to play Lock/Mage or 3s by playing Boomkin/Lock. Sure little things like keeping your dots up to pressure or LoS players but you will learn so much faster if you just play the comp you really want to play.

  18. #18
    /cast [nomod] Havoc
    /cast [mod:shift,target=focus] Havoc
    /cast [mod:ctrl,target=mouseover] Havor

    You can put whatever you want in the mod binds, but those are the ones I use. You can also remove the mod options and do separate macros for each, but that's a waste of space and not very productive in my opinion.
    Melee vs caster balance in WoD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9F0Ehgx_Q8

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by infernouk View Post
    ok thanks ill reforge, i have 2 more games ill put up now and will cap some tonight with changes advised here made.

    How is demonology in 2v2? i was thinking of trying it out

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-01 at 12:46 PM ----------

    2 new games added to the OP!!!!!
    Another thing I noticed, if you're playing with a druid, why aren't you using Rejuv? You never use it.

    Tell your druid to play Resto and you may have a chance on getting much higher rating, but as other mentioned, the comp is awful.

    I personally really like Demo, Demo's burst is really dumb, you can actually compare it to Warrior burst... But the damage outside of CDs is rather low, you got no real PvP fillers to use and do decent damage... It's a little more complicated than Destro and Affliction tho, but once you get used with it, it's pretty awesome for getting your desired rating.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Bogdan View Post
    Another thing I noticed, if you're playing with a druid, why aren't you using Rejuv? You never use it.

    Tell your druid to play Resto and you may have a chance on getting much higher rating, but as other mentioned, the comp is awful.

    I personally really like Demo, Demo's burst is really dumb, you can actually compare it to Warrior burst... But the damage outside of CDs is rather low, you got no real PvP fillers to use and do decent damage... It's a little more complicated than Destro and Affliction tho, but once you get used with it, it's pretty awesome for getting your desired rating.
    i do get your point but the druid is a friend and just screwing your friends to get rating probably isnt that fun, we tried restro but i couldnt lay down enough dps to kill anything, they would just outlast me then kill them everyone had blown CD's that druid does more damage than me (played longer and knows class better)

    Im going to try demo in some BG's as i think it might work a bit better, restro druid demo lock might be a beter choice.

    What classes would you suggest i played with? as i guess i can run games with 2 people

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