Landsoul's Armory: Overcap Hit and Carbonic Carbuncle?

[Freedom]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...dsoul/advanced

Is he just messing around and experimenting, trolling/ throwing people off or did some theorycrafting change? I know askmrrobot now claims carbonic carbuncle is BiS but I did not trust it at the time but now I am not so sure. Or does he not have H Lei Shin's Final Orders? I imagine he has the coaster.

[OneSent]

More than likely, he's just messing around with different setups and doesn't take his Armory into consideration. Vodka hasn't raided yet this week due to a few members losing power to Hurricane Sandy, but I think they will be tonight. By then, I'm sure he will have his gear in order.

It could also be the gear he uses for doing dailies, hence why he is using Bladestorm atm. But prior to that though, he 's been using the Brewfest trinket.

[Deleted]

No

Hit is better than haste , even over the hit cap. thats the reason why

[Keensteel]

Hit is better than Haste over the soft cap but Landsoul is also favoring Hit over Mastery as well. Check out the reforging? So, is Hit also more valuable than Mastery at a certain gear level perhaps?

[Freedom]

I ran 10,000 iterations of SMF BIS T14H scaling and got mastery at 1.8 something and hit at 1.5 over cap, but maybe Simc is faulty. I wish Landsoul would release his spreadsheet already, but progression> community.

I am actually close ish to his gear level off iLvl alone(4 ilvl below) but he has a H Elegion.

[Darkfriend]

I ran 10,000 iterations of SMF BIS T14H scaling and got mastery at 1.8 something and hit at 1.5 over cap, but maybe Simc is faulty. I wish Landsoul would release his spreadsheet already, but progression> community.

I am actually close ish to his gear level off iLvl alone(4 ilvl below) but he has a H Elegion.

He's also not in full BiS t14H

[Freedom]

Scale Factors for Landsoul Damage Per Second
Str Agi AP Exp Hit InvHit Crit Haste Mastery Wdps WOHdps
Scale Factors 2.88 0.00 0.00 0.00 1.14 0.00 2.41 0.86 1.37 0.00 0.00

Scale Factors for Wrathslash Damage Per Second
Str Agi AP Exp Hit InvHit Crit Haste Mastery Wdps WOHdps
Scale Factors 3.03 0.00 0.00 0.00 1.08 0.00 2.14 0.77 1.36 0.00 0.00

10,000 iterations, he's experimenting.

[Bloodletters]

If I had to guess, he probably doesn't have Lei Shen's Final Orders yet. I know he was doing a bunch of personal sims lately (not using simcraft btw) and it was showing the Coren's Cold Cromium Coaster to be a pretty bad trinket. The proc is absolute crap. Whereas Carbonic Carbuncle was simming to be a pretty good trinket overall. Lei Shen's was still beating it but he doesn't have it.

As far as hit goes, I think he was saying you could go for a high hit build or a high mastery build as the two stats are fairly equal.

[Rustynip]

Just because simcraft says two trinkets are BiS doesn't mean that they're BiS for every fight. I know that I've swapped trinkets on different fights. You have to think about what they do, how often they proc and how efficiently they will line up with fight mechanics. The scholomance exp/on use str trinket was pretty good for heroic spirit kings progression since the phases were longer and it was usable during every execute phase, allowing you to push to the next king faster.

[wariofan1]

Tbh I'm hestitant to replace Carbonic Carbuncle if I ever get Lei Shin's Final Orders. Haste just isn't that good, and even if the proc is amazing I don't think that one proc can carry a trinket. Replacing 847 Strength is kind of a big deal.

[Rustynip]

Lei shins lines up really well with the DMC trinket and the static haste on it can be reforged to crit.

[BuzzIrl]

well this is good news because simc tells me hit is >str/crit beyond 7.5%;

Hit 1.29 (above 7.5%)
Exp 1.13 (slightly under cap so understandable)
Str 1.00
Crit 0.83

This is 50,000 iterations

Is anyone else getting similar simc results?

I am ilvl 472 http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...zzirl/advanced

Buzz

[Deleted]

Yes, indeed. I'm getting similar results and my ilvl is 477 now. 10k iterations and similar stat weights

[Angriff]

The default setup in SimCraft sims hit and expertise values by subtracting rating rather than adding. That is your hit value to cap, not after cap.

[redd]

The default setup in SimCraft sims hit and expertise values by subtracting rating rather than adding. That is your hit value to cap, not after cap.

Actually it's your hit to whatever hit you have equipped in the setup you used to sim. If you equip to like 10% hit you'll notice the 'point lost per point of hit' goes down, meaning hit is obviously losing value. At exactly 7.5% you see your hit-under cap value shown in that negative delta.

[Cityfella]

scrolling through the top geared warriors in the world on wowprogress every smf warrior is overcapping hit, so there must be something there i guess?

[Deleted]

When I simmed and noticed that hit was better than strength point for point I tried reforging with this priority: Hit > Exp > Crit (9000 [~20%]) > Hit to hard cap > Mastery

I then had "only" like 9% hit, 20% crit, exp cap and I don't know.. about 28k AP (ilvl477) with 16% mastery or so. Simcraft then showed me after scaling my stats again (with the new gained 9% hit) and it showed me that hit actually lost value pretty fast. It was showing to be only around 0,97 times as good as 1 strength. Before it was easily above 1,1x in value.

What could cause this? I mean got about 1,5% hit more and then suddenly hit fell off. Is it an error caused by SimCraft? I wonder..

[Deleted]

When I simmed and noticed that hit was better than strength point for point I tried reforging with this priority: Hit > Exp > Crit (9000 [~20%]) > Hit to hard cap > Mastery

I then had "only" like 9% hit, 20% crit, exp cap and I don't know.. about 28k AP (ilvl477) with 16% mastery or so. Simcraft then showed me after scaling my stats again (with the new gained 9% hit) and it showed me that hit actually lost value pretty fast. It was showing to be only around 0,97 times as good as 1 strength. Before it was easily above 1,1x in value.

What could cause this? I mean got about 1,5% hit more and then suddenly hit fell off. Is it an error caused by SimCraft? I wonder..

The closer you are to the maximum % the less value any stat has. The higher the stat, the lower chance you have of it not occurring.
At 10% Crit, crit rating has a high value. At 70% Crit, crit rating has a low value.

Same with hit except the cap isn't 100%. With a lower cap smaller amounts will relatively fill your remaining hit more, meaning that the DR you get (like the crit example) will happen a lot quicker.

[Deleted]

The closer you are to the maximum % the less value any stat has. The higher the stat, the lower chance you have of it not occurring.
At 10% Crit, crit rating has a high value. At 70% Crit, crit rating has a low value.

Same with hit except the cap isn't 100%. With a lower cap smaller amounts will relatively fill your remaining hit more, meaning that the DR you get (like the crit example) will happen a lot quicker.

That's a pretty good explanation. Thanks.
Would that mean we wouldn't need to get much higher than 9%~ hit since crit surpasses hit by then? (atleast on my config) hmm...

[Freedom]

I just got Relic of Xuen this morning and ran 25,000 iterations on Carbuncle versus Coaster and it came up as a 350 DPS difference favoring Carbuncle, which roughly agrees with some napkin math I did on the two trinkets using actual uptime based on some Stoneguard and Elegon 10N logs from 2 weeks ago.

I imagine that Hit might be better than Mastery over soft hitcap once the Avatar nerf goes live if you use that talent for sub-20% burst because of less rage for Executes.