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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    You're inventing a distinction that doesn't exist. You like a glyph? Then it's an "improvement". You don't like having to use a glyph slot on it? Then it's a "fix" and it's bad.
    I think I gave pretty good explanations as to how a glyph optional and hoe it is needed. There is nothing invented there.
    The ones who invented the distinction where the devs, who at some point thought: "Well, we have good stuns now, why dont we start making bad ones now so we have different stuff around for the heck of it?
    You just made up what you think an ability should be, in your mind,
    An ability should be working properly without glyphs/talents. A stun is mainly for pvp. If a stun does not properly work in pvp baseline, it's crap. That's nothing made up, it's common sense.
    You're insisting that whatever we have is fine, because apparantly I am an "enh hater", therefore automatically wrong because a hater cant give constructive feedback => making me wrong =>circular reasoning anyone?

    Buff totems I have started fighting for over three years ago and now it is implemented, how come if it is just the opinion of someone who hates the class anyway?
    No, of course not. How could any of what I say ever have any hint of truth?
    Just like I, who have kept my attitude of critisizing/giving feedback to alyways improve shaman, you have kept yours of going exactly opposite of whatever I say.
    With your reasoning of me hating shaman, hence complaining we could apply it similarly to you, hating me for continuously voicing my opinion or whatever.

    And with that single point, argueing would become flawless anyway, because your point would only consist of "I hate you, therefor you are wrong" anyways. But who would accuse someone else of hating something(shaman) or somebody without a reason?
    No, where you move to compare it to other stuns is where you start talking about equality.
    No, because those other stuns are not the same either. Shadowfury is not the same as Deep Freeze.
    Deep Freeze has a five sec duration and is single target, Shadow Fury has three sec duration and can multiple targets (who have no way of escaping).
    Both are competitive, because you cant really counter either of them, although they are different. CPT can be countered easily, therefor it is not competitive.
    It could be a 2 minute cooldown to compensate for it being 5 sec AND aoe, but be uncounterable. That'd be still competitive. What above all else matters is reliability, and CPT does not have it. There is no flaw in my argumentation so dont pretend I am making things up.
    You can disagree with my points, but dont slander me in being a hater, making things up or the like, since I dont do it either.

    I say you hate the spec because you have hundreds if not thousands of posts here, and almost every single one is talking negatively about the spec.
    Or you hate the spec, because you fight against improvements. Hmmm, you can twist it either way.

    Arena ranking IS a good way of determining PvP competitiveness, though, which is what we were establishing.
    We were talking about pvp design. Ele was competitive in wotlk through being a burstbot. While that was competitive, it was not designed well. As a result ele was crippled after they castrated burst and banned BL from arena. That's a s fast as it goes.

    Normally, when they address a host of someone's concerns like that, I'd expect them to be happy, or at least improve in their outlook, but you instead found new flaws to complain about, even if it meant reversing your prior stance; you said in that post there that you liked the 4.3 Enhancement AoE. It's the same basic model now. Yet, you've been complaining about it.
    1) I have several times expressed my thought on these forums that blizz did A LOT for us in MoP beta. By a far marging more than in any other beta, where I was feeling left out.
    2) Being happy about good changes does not mean I cannot still voice my opinion for further improvement, right?
    3) Yes, I found new flaws, because they created them. They cut customisation by making GW glyph mandatory, they increased the sacrifice of dps in favor of utility (UF, SF change), CPT instead of a simple 5 sec insgle target stun and others
    4) I have NOT heavily critisized the 4.2 aoe, that's you, making things up. The new aoe came up just before I retired, so I could neither experience the joy of having such a vast improvements over the crap we had before, nor the frustrations at DW spine and similar fights.
    Enh aoe seems to me like a good aoe if the aoe time isn't to short, and if I ever said something concerning our new aoe that wasn't praise, it usually was ideas when I heard others complaining about it.
    5) You're like: They did something for us, so shut up already!
    It's like saying: Hey, at least the hitman stopped killing people, so be happy with that and dont expect him to stop dealing drugs, the thing he started doing afterwards.
    Last edited by Omanley; 2012-11-14 at 04:56 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angoth
    I'm sorry that Blizzard won't just gift wrap awesome in a cup and let you drink your fill.

  2. #162
    Blademaster filo155's Avatar
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    Endus dude no dissrespect here but your defending elemental like it was good or verry good... elemtanl is horible atm... it needs major fixes...alot of uncessesery rng, critical strike rating is praticly useles becuse lava burst cant benefit from it....no survival in pvp,no control in pvp, no dmg in pvp... ALOT of fixes are needed for ele

  3. #163
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    I think I gave pretty good explanations as to how a glyph optional and hoe it is needed. There is nothing invented there.
    The ones who invented the distinction where the devs, who at some point thought: "Well, we have good stuns now, why dont we start making bad ones now so we have different stuff around for the heck of it?
    You're making it all up. It does not exist anywhere outside your head. There is no distinction between what you're calling "improvements" and what you call "fixes". It doesn't matter if you can label things one or the other, the fact is, that's not how glyphs are designed, and the ENTIRE thing is predicated on your own preconceptions, circularly.

    No, because those other stuns are not the same either. Shadowfury is not the same as Deep Freeze.
    Deep Freeze has a five sec duration and is single target, Shadow Fury has three sec duration and can multiple targets (who have no way of escaping).
    Both are competitive, because you cant really counter either of them, although they are different. CPT can be countered easily, therefor it is not competitive.
    It could be a 2 minute cooldown to compensate for it being 5 sec AND aoe, but be uncounterable. That'd be still competitive. What above all else matters is reliability, and CPT does not have it. There is no flaw in my argumentation so dont pretend I am making things up.
    You ARE making it up. You're using a whole bunch of subjective terms and personal preference statements, and then claiming what you just said is quantifiable fact. You're using "competitive" to mean something you're inventing, rather than anything concrete; the facts are that Shaman are in top-ranked arena teams on the ladders, so we ARE competitive with our toolkit, including Capacitor Totem. You've provided no grounds for declaring CPT to be uncompetitive. You've provided reasons you don't LIKE it, and reasons why you think it's not as strong as some other stuns are, but those do not determine competitiveness.

    Abilities aren't competitive. Specs are competitive. You have entirely the wrong outlook, here, since the balance of any particular ability is entirely irrelevant. The only thing that matters is class and spec balance. Abilities are not balanced in comparison with other similar abilities. It's not only perfectly fine for us to have the weakest <insert ability here>, the facts are that some class is going to have the weakest anything. And that's fine. Because classes and specs are balanced based on their full toolkits. Abilities are not balanced against each other 1:1. It's an entirely irrelevant point to make.

    Especially as, to repeat; Shaman are doing just fine in PvP. If we weren't performing well, we could start discussing why that is. If we ARE performing well and are competitive as we are, and the ladders show that this is the case, then any improvements to our abilities to make us more effective in PvP would have to come at the cost of additional nerfs, to prevent us becoming TOO strong.

    The only spec that really seems to be struggling a bit in PvP is Elemental, and their issues there are primarily due to low sustained DPS and easily mitigated burst DPS. Not something an improved Capacitor Totem could fix.

    3) Yes, I found new flaws, because they created them. They cut customisation by making GW glyph mandatory, they increased the sacrifice of dps in favor of utility (UF, SF change), CPT instead of a simple 5 sec insgle target stun and others
    It's already been demonstrated as concrete fact, that Glyph of Ghost Wolf is not mandatory in PvP. Stop perpetuating misinformation.
    4) I have NOT heavily critisized the 4.2 aoe, that's you, making things up. The new aoe came up just before I retired, so I could neither experience the joy of having such a vast improvements over the crap we had before, nor the frustrations at DW spine and similar fights.
    Enh aoe seems to me like a good aoe if the aoe time isn't to short, and if I ever said something concerning our new aoe that wasn't praise, it usually was ideas when I heard others complaining about it.
    And yet, earlier in this very thread;
    Quote Originally Posted by Omanley View Post
    From what people say, I doesn't appear that shamans are in need of immiment changes pve-wise (except for enh specifically maybe a more comfortable way of aoe-ing maybe)


    ---------- Post added 2012-11-14 at 12:26 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by filo155 View Post
    Endus dude no dissrespect here but your defending elemental like it was good or verry good... elemtanl is horible atm... it needs major fixes...alot of uncessesery rng, critical strike rating is praticly useles becuse lava burst cant benefit from it....no survival in pvp,no control in pvp, no dmg in pvp... ALOT of fixes are needed for ele
    I haven't ever said Elemental was "good or very good", I've been saying since the beta that Elemental's lagging a bit behind in PvP.

    That said; we don't really have more RNG than other classes. Crit isn't useless, either; it's reasonably decent for us, if you're talking about damage. We've got significantly better survival in PvP than in Cata.

    Yes, we could use some improvements. i'd like to see Frost Shock made usable with less of a DPS loss for Elemental (it should still be a tradeoff, but right now we've got two major nukes tied to shock cooldowns and it's a major sacrifice, as opposed to Resto/Enh where it's a fairly small one). I think we need better damage outside Ascendance, and Ascendance needs to be a bit harder to lock down; an immunity to silence/interrupts for instance, while it's active.

    We're not "horrible", though. It's vastly better than it was during Cataclysm, and even there, we were viable in RBGs.

  4. #164
    Yes endus you are alwais right, people make up things all the time and everything and everyone that doesn't agree with you is wrong.

    /sarcasm off

    Try someday to read good feedback post and you might find is not false as everything you claim is.

  5. #165
    Stood in the Fire shell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by angeleg View Post
    Yes endus you are alwais right, people make up things all the time and everything and everyone that doesn't agree with you is wrong.

    /sarcasm off

    Try someday to read good feedback post and you might find is not false as everything you claim is.
    Here's the thing, even though this post wasn't directed at me. I don't have a problem with people providing feedback. Even if I disagree with it , IMHO, it's still good feedback. The problem is this: it's when the feedback is based on their opinion that certain talents and/or glyphs are mandatory; or when their feedback is based on their opinion that class x's ability is better than class y's ability when they're not taking into account the entire toolkit of each of those classes.

    Restoration's toolkit looks really strong to me. Yet a lot of the abilities that people complain about are abilities that Resto's have. That suggests to me that those abilities are not really where the issues are. Most of the issues, in my opinion, are contained within each individual spec of the class.

    For instance, if enhancement shamans believe that they have gap-closing issues, whether I agree with them or not is irrelevent, it's still good feedback. But there's nothing about glyph of ghostwolf/capacitor being made baseline that's going to solve that. Enhancement shaman have been asking for a gap-closing ability for years. If that's what they believe their issue is, then that's a spec issue and should be handled through their spec.

    If elemental shamans believe that they have survivability/dps issues, whether I agree with them or not is irrelevant, it's still good feedback. But there's nothing about glyph of ghostwolf/capacitor being made baseline that's going to solve that. If that's what they believe their issue is, then that's a spec issue and should be handled through their spec.

    They could make all the glyphs/talents that people have been complaining about in this thread baseline, they could make all the abilities that people are complaining aren't like the others exactly the same, but the problems that they think their specs have would still remain problems.

    I have done all the things that the other posters are doing here and I'll probably do it again. Every time I've done it I was shot down the same, whether it was Endus or another moderator. In some cases it was a former moderator and if I knew anything about theorycrafting, Binkenstein would probably shoot me down too. I've learned to live with it because while I realize that in no way do these people represent Blizzard, they often hold similar views. And if I can't get my arguments across to them then its probably not going to come across to the developers either.
    Last edited by shell; 2012-11-14 at 08:46 PM.
    These words in my mouth... where did they come from? I don't think I'm the one that put them there...

  6. #166
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shell View Post
    Here's the thing, even though this post wasn't directed at me. I don't have a problem with people providing feedback. Even if I disagree with it , IMHO, it's still good feedback. The problem is this: it's when the feedback is based on their opinion that certain talents and/or glyphs are mandatory; or when their feedback is based on their opinion that class x's ability is better than class y's ability when they're not taking into account the entire toolkit of each of those classes.
    The issue to me, as I've tried to make clear, isn't that people be positive. Heck, I'm critical myself. I'm always careful to either have numerical backup, though, if I'm going to claim we're lagging, or I make an effort to be clear that I'm talking about my own personal impressions and thoughts rather than something quantitative and factual.

    When people start using words like "mandatory" and "broken", they're using words that refer to a state of fact. "Mandatory" means you MUST have it to succeed, period, no exceptions. "Broken" means "not working at all". You can't use "mandatory" as a synonym for "too popular and strong in comparison with other glyphs for my liking". You can't use "broken" as a synonym for "not working as I'd like".

    If someone were to post that they thought CPT feels awkward to use, and that Ghost Wolf is probably a little too strong for a glyph in comparison with the others, I wouldn't be responding the way I am. The issue isn't people being critical. I've been critical myself, in this thread. The issue is presenting their personal preferences as if they were incontrovertible fact.

    The facts are; glyph of ghost wolf isn't mandatory, and CPT isn't broken. Those are simple truths. Once we can establish that, we can discuss whether Glyph of Ghost Wolf is too popular for 3s and whether this shows it's too strong as a glyph relative to our other choices, or whether CPT's implementation could be improved to be a little less daunting to use.

    It's like another issue that hasn't been raised here (and I'm not trying to raise it, just using it as an example); totem health in general. I've been saying since the beta that I think our totems should have 5-10% of the Shaman's health, baseline. Glyph of Totemic Vigor should be an additional protection. The basic idea was that totems shouldn't fall to an offhand slap from a dual wielder, but should still be relatively easy to kill if you try. Yet, when people post "totem health is balls, totems shouldn't be killable because nobody else's cooldowns are killable", I'll take issue with that. If people post saying we need totem health to be increased to be viable, I'll point at the numbers and say that we're doing okay without it.

    That doesn't mean I don't support it, it just means your arguments aren't holding up. The ends do not justify the means; if we have issues, we don't need to resort to exaggeration and hyperbole to convince the devs to fix it.

  7. #167
    I rerolled to shaman early TBC and have been reading forums and sites like these for years. I've registered for one reason, sorry for it being OT.

    Endus, you are getting old, predictable and boring, so boring.

    You know shaman, make informative guides and probably moderate this section well. I very much appreciate your efforts in the guides you make, but please, please stop the finger pointing granny style comments on people who are just trying to express their disappointment.

    Please stop posting like you are the all knowing oracle of shamans, some disciple from blizzard advocating the sheer success of shaman when nearly every
    single poster experiences the class differently than you. The never-ending disagreements. It's getting old, so very old. Perhaps take an example to the moderators from blizzard who reply a lot less but are still effective, and by far alot let depressive.

    Perhaps let it go, stick to your guides or perhaps consider another challenge, like Bink on totemspot or Vixsn at LifeInGroup5. A private playground. It's a video game related forum section you moderate, assumable for a small reward if not completely voluntarily. But instead of being at least a bit lightened up, your posts are so cold, nearly depressing. I'm sure there are undertakers out there that have more fun doing their job.

  8. #168
    Dreadlord Aurokk's Avatar
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    PATCH 5.1

    All totems are now considered spells, and summoning totems can be prevented by silencing effects. Searing Totem, Magma Totem, and Fire Elemental totems fall into the Fire school, while all other totems fall under the Nature school.


    I feel so sorry for Elemental in particular.

  9. #169
    Stood in the Fire shell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madboweye View Post
    advocating the sheer success of shaman when nearly every
    single poster experiences the class differently than you.
    I shouldn't respond because I'm derailing the thread but I can't help myself so I'm only going to say this once.

    I don't think people are noticing that when he's disagreeing with us, for the most part, he never actually states his own opinion on the matter. Most of the time, it seems to me, he's just disagreeing with people's premises. So he might agree with someone's conclusion but he doesn't agree with how they reached it, or vice versa. Besides that he has made suggestions but people are ignoring that and reacting to his tone. When he disagrees with me I don't get offended, I just go back to the drawing board and try to think of a way to phrase my argument in such a way that he can't. If I can't get my argument to fly with him its not going to fly with the devs either, so I try to make it as precise as I am able to.

    Back on topic,

    All totems are now considered spells, and summoning totems can be prevented by silencing effects. Searing Totem, Magma Totem, and Fire Elemental totems fall into the Fire school, while all other totems fall under the Nature school.
    I'm trying not to jump to conclusions but this doesn't sound good.
    Last edited by shell; 2012-11-14 at 09:34 PM.
    These words in my mouth... where did they come from? I don't think I'm the one that put them there...

  10. #170
    wow, didn't think I would get that much response, shows you how a poorly typed statement can get you an overload of info...


    I do enjoy playing my shaman a great deal, its been my main since BC, but have played since long before that. I loved the old school enhancement style of play GCD locked and all. When they changed it to the newer style I just went elemental.

    I have not enjoyed PvP since the inception of arena and BG's, nothing like WORLD of warcraft in a box.

    I can live with the small amount of RNG the class seems to have atm, and every time I add a couple points to my ilvl I sure can tell the difference on the DPS charts.

    But as for my original statement, it dang near drives me nuts not seeing anything about shaman every single patch "even leaving out hot fix info most of the time". And from some of the posts I think there are others like me.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-14 at 09:53 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithgroth View Post
    On topic:
    I'm starting to worry about seriously being missed because of all the shitstorm going on about Warrior & BM burst and mage CC. Most of the PvP'ers complaining about it and it's understandable that Blizzard is taking high priority on this issue, however I see -almost- no mention of any shaman discussion going on.

    Even if we are fine in every aspect on what/how we are doing -although some claim we are, I don't see how everything can be fine-, I don't see how come there are no attempts to improve things, or make them cooler.

    Not even a single cosmetic minor glyph, or an icon change. As a shaman I feel so desperate and sad that there are no positive changes (doesn't have to be a direct buff, or not an obvious PvE encounter fix, that's aimed to fix the fight, not the shaman).

    On CPT:
    CPT is not junk: We had no CC before. Then they gave us hex and bind elemental (so rarely used). Today's WoW requires even more control, but we should be thankful that we have at least one addition to our arsenal. 5 second AoE stun is welcomed by anyone, and shamans got it, it's great.

    CPT is not fine: CPT is very good indeed, but it is obviously not fine as it is now. 45 second cd makes up for 5 seconds stun duration, it is pretty balanced as it is in terms of effect / cooldown. However, it really requires improvements and QoL changes to be useful enough:

    - Totemic Projection becomes mandatory to use it. In PvP, nobody's going to stand in range of it, you have to be the one stunning them. And making a talent mandatory is flawed design. The most perfect talent example is Warlock's pet tier. Assumed that they produce the same dps, it just alters the playstyle and depends on your choice. Only CPT alone itself makes TP such a mandatory choice because it is not going to work %90 of the time without it.

    - A X class ability should be usable by an averagely skilled x class player. If top tier shamans can use it very well, and most others can't, it does not mean the ability is fine and everyone else needs to L2P. It's more of a stress source than fun in my experience, and I really wonder what do you love about it as its current state, since -as I said- it effects your talent choices on its own, and furthermore pushes you to pick a glyph just to be more reliable -explained below-.

    -------***** The most important issue for QoL change *****-------
    - While you are trying to aim it, your mouse turns into TP's AoE pointer, which is a circle about 2-yard radius. When you try to aim it 30-yards away, it becomes too hard to predict 8-yard effect area on a moving target, while in the mean time you have to count for the arming time and hit it exactly on the right milisecond to land it. I don't see how this is "skill-cap" instead of just annoying. In the heat of combat, count to x, place it in the very right spot at the very right time, and try to predict 8-yards AoE, it's just asking too much for an AoE stun which is already balanced by its own long cooldown . It's not reliable enough, hitting with CPT shouldn't be a bonus, it should be one of our tools that we use for control.
    -------***** The most important issue for QoL change *****-------

    - Glyph feels plain wrong. Glyphs should alter and tweak a spell further instead of making them more reliable to use. The ability itself should be decent enough to be useful. Similar to talents, glyphs should be playstyle choices. CPT glyph feels like a bug-fix now. Because CPT isn't a reliable stun and too difficult to execute properly on its own (see the reasons above), glyph becomes mandatory if you intend to use it in your arsenal. This is just plain wrong because it contradicts with Blizzard's revamped talent and glyph logic. Also, "making a spell more reliable to use" isn't the same as "altering your playstyle by adding CPT".

    There are tons of ways to make the ability more appealing, everybody probably have some ideas.
    Even the existance of these ideas points out that it should be discussed by people and some improvements are required for the spell.


    THIS ^^^^ Is exactly what I am talking about.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Jecht View Post
    PATCH 5.1

    All totems are now considered spells, and summoning totems can be prevented by silencing effects. Searing Totem, Magma Totem, and Fire Elemental totems fall into the Fire school, while all other totems fall under the Nature school.


    I feel so sorry for Elemental in particular.
    HHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAH sooooooooooooo totems are now just cd's only worse then every other cooldown. HHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHA I cant stop laughing how not in touch they are with the shaman class

  12. #172
    Stood in the Fire shell's Avatar
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    I'm really starting to dislike resto shamans (only slightly serious) but this is twice now, it appears, that enhance/elemental get knocked because resto is so good. If this is what I think it is and we end up with no compensation it will be torch-and-pitchfork time.
    These words in my mouth... where did they come from? I don't think I'm the one that put them there...

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by filo155 View Post
    Endus dude no dissrespect here but your defending elemental like it was good or verry good... elemtanl is horible atm... it needs major fixes...alot of uncessesery rng, critical strike rating is praticly useles becuse lava burst cant benefit from it....no survival in pvp,no control in pvp, no dmg in pvp... ALOT of fixes are needed for ele
    Elemental is FAR from horrible... I have watched many HORRIBLE elemental shaman complain about how bad the spec is just to blow them out of the water and be 2nd or 3rd on the DPS charts. This broad sweeping statement that elemental is horrible is in fact crap.

    RNG is not that unnecessary, its needed, if our damage was 100% predictable the numbers you see would be far lower from hit to hit. I enjoy that rare occasion of seeing multi lavaburst spam and Elemental Burst going off, makes me giggle a little.

    So what if Crit is useless because of blah blah blah, then stack haste, or mastery. You think every class has always had to stack crit? You should understand you never stack just 1 stat, well I hope you understand that.

    Pvp, what can I say I think it sucks since they started arena's and bg's, then added that horseshit stat resilience and still have not figure out how to fix it. go go pvp power...


    But there will always be that FOTM class that will blow us up, re-roll if you want to be OP for a month or three, I will just continue to "HAVE FUN" playing a shaman.

  14. #174
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shell View Post
    I'm really starting to dislike resto shamans (only slightly serious) but this is twice now, it appears, that enhance/elemental get knocked because resto is so good. If this is what I think it is and we end up with no compensation it will be torch-and-pitchfork time.
    I posted in the other thread started for that topic specifically (and I'd suggest that discussion get moved there rather than here, if you just want to discuss that one change), but I agree. The only possible reason I can see for it is Resto. It hurts Elemental far worse than it hurts Resto. I can see the reasoning to make totems count as spells, but I think we need some other kind of protection against interrupts and silences, then; that totems were physical abilities was all we had, up till now, and even that wasn't feeling like nearly enough, IMO, for Elemental.

  15. #175
    Only problem I am having at the moment, is when there isn't much raid dmg, so not much to heal is everyone still manages to get 35+k hps and I hang around 15%, there is freaking nothing to heal but tanks...even though I actively spam abilities, I feel so weak because others got absorbs and whatnot and it shows on world of logs. Garalon I top and beat every single healer, but on Imperial or Wind Lord I get beaten. *annoyed*

    Even on trash...no one to be healed, people get high on hps and I'm like at bottom, and I use HR and Healing Wave/Riptide...
    I want Resto Shamans to have smarter heals, I hear from others, that other healers are stronger when it comes to smarting heals.

  16. #176
    About "broken" or "mandatory" abilities talents/glyphs let me put you an example. In cata we got the talent ancestral swiftness wich gave us 15% movement speed and reduced the cast time of ghost wolf by 2 sec (if maxed). So lets look at it, basically if you didn't take the talent ghost wolf is totally and completely useless it served no purpose you had to take the talent to make it useful wich is what is called "mandatory"
    Same goes for the current ghost wolf, in a pvp enviorement for example what would be the point of it baseline if you just get slowed anyway, so you have to take a glyph to make it useful, thats mandatory.

  17. #177
    I just read about the totem silence nerf. Can't help but laugh at how things are developing. Having mained as shaman since vanilla I've come to expect shamans being neglected during class balance sweeps, but this expansion has by far exceeded my expectations so far. First there was that blue post about shamans not needing much attention at the moment, then the ancestral swiftness nerf, and now the totems too.

    At this point, it has turned into some kind of parody. All that's really needed now to compensate for the nerfbats is a new Stormstrike icon.

  18. #178
    Lol so typical.

    No patch notes as shaman are fine, and then with release candidate on PTR, AS and totems are nerfed.

    blizzard lied about the new talent system.
    It was to avoid cookie cutters and to tune specs more easily independently without affecting the class.
    They lied so badly and if this goes live we'll be dog shit for the rest of the patch in pvp.

    I've seen Zeiyo on AJ also complain,

    I'm sorry dear moderators, but I'm back in my old sceptical pessimistic mood that blizz doesn't give shit about shaman.
    stupid change, lower skill floor and cap on classes like mage, lock, spriest. Increase skill floor of every shaman and also decrease their skill cap, GG.

    yes I'm mad, QQ

  19. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by woopytywoop View Post
    stupid change, lower skill floor and cap on classes like mage, lock, spriest. Increase skill floor of every shaman and also decrease their skill cap, GG.
    I was happier when we had less attention than Sunsong Ranch for 5.1.

    Totem silence nerf is not only a direct nerf.
    It's a direct move to encourage blanket silences and it kills all our moves, all our "skill-required" answers during silences. It's also a nerf to skillful play.

    It doesn't matter now either this change goes live or not, even considering it shows how Blizzard's actions are unfair against shaman, particularly DPS. MoP changes were pretty exciting because we had a hope that Resto nerfs wouldn't effect others much.

    Also I'm wondering why they aren't answering Shamans yet. Tons of questions and threads are up on every platform possible, there are still no answers to any of them. Still waiting for a justified answer on why they even considered such a change, while they even answer to previously answered, obvious changes:

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Warrior Cd stacking was bad, but losing the rage from avatar will really hurt, any plans to buff some sustained dmg?
    We increased the duration to offset the rage loss. (Source)

  20. #180
    Elemental survivability was out of hand, glad they're bringing it in line with other critters.

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