I never said frost was above fire...
Plus, your version of that post is not the 'average', that's pulled from the top 100 parses.
Bottom line is if you get irritated by fire's broken mechanics like I do and want a more interesting play-style, and would like to have a little control over burst, there's a perfectly viable alternative.
idk, maybe its just my raid and our fire mages suck (which they don't, and they out-gear both frost mages), but I'm pretty damn close to them (if not ahead of them on some pulls)...
Unless you're playing wow just to be in the top parses I wouldn't worry about fire vs frost. You just have to try both and see which you can play better and enjoy more.
Playing frost now isn't so bad. I used to play arcane in 4.3 lol.
I've always tried all the specs and you really just have to play what your good at. I suck at fire and I don't like how it feels so I play frost.
Fear not! I am here! And I am frost until the bitter, cold end.
Talk to me if you wish. Find me in-game and I'll add you on realid. The community of frost mages must grow and stay strong!
So? its higher than frost man
#1 fire mage US. u mirin'?
"Aaah ah ah ah ah ah ah yea, f*ck me, ah, f*ck, aah yeah"
- Jenna Jameson
Raidbots is aggregate. I'm tired of people presenting raidsbots in the wrong context. It happens in my guild all the time.
Frost could have an upper level potential of 5% above fire. However, if 80% of frost mages play at 2/3 their maximum potential, the logs will reflect a number much lower than fire if fire mages are playing at a higher potential.
Raidbots is something you present as a reflection of how well mages are playing their spec at any given time.
Fire is easy to learn, and in many situations has a yield (if RNG favors you) of an upper limit above frost. Nearly all mages don't have set bonuses yet either, which makes all conclusions very premature. Frost is a bit tougher, and honestly not the spec for a lot of people. There are less of us, and we are still figuring a lot out.
---------- Post added 2012-11-04 at 01:11 PM ----------
29th percentile on Feng Heroic. 69,448 dps as a fire mage isn't remotely good. I did 10k higher than that as frost and I think I did a rubbish job.
Keep in mind that Raiding is never about how much DPS you do, its about how well you can keep to tactics and do a decent amount of DPS besides that. If DPS is not the main concern in your raid, who cares about the amount of damage done?
I say this because there seem to be a lot of people convinced that getting near top 100 parses makes you a good player. I'm not saying that it doesnt, but you are missing the point of raiding. Every spec has its ups and downs. For example, Fire sucks in (predictable) burst on for example the Elegon orbs, but it is very good on single target, and multitarget with large health pools. And although Fire is higher up the charts then Arcane on Elegon, if you are progressing on it, Arcane might be the better choice. Yes, you will do less dps overall, but your raid wont wipe because of you werent able to kill your orb because of lack of crits.
So, basicly, forget about any parses, and forget about what other mages seem to do. It is about what how you feel you can help out your raid best. If you feel safer as Frost then Fire, then go frost, despite what any parse or internethero tells you.
I'm un-derailing this thread.
I want to know how you're getting combustion up on bosses. What raid cooldowns are being used, when you're potting, how you're using AT. You should easily be doing more as fire even with bad RNG.
I've only seen frost doing more on one fight: Will. That's due to the standard strat of pulling all the mobs into one place and AoE nuking everything down. Having a major AoE cooldown every other rage spawn yields some crazy numbers.
Dont let it bug you. Play what you want! Ive been raiding as frost and have yet to be beaten by a fire specced mage who was in similar or better gear than me. If you do more damage as frost, play as frost. Once people see the damage meters, they wont even think about questioning you.
First, get at least one (preferably two) Intellect/Spellpower procc trinkets (Elegon's Trinket, DMF Trinket, even the Coren Direbrew will work for a bit). Next, start a fight by evocating and getting ready to throw a Pyroblast (link NT to it). Then, do your rotation as normal but DO NOT use your hot streak if you get one.
Wait for both HS and one (preferably both) trinket(s) to procc. Now, pop a macro that has the following:
/use <Insert 10 for Engineering glove enchant, 13/14 for an on-use trinket)
/cast Presence of Mind
/cast Alter Time
Pop your HS Pyro and your PoM Pyro (and if you get lucky, an additional 1-2 pyros from more Hot Streaks). Pop Alter Time and rinse/repeat this line. Combust when out of instant Pyros.
PS: You do the Alter Time combusts every other combust. When you do a non-Alter Time combust, you use PoM.
PPS: Feel free to delay Combustion a little bit to line up PoM+HS with a trinket (Add AT on the odd-numbered Combusts)
After the alter time + pom pyros (4 pyros) what if you have a heating up proc, and fireblast..it's not worth using fireblast to get a 5th pyro is it? cause the ignite goes wayyy down? u wanna ONLY rely on pyro?
There is so little useful information in this thread, I think Dragon9870 was the only *on-topic* and helpful post.
As he implies by explaining how to use PoM combustion correctly, your dps is almost certainly lower as fire because you are not doing this. Fire does consistantly beat frost, it does have an RNG swing but its average is still above that of frost in gameplay for the average mage. Fire also has the advantage of doing *significantly* higher damage on 3 targets, no dps loss on target switching, higher dps (via multi LB) on spread out targets. Frankly I expect a nerf to fire, it is too good for how easy it is to play (which by the way aside from learning how to combustion is monkey-level easy).