Page 7 of 12 FirstFirst ...
5
6
7
8
9
... LastLast
  1. #121
    My primary concern is with Arcane's performance in PvP. It is pitiful. Can barely get a cast off, I've got no survivability, virtually no viable crowd control, and, while less important but still relevant, my spells' visuals are so lackluster! The only few times I've been able to do something is while defending Dun Baldar in AV – I just hide behind a tree or find a place where no one can bother / see me, and I think I killed a couple people once...

    Mobility is a huge part of it; I would like to see some improvements there (AM while moving would be an obvious start). Some better survivability in terms of damage mitigation; Ice Barrier is nice, would be great to have some kind of mana shield or magic-absorping spell/ward again. Lastly, how about a really sweet crowd control spell?

    Picture this: an ability called Arcane Storm. The area surrounding the mage (let's say 10-15 yards) becomes engulfed by swirling, chaotic arcane energies. It could slow enemies who move inside of it, maybe apply some kind of debuff to them, hell, it could even randomly teleport players around within the area of the spell or knock them back occasionally. You could either make the spell affect the area surrounding the mage and give it a cooldown, or make it affect a targetable area and give it a short cast time. Give it some sweet purply, stormy, lightning animation with some swirly-looking ground effects, and bam. I'd be a much happier mage.
    Last edited by Dr-1337; 2012-11-17 at 04:31 PM. Reason: grammar

  2. #122
    For arcane pvp you should spec Ice Floes. Scorch doesn't generate any charges, and Presence of Mind... doesn't work with missiles, Arcane Barrage has only 3 sec cooldown, and you still have Fire Blast, so if you need an instant nuke there's no reason to waste Presence of Mind on Arcane Blast. Finally instant Polymorph, Polymorph is starting to be obsolete, without the old Improved Polymorph Talent the spell is too unrealiable, and too situational to make it instant.

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    Well I do think that I've come up with a nifty solution for most of our pve problems. Might be an issue for pvp but not necessarily. Now, there are three things to consider before reading the suggestion:

    1. I am not in the 'we want the burst phase back' team.
    2. I'm looking for a solution to faster recover from our lack of mobility, not to be able to dps while moving.
    3. I like our Mastery a lot.

    Suggestion:
    Draw Power - draw power from the nether realm, gaining 1 Arcane Charge per stack of Draw Power. Max 6 stacks. One stack is gained every 10 seconds. If used at 5 or 6 stacks, also generates one charge of Arcane Missiles. Cannot be used while Arcane Power is active because the sheer energy would destroy the mage.

    So this is basically an 'outbreak' type spell that's active all the time - when you use the spell it gets reset to 0 stacks and generates 1 stack every 10 seconds, allowing you 'take' as many stacks from it as you need based on it's current amount of stacks. So theoretically you could go from 0 to 6 Arcane Charges instantly every 60 seconds or for 2 charges every 20 seconds or any combination. For phases with high mobility when our Charges drop for stupid reasons, we can use this to help restore our dps as fast as possible. It also opens up a lot of combinations to handle our mastery, allowing more active mana management.

    What do you think?
    YOU DESERVE A RAISE!!! XD

    i mean really i really really like this concept >_< should post this on blizz forums :P

    also with ROP having no CD will make this even more appealing

    oh and i also love arcane 's mastery very unique and very fun to play(at least for me)
    http://oce.op.gg/summoner/userName=soulstrikes in oceanic now Lol

    5172-1206-0622 pokemon FC Lets Battle!!

  4. #124
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,018
    I am not able to post on US forums, but once we make a purified list of issues and ideas, we can find someone to do it for us.

  5. #125
    Ive been doing some pvp on arcane for some time on ptr now, the thing that hurts me the most is not being able to do any damage while running, and the lack of control.
    I cant afford standing still casting arcane blast because the cast time is inanely long, and by the time that i build up 6 stacks I'm pretty much OOM or my stacks fell of because of having to run/blink/cc (yes i can refresh the stack by an explosion but that requires melee range).

    I've been thinking about how to improve Arcane mage in pvp for some time now, here are the things i would change in talents and class abilities:

    -max stacks to 5 and the damage increase to 30% per arcane charge, mana increase stays the same, change duration of the buff to 15 seconds. (so we actually have time to do other things without them falling off.)

    -*NEW* glyph: You can now cast Arcane blast while moving, but decreases movement speed by 6% for each stack of arcane charge.

    -Arcane missiles damage increased by 40% (so it's actually worth finishing the cast instead of casting for 0.2 seconds just for the charge.)

    -Scorch now has a 50% chance to proc Arcane missiles on hit

    -Arcane only change: Your ability Frost nova has two charges (generating like warrior charge)

    -Arcane barrage damage reduced by 15%

    -Arcane bomb: Throw a small bomb on the ground that explodes when it lands, disorients all targets in a 5y radius. 0,5 second cast time,1 minute cooldown, 30y range
    These changes would make Arcane (in pvp) alot better because of the ability to move while casting. and regenerate charges faster while adding a damage increase to arcane missiles so we have some better sustained damage. I also changed frost nova to make up for the lack of control.
    The arcane barrage nerf is pretty much justified, i've been critting over 200k (on full resi targets) with 6 stacks and trinket, We should not be able to almost global someone in a deepfreeze with a barrage every 5 stacks.

    For pve, these changes would be pretty nice too, mobility boost and a slight damage boost.

    Tell me what you think :3

  6. #126
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,018
    Er... some issues with your suggestions:

    1. That change would completely ruin our mana management in terms of there would be nothing to manage - we'd constantly be over 90% without thinking about it and that would be boring. The thing about lengthening the duration of the debuff, okay, I could agree, but it would be too much in pvp. Arcane has lots of power at high stacks and the trick is to use skill to stay at high stacks.

    2. I have no opinion about that glyph change. It doesn't really sound bad at first.

    3. Your suggestion to Arcane Missiles is by far ridiculous because Missiles are currently our most powerful spell at any Charge level.

    4. A 50% proc chance from Missiles is too much, it would always be the go-to spell of Arcane for every single encounter and we'd be able to use it to maintain 6 Charges indefinitely. We actually want our favorite spec to be powerful, but not over the top because nobody benefits from that.

    5. Frost Nova suggestion seems reasonable, but I'd rather have an extra Arcane only spell to use. Also, it's kind of senseless for Arcane to have improved Frost spells.

    6. Barrage damage doesn't need to be nerfed - in pvp the only time it's powerful is if it crits at 5-6 charges. Also, reducing Barrage by 15% isn't enough to compensate for all of your other buffs Also, as you said up there, if you are able to pull a 6-Charge combo on a target in deep freeze, you deserve the over 200k damage, because setting up that combo is the problem.

    7. Arcane Bomb seems nifty, I'm just not sure about the disorient part, but it could work.

    2.

  7. #127
    Missiles damage is really good, outstanding against Deep Freeze targets. It doesn't need a buff.

  8. #128
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    The Emerald City
    Posts
    17,096
    Here's a crazy suggestion:

    Make Mana Adept a baseline passive for Arcane.

    Change the Mastery to one that generates 2 charges of clearcasting, the chance each spell has to proc it is increased per point of Mastery.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Here's a crazy suggestion:

    Make Mana Adept a baseline passive for Arcane.

    Change the Mastery to one that generates 2 charges of clearcasting, the chance each spell has to proc it is increased per point of Mastery.
    I really really like this idea!

    I've made a list of suggestions here: http://mop-talent-grid-maker.appspot...&gridId=372001

    Things that I think would make Arcane PvP much better are:

    - Your Blink spell now has two charges, but its second charge won't free you from stuns and bonds and will only teleport you 10 yards forward.

    - Arcane Power grants Arcane Charges when used.

    - If the player casts Spell Steal while the enemy is casting a spell or within 4 seconds after a spell has been cast, he/she will be able to unleash an exact duplicate of that spell. Cannot happen more than once every 2 min.

    - Improved Mirror Images ( additional copies, they mimic all of your actions, etc..).

    - Combining the defensive effects of molten armour, mage armour and frost armour might make life easier. ( view it as some sort of Elemental/Prismatic Armour)

    Keep the suggestions coming! I've seen some pretty good ideas in this thread.

    Edit:

    A Force Push spell which knocks enemies back could make Arcane more fun in PvP.
    Last edited by Alexand3r; 2012-11-19 at 09:15 AM.

  10. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Here's a crazy suggestion:

    Make Mana Adept a baseline passive for Arcane.

    Change the Mastery to one that generates 2 charges of clearcasting, the chance each spell has to proc it is increased per point of Mastery.
    Nice, I like this alot.

    Also I would like to see a change in Invocation solely for arcane so there is actually a choice between RoP and Invo.
    Example: If you fully evocate as Arcane while having less then 30% mana you get 2 stacks of Arcane Missiles and a small mastery buff as long as it is on CD. Maybe that would make the specc too simple or OP but I believe something can be found along these lines to make Invo more attractive as arcane.

    *Using ABr on a target with less than 30% health increases its damage by ?% and increases your Missile proc chance of your next 2 spells by ?%.

  11. #131
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,018
    Quote Originally Posted by Alexand3r View Post
    I really really like this idea!

    I've made a list of suggestions here: http://mop-talent-grid-maker.appspot...&gridId=372001

    Things that I think would make Arcane PvP much better are:

    - Your Blink spell now has two charges, but its second charge won't free you from stuns and bonds and will only teleport you 10 yards forward.

    - Arcane Power grants Arcane Charges when used.

    - If the player casts Spell Steal while the enemy is casting a spell or within 4 seconds after a spell has been cast, he/she will be able to unleash an exact duplicate of that spell. Cannot happen more than once every 2 min.

    - Improved Mirror Images ( additional copies, they mimic all of your actions, etc..).

    - Combining the defensive effects of molten armour, mage armour and frost armour might make life easier. ( view it as some sort of Elemental/Prismatic Armour)

    Keep the suggestions coming! I've seen some pretty good ideas in this thread.

    Edit:

    A Force Push spell which knocks enemies back could make Arcane more fun in PvP.
    Your suggestions (on the link as well) are all cool, flashy, shiny, nice, innovative and ridiculously overpowered

  12. #132
    Warchief Voyager's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Soviet Union
    Posts
    2,147
    So from this thread we can all conclude that the only way to fix Arcane is to get rid of Liverra? Is that correct?

  13. #133
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,018
    Quote Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
    So from this thread we can all conclude that the only way to fix Arcane is to get rid of Liverra? Is that correct?
    If you have nothing even remotely constructive to add to the discussion, don't bother typing anything at all.

  14. #134
    It seems that Arcane in MoP is a complex issue. Based on their actions Blizzard seems to think that a 2%-3% dps buff and removing the 6 second cooldown from Rune of Power is enough to make Arcane a viable spec. And Blizzard is not there alone. Christian Belt from WoW Insider writes in his latest 'Arcane Brilliance: Patch 5.1 preview for mages' column:

    "I feel like Arcane's damage is in a good place right now, and don't feel like any major changes are needed."

    Then on the other hand we have World of Logs. Ironically only five days before the latest 'Arcane Brilliance' column Brian Wood from WoW Insider published his 'State of DPS in Mists of Pandaria' column where he compared dps classes using logs from World of Logs. If Arcane is "in a good place" why the top players systematically choose other specs? I'm afraid that I don't understand how Christian defines "good". On pain of telling a self-evident fact I must say that in order to be viable a spec must offer something. And the only speciality Arcane can offer is a lack of mobility. Of course it is possible that the changes in 5.1 will make Arcane THE mage spec, but I very much doubt it.

    I don't know if it is a coincidence but it seems that the specs that were known of their burst capability in Cata (Arcane, Sub rogue) are now in poor shape in MoP. In any case patch 5.1 is almost ready so there is not much hope to get improvements to Arcane before 2013.

  15. #135
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    2,018
    And what is the "specialty" that other specs bring? Any other, not necessarily mage?

    We have to see if the number tweak for Arcane is going to fix some of the "lack of dps" issues. Also, our issue isn't damage, our issue is not being able to do damage while anything else is going on. And I'm afraid that's not going to be easy to fix in the middle of an expansion, but we will try.

    I'm currently gathering all of the ideas from this thread, and I'll (hopefully) divide them into "Doable soon" and "Doable for next beta" categories. So we'll see.

  16. #136
    Christian Belt is a good comedy writer but has never been any kind of theorycrafter or even a particularly good raider.
    He also has absolutely no influence on Blizzard.

    Don't look for more than beginner advice in that column.

  17. #137
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    The Emerald City
    Posts
    17,096
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    And what is the "specialty" that other specs bring? Any other, not necessarily mage?

    We have to see if the number tweak for Arcane is going to fix some of the "lack of dps" issues. Also, our issue isn't damage, our issue is not being able to do damage while anything else is going on. And I'm afraid that's not going to be easy to fix in the middle of an expansion, but we will try.

    I'm currently gathering all of the ideas from this thread, and I'll (hopefully) divide them into "Doable soon" and "Doable for next beta" categories. So we'll see.
    Arcane is a relatively easy fix, to my mind, at least enough to make it playable.

    1) Fix the lack of synergy with the Tier 6 talents.
    2) Provide a mobility cooldown like Spiritwalker's Grace, Arcane only.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    And what is the "specialty" that other specs bring?
    I think that you know what I meant. For example in late Cata mage specs were usually chosen like this:

    - Fire for top dps
    - Arcane for burst
    - Frost for PvP

    Of course when choosing a dps spec the main factor is the dps. Top players won't hesitate to change their spec if they get even a little more dps. However the total dps is not always the key feature. As far as I know the player who had played as a mage for years in Paragon switched to shadow priest in MoP. He said that spriest fits better into their team. Maybe because of Symbiosis?

    But at the moment I can see no reason to select any other spec than Fire for raiding. Do you?

  19. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    Your suggestions (on the link as well) are all cool, flashy, shiny, nice, innovative and ridiculously overpowered
    Well double blink in pvp in my mind would be a nerf to blink in pvp(if it works like roll for monks) as you do not use blink to gain ground most of the time, sure you can do it offensive or defensive, but thats whole cd of blink to not getting out of a stun without a trinket, and now if you could do it double, as soon as you do the first.. everybody is gonna switch to you and force defensive cooldowns out of your team. It just wouldnt work if the 2nd charge would remove roots and stuns.

  20. #140
    Keyboard Turner
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    France
    Posts
    3
    back to 4 charges and much damage with am and arcane barrage, and immun to kick and silence when arcane power is active.


    for fun(not unrealizable) : - blink with 12 sec cooldown only for arcane spec
    - a pasive talent --> the dammage took during critical attack(or basic attack why not?) is reduced to 6 % per charges

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •