Forget about chaos bolt, calling demo nerfs soon.

[Brauhm]

Uh, are you saying Chaos Wave one shots people through their defensive cooldowns? Chaos Wave crits for what, 100k with Dark Soul, trinket and tier 2 weapons? With defensive cooldowns, it wouldn't even come close to one shotting. Hell, you can pop defensive cooldowns after the Warlock casts the Chaos Waves with how slow they travel.

I feel like people who complain about warlocks must suffer from a "warlock is actually doing something" disease, where, you know, you're so dumbfounded that a warlock is doing damage that you just don't do anything and let it happen.

'Cause see, for me:

If I see a warrior go red, I pop cooldowns.

If I see a paladin with wings, I pop cooldowns.

If I see a mage turn blood red or him shooting triplets of ice lances. I pop a cool down.

If I see a hunter turn blood red or a lot of animals start ripping my back muscles apart. I pop a cool down.

BUT OH NO BIG BARNEY DEMON POPS OUT AND I'M JUST PARALYZED WITH CONFUSION ITS A WARLOCK WHY IS IT DOING DAMAGE?

This thread doesn't even make sense, please go QQ somewhere else.

[NPSlow]

To be honest, Demo's damage is only "alright" but I think the real fun factor for me in PVP is being able to survive so well on top of this incredible burst potential.

One of my favorite abilities:


Also Demonic Teleport. We'll be in real trouble when the monks learn how to use it right.

[Chainreactor]

2x Chaos Wave crits with Dark Soul deals massive damage but how much chance is their for back to back crit anyway? It rarely happens unlike Chaos Bolt which even after the nerfs is a guaranteed crit

[Zinnin]

So, while I have seen 185k crit, I have never seen anything over that. Maybe the 200k is with skull banner if he is playing with reckful?

And while it is something that can catch you off guard, a simple cc \ purge on the warlock when he pops cooldowns negates almost all of the 'insane' burst that we can do.

That said, if you have been watching my stream at all in the last few weeks, I have said over and over again how I have no idea how people aren't bitching about this. I have played against a few other demo lock teams and unless you CC them and purge of DS right when it is popped you pretty likely to feel the hurt. I would expect either a huge chaos wave nerf, or a DS nerf (90% increased damage in meta...when other two specs get 30% haste \ 30% crit).

Honestly though, when Blizz has come out and said that a warriors 200k crit is fine because you should have been paying attention to their taste of blood procs, I don't know how bad I feel about it since our burst is currently dispellable \ cc-able \ and you know...able to be lived through by popping cds (which you have plenty of time for considering Chaos Waves 3s travel time..

[wholol]

Oh my... slow down peeps,drop your machine guns and stop shooting everywhere plz ^_~

First, these type of threads always emerge, the overall theme is " omg OP nerf it ", let's go back to scratch shall we:

- one : read how much demonic fury every single ability grants a demonology specced warlock.
- two : notice how long it takes to build optimal fury for 2x chaos wave and a few demonic slashes, average is around 500-ish.
- three: start by understanding why the dmg curve is so high, compare damage with /without dark soul.
- four: do the same analysis for every single class.

Then you can begin to understand what is going on, demo lock has a higher build-up time than destro's ember resources, the amount of damage 2xchaoswaves should equate 1 Chaos bolt for the same time ( chaos bolt 3 sec ~ cast average , 2x chaoswave= 2x gcd ,1.5x2=3 secs).

Burst without dark soul is significantly less, meaning it only occurs every 2 mins, as in the real " Oh shit" if you cannot or do not know how to manage cds properly then do not blame others .

tips : damage outside meta is laughable, don't complain about demo spec in general, if u wanna nag about damage focus the topic on the issue, what's being said or debated here is that chaos wave hits too hard with DS / meta , it bloody well should given the fact that the warlock stood there running around like an idiot dotting every single thing and peeling and whatnot with having very minimal pressure for around average of 30 sec - 1 min, which is about 2-3 times longer than it takes to build an ember for destruction, and what do you expect? we end up hitting u for a wet noodle? at least we take time to build our burst.
You don't want to compare to classes? are we playing the same game? ofc we're going to compare to other classes because this is a class oriented game, there shouldn't be classes that have insanely better margins of success for very little amount of skill investment in this game where other classes have to suffer 10 times as much to achieve not even half of what some classes can ( ps : in case you do not understand, I'm talking about rogues not locks...), so you say demo has burst? welcome to MOP, be glad we have burst in a spec that very few even play, lvl a lock in case you don't have one because I'm not sure you play a lock, loggin on lock forums to complain because you got 2 shotted by a warlock simply because " omg warlocks shouldn't 2 shot me , but everything else except rogues should" is not really fair logic.

I would accept nerfs to warlocks across the board only if they reduce damage to all the other 2 shotnoskill classes running around today, if you can even compare us to them, at least to be fair we need to spend almost a minute or so building towards our burst while others only need to press a button and that's only for demo, look at other lock specs.

Remember skill and time investment before posting random details about numbers simply because all you see are numbers and the thought about seeing big numbers on a class you dislike makes you mad. true story.

PS: I'm fully decked and have around 43% pvp power and 18.5k SP with DI , I can assure you at MOST chaos wave crits for 130k(hits for less obviously, like 60-70k normal hits) on an actually pvp geared player, not random bg scrub with no pvp gear.

[Deleted]

no warlock specc has ANY damage outside of CDs+trinket. its impossible to kill as a demo if u dont have a) enough fury built up b) cds ready. clone the lock when he pops cds+trinket (every 2 min) or disable him in any other way and he wont do dmg at all.

on the other hand there are alot of classes that can just pop every cd they have right after the gate opens and kill someone. those are the classes that should be looked into, and after they are fixed if chaos wave should turn out to be too strong it can be nerfed. but atm there are other things to take care of.

[Gangresnake]

The main reasons demono is the best warlock PvP spec right now is that it's the most adapted to the current state of arena : It's 100% spam instant cast. Except portals you never cast anything.

Technically, destro have a better burst, affli a better sustained, but since they have to actually cast things, they are just obsoletes.

[Gohzerlock]

The main reasons demono is the best warlock PvP spec right now is that it's the most adapted to the current state of arena : It's 100% spam instant cast. Except portals you never cast anything.

Technically, destro have a better burst, affli a better sustained, but since they have to actually cast things, they are just obsoletes.

100% spam instant cast.... you know, after you've corrupted the target doom'd.. that gets dispelled, you hit like a noodle with long channeled spells or fel flame then life tap like a madman. Until some idiot team lets you build up enough fury to actually be viable.

You know... as opposed to say, being able to use all your cds out the door like almost every other class?

[Jessicka]

People just see a Warlock spamming Fel Flame and doing nothing for 30? 40? 50? seconds. Ignore it because they're like 'Oh, that Fel Flame isn't doing much.' Then go all 'OMGQQWTFBBQSAUCE' because after an actual eternity, the Warlock is able to actually do something useful. Meanwhile, they wasted all that time when they could force Ember Tap if Destro, or Dark Apotheosis if Demo and prevent any damage from ever happening. If people are too stupid to learn, they deserve to get hit for 400k in 2 globals; even then it probably wont even kill them.

[Tya]

MoP destro/demo warlocks:
Spam fel flame for 1min 40 sec
Burst for 20 sec
Spam fel flame for 1min 40 sec
Burst for 20 sec

Resource farming and having to wait for Dark Soul are the two silliest things with the class right now.

[Simplexity]

100% spam instant cast.... you know, after you've corrupted the target doom'd.. that gets dispelled, you hit like a noodle with long channeled spells or fel flame then life tap like a madman. Until some idiot team lets you build up enough fury to actually be viable.

You know... as opposed to say, being able to use all your cds out the door like almost every other class?

It's your fault if you don't have the awareness to take advantage of the dispel system (healer dispels Doom/Corruption - put his teammate in a full Fear). You're overestimating the time it takes to build fury, it's really not that hard and remember you have an AoE Curse of Enfeeblement to stop damage.

Yeah, so played this spec in 3s for the first time yesterday. LOL. I kid you not, in 15 games (went 12-2 at 2100 with trade chat people not counting a DC) the only spells that I had to cast were Hellfire and the occasional Soul Fire, so it didn't matter if I got kicked on Fire. Everything else that you do in this spec is instant. Blade's Edge and Dalaran Sewers are even more warlock-friendly maps because this spec has a 12 sec CD knockoff. The difference between Demo and Destro burst is that it's a lot easier to stop a 2 second Chaos Bolt than react in one GCD to an instant Chaos Wave. I'm getting Tier 2 wep next week so I'm looking forward to testing out the damage.

[pokeadott]

Yeah, I'm jumping on the bus. It's too frustrating to build embers forever only to have bad fear pathing, a team with a clue about cc, etc stop your only shot at a kill. Demo builds Fury very quickly (much easier to early burst as demo vs destro - not close actually) and the instant nature is great. Add in knockbacks for Z axis and Aura of Awesomeness and it adds to up a very decent spec.

You're still just a BF bitch between burst windows, but at least you can help with some instant burst even w/o DS if your teamate gets a kill window between CDs. Never casting is pretty nice.

[Zmaniac17]

This goes off the radar because it's hard to do this and even harder to set it up. Beckinsale's team makes it look simple. When I saw them playing they were 2/2 vs reckful. The first two times beckinsale's team lost to their shaman getting killed almost instantly. And they were both complaining about each others comps.

[Chainreactor]

I dont know if many ppl are aware of this but as Demonology Demonic Circle has separate CDs for Caster and Meta

[pokeadott]

I dont know if many ppl are aware of this but as Demonology Demonic Circle has separate CDs for Caster and Meta

O.o

foreals?

[Supernex]

O.o

foreals?

*waves hand* No, this does not work...

[Tya]

I dont know if many ppl are aware of this but as Demonology Demonic Circle has separate CDs for Caster and Meta

Wow that's hilarious. Really. I can't wait to abuse the hell out of this in arena and rbgs.

[wholol]

does it cost fury then ? if so, how much ?

[Tya]

Yes and 40.