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  1. #1001
    Armory is: eu battle.net/wow/en/character/anachronos/Cairra/advanced

    Healing in a 10 man with a Mistweaver, just wanted to ask would it be worth going for the 7170 bp or just focus on mastery as the MW is covering the raid already in HoTs?

  2. #1002
    Quote Originally Posted by Cairra View Post
    Armory is: eu battle.net/wow/en/character/anachronos/Cairra/advanced

    Healing in a 10 man with a Mistweaver, just wanted to ask would it be worth going for the 7170 bp or just focus on mastery as the MW is covering the raid already in HoTs?
    Honestly, if I were you I would just go with a full out mastery build. Let the non absorb classes deal with their non absorbs. I heal with a disc priest and a shaman so I focused more on the 7170 breakpoint and blanketing EFs everywhere. 10m is a whole different ball game for holy paladins right now, and we seem to be the star player. (maybe it's just me)

  3. #1003
    Quick question I've currently got heroic horridon and normal siegecrafter trinket (to go along with the amplifying trinket)

    Which of the two should i upgrade and keep?

  4. #1004
    Quote Originally Posted by Brucewilly View Post
    Quick question I've currently got heroic horridon and normal siegecrafter trinket (to go along with the amplifying trinket)

    Which of the two should i upgrade and keep?
    the siegecrafter trinket have a lot more INT and the spirit proc its also buffed by your amp trinket.

  5. #1005
    Hi, ive never before been a holy pally and i want to really get into it, im mainly a ret a pally but now i want to be good a holy pally too so i can go on runs with my guild, and i seem to be having trouble with healing, i dont really know the rotation properly and i have used mr.robot to help me out with enchants and reforging and that, my ilvl in holy spec is 510 and i really only do about 25-30k hps on average when im in a raid, and ive seen other hpallies at my ilvl and lower do like 10-20k hps more then me, so now i want to ask how can get better at healing? what am i doing wrong?

    Armory: http : // us . battle. net /wow/en/character/ frostmourne/ Osram/ simple

    world of logs: http : // www . worldoflogs. com /reports / 464qk0149sbql9za /

  6. #1006
    Armory Link: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...%AEke/advanced
    Alternate Specs/Glyphs: Divine Purpose & Light's Hammer on Thok
    Worldoflogs Link: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/q...m/healingDone/ is most recent log.
    Questions, concerns, expectations: I don't know if I'm where I'm supposed to be, but compared to the other healers in the group I'm one of the lowest on most, if not all, fights.
    Description of Playstyle: Spamming Holy Radiance and Eternal Flame, Holy Prism off CD, I have yet to learn when to pop CDs at optimal times, still getting used to the class and when I do want to use my CDs the other healers have everyone back to full so it seems like a waste.

    I'm using AMR to get to second haste breakpoint and trying to get up to 30% mastery (since changing from 1 HBP dropped it significantly, used to be at around 33%). I also am running 25 man SoO.

  7. #1007
    Quote Originally Posted by Cairra View Post
    Armory is: eu battle.net/wow/en/character/anachronos/Cairra/advanced

    Healing in a 10 man with a Mistweaver, just wanted to ask would it be worth going for the 7170 bp or just focus on mastery as the MW is covering the raid already in HoTs?
    I wouldn't really recommend a full mastery build as I think with the nerf to IH it's not as good as a semi-haste build. If you can get up to either the 3506 or 7170 breakpoint for EF without sacrificing too much mastery (keeping it around 30%) still with a decent amount of spirit, I would recommend trying that out. Otherwise, socketing Int primarily will currently outperform a pure mastery build IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brucewilly View Post
    Quick question I've currently got heroic horridon and normal siegecrafter trinket (to go along with the amplifying trinket)

    Which of the two should i upgrade and keep?
    DSD is a more steady mana return while HLG has a chance to provide you with abnormally large amounts of mana. Would probably recommend DSD upgraded as well. I'm not so sure why you'd keep the amplification trinket over using both DSD and HLG and gemming a lot more in to secondary stats than spirit though. The Amp trinket provides us with either 2-3.5% mastery or 2-3.5% haste while the two trinkets will give you static intellect plus both bringing in around 100,000 mana.

    Quote Originally Posted by chovie23q View Post
    Hi, ive never before been a holy pally and i want to really get into it, im mainly a ret a pally but now i want to be good a holy pally too so i can go on runs with my guild, and i seem to be having trouble with healing, i dont really know the rotation properly and i have used mr.robot to help me out with enchants and reforging and that, my ilvl in holy spec is 510 and i really only do about 25-30k hps on average when im in a raid, and ive seen other hpallies at my ilvl and lower do like 10-20k hps more then me, so now i want to ask how can get better at healing? what am i doing wrong?

    Armory: http : // us . battle. net /wow/en/character/ frostmourne/ Osram/ simple

    world of logs: http : // www . worldoflogs. com /reports / 464qk0149sbql9za /
    The log that you've linked is 2 LFR kills which I don't think are very good comparisons to draw conclusions from. There is a lot of meter padding, ignoring of mechanics that would in normal raids kill you etc that goes on in LFR. That being said a few suggestions on glyphs. The change to the DP glyph makes it so it will return less mana to you as the cost of not having the buff dispelled such as in PvP. It's not viable in PvE anymore. The glyph of LoD is actually a healing loss and even more so in a 25 man setting. In raid environments, paladins shouldn't be using FoL that often so your FoL glyph is largely useless. Recommend going glyphs such as Divinity, Beacon of Light and Hand of Sacrifice which are more or less the 3 best in almost any setting now a days. You beacon wasn't on any targets for the the Megaera fight most likely an oversight? Your primary spells should consist of things like HR and HS. Pay attention to your Daybreak spells as I think you should be making more use out of that.I do believe Holy Avenger to be better for Megaera and maybe Ji-Kun. Other than this, your HS and cooldown usage are decent. It may just be that holy paladins aren't excelling very well in the 25 man setting compared to the priests and druids.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ovaldo View Post
    snip
    I think you're overkilling your spirit currently. For normal modes, I'd almost cut down on your spirit by a few thousand. An alternative gemmign strategy I've seen is successful is a heavy intellect/mastery build with reforging to spirit but also maintaining a higher mastery. As I said about I don't think holy paladins are ina great place in 25 man. But that being said, with your haste build you should probably be getting a higher count of holy shocks. Make sure you swap your BoL to the active tank. I saw 2 uses of Avenging Wrath in your logs on 5 bosses so if you use your cooldowns at a regular pace in preparation for boss abilities I think your healing will go up a lot.

  8. #1008

    Obstacle

    Greetings

    First things first:

    u.battle.net/wow/en/character/kul-tiras/Aethernus/simple armory log
    ww.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-o6b023nh8ph7x0qk/[/url] raid 10.10.2013
    ww.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-xx1lszll978kzpzd/[/url] raid 09.10.2013
    ww.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-4rxgif2a3qk95ofn/[/url] raid 25.09.2013

    So yesterday we got to the point when my fellow guildies couldnt carry me anymore through SoO. My guild runs 25 mans (normals so far). Usual healing setup is 2 resto druids, 2 holy pallies (inc me) and 2 holy priests. Before we got to Thok i was able to get away with my crap healing due to character of encounters, but Thok is unforgiving if you dont perform as a healer which is my case. After dreadful evening full of wipes, i think i was an obstacle in further progress ( 2 potent dpsers had to switch to heal and we werent able to dps him down fast enough). I'm using AMR build with 1st haste cap static 14000 spirit cap set. Usually i use EF, HP, DP base talents, but im going to switch to HA to have a holy power generation burst... thank you for any feedback on my post (slack, criticism whatever), i want to participate in my guild progress not obstruct it...

    Ps. sorry for removing some letters from links, Im not allowed to post them yet

  9. #1009
    For Thok specific go Selfless Healer. It is a much better specc for that fight. Go max Mastery and literally no spirit. We are currently progressing that fight (HC) and I go with 9k spirit because I cant go less with my gear. With SFH you barely ever cast. Most of the spells will be instant casts and therefore you wont be interrupted by the screeches. Bubble yourself if it goes to higher stacks and BoP some of the other healers (time this with them so they can use the BoP effectively).

    I didnt go through all logs but just by looking at the longer attempts I can see that you barely ever use your CDs. And that will be one major problem. You have very strong CDs and should try to use them as often as possible during the fights. Try to learn where the DMG is higher and time your CDs accordingly.

    Also DONT use HolyLight. Its not worth it. You should try to maximise HolyPower generation. You do that by keeping HS on CD and using HR to build HP.
    Last edited by Tungzten; 2013-10-11 at 02:40 PM.

  10. #1010
    I guess I don't get why people push mastery so hard. It is a valuable stat but I can promise you that full haste builds stomp mastery builds in output (If you use eternal flame) and I'm pretty sure that i've seen charts mathed out to prove this. For 10 man at least. I sit at 22ish% mastery hitting the 10870 haste breakpoint (actually just over 11k) and my output is extremely high. My spirit sits just under 17k and have 0 mana issues. The bonus of so much haste is more than extra ticks, it gives you the ability to keep up with the spiking damage on a moments notice.

    I personally have tested both mastery builds and haste builds for 10 man (I heal with a disc priest) and haste dwarfs the numbers. On the normal side of things I find it easy to 2 heal 13/14 bosses...the one 3 healed boss is thok because holy crap do those dispels blow. Once again this is only for people using Eternal Flame talents not SH or SS.

  11. #1011
    Quote Originally Posted by Aethernus View Post
    Greetings

    First things first:

    u.battle.net/wow/en/character/kul-tiras/Aethernus/simple armory log
    ww.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-o6b023nh8ph7x0qk/[/url] raid 10.10.2013
    ww.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-xx1lszll978kzpzd/[/url] raid 09.10.2013
    ww.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-4rxgif2a3qk95ofn/[/url] raid 25.09.2013

    So yesterday we got to the point when my fellow guildies couldnt carry me anymore through SoO. My guild runs 25 mans (normals so far). Usual healing setup is 2 resto druids, 2 holy pallies (inc me) and 2 holy priests. Before we got to Thok i was able to get away with my crap healing due to character of encounters, but Thok is unforgiving if you dont perform as a healer which is my case. After dreadful evening full of wipes, i think i was an obstacle in further progress ( 2 potent dpsers had to switch to heal and we werent able to dps him down fast enough). I'm using AMR build with 1st haste cap static 14000 spirit cap set. Usually i use EF, HP, DP base talents, but im going to switch to HA to have a holy power generation burst... thank you for any feedback on my post (slack, criticism whatever), i want to participate in my guild progress not obstruct it...

    Ps. sorry for removing some letters from links, Im not allowed to post them yet

    Only reason I post here is because I really like your attitude. Realizing that you have room for improvement (everyone does, not only you) is the first step to becoming a good player.

    I am by no means a paladin expert, but here are some things I noticed by looking at your last Thok try (biggest duration) of 10.10:

    - In a 8min32sec fight you cast 38 Holy Shocks (buffs cast --> power gains). That's one Holy Shock every 13.5 seconds which is very low. You should have at least close to one HS every 8 seconds. Get an addon like weak auras or tellmewhen and I make a big icon to show in the middle of your screen every time HS comes of CD. If it helps you, you could also add a sound to play every time it's off cd.

    -You spend all your Holy Power on Light of Dawn. I'll let someone else comment on whether this is optimal for 25m paladins, but in any case if you're only using eternal flame so little in that fight you're probably served better with another T45 talent.

    -Are you using Divine Plea? There are a lot of opportunities to use it, especially on Thok while you are running around for example.

    - You only started using cooldowns on the last try? You should make sure to never forget to use them, especially as a paladin because they are pretty cooldown-centric.

    Finding a new weapon and a trinket to replace that horrible megaera trinket is also a huge priority for you now, but I guess you already know that.

  12. #1012
    I see we're currently discussing Thok, it just so happens my guild downed Thok(normal) last night, 3 hours, 16 attempts.

    I'm looking for some advice on how to improve myself, please criticize where needed.

    Armory: us.battle.net/wow/en/character/bleeding-hollow/Lavidaloca/advanced
    WoL for all Thok pulls: worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ubqzk2kngj5v2vyv/sum/healingDone/?enc=bosses&boss=71529

    Before the raid, I checked out what most paladins on WoL are using for this fight, and most are using EF, so, the very first attempt, I was Eternal Flame & Holy Avenger build, however it wasn't great for me, all pulls after that was SH & Divine Purpose, including the kill.

    I understand Shamans are pretty amazing this patch and it's tough competition, however, I feel my heals are very low compared to his, as well as the disc priest's.

    What I lack in heals, I try to make up in utility, such as BoP my shaman and priest, followed by aura mastery, so we can stay in P1 as long as possible.

    Is it normal that I'm getting crushed this badly on Thok? HS, Judgment, CS, LoD, HR is the general spam rotation, of course HR reduced as Screenches increased.

    Additionally, I want input on how to build my paladin to coexist with the other 2 healers, Shaman & Disc. On fights where we can 2-heal, the shaman goes Enhance, therefore it leaves myself and the disc 2-healing. While I can easily attain the 2nd haste breakpoint for EF, I've read that EF build doesn't play well with disc and it can cause a lot of overhealing, therefore I am current SH (which is awesome, reforging out of spirit feels fantastic).

    Should I switch to EF? Since going SH, anything else makes me feel like I'm Holy Power starved. It's addictive how SH plays, but I wouldn't mind going back to EF & HA if it's a better compliment to a disc priest. (I really want him to go Holy, but he doesn't want to, and I'm not going to force him, we're not that hardcore).

    Thanks fellas.

  13. #1013
    Quote Originally Posted by Royals Ego View Post
    I see we're currently discussing Thok, it just so happens my guild downed Thok(normal) last night, 3 hours, 16 attempts.

    I'm looking for some advice on how to improve myself, please criticize where needed.

    Armory: us.battle.net/wow/en/character/bleeding-hollow/Lavidaloca/advanced
    WoL for all Thok pulls: worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ubqzk2kngj5v2vyv/sum/healingDone/?enc=bosses&boss=71529

    Before the raid, I checked out what most paladins on WoL are using for this fight, and most are using EF, so, the very first attempt, I was Eternal Flame & Holy Avenger build, however it wasn't great for me, all pulls after that was SH & Divine Purpose, including the kill.

    I understand Shamans are pretty amazing this patch and it's tough competition, however, I feel my heals are very low compared to his, as well as the disc priest's.

    What I lack in heals, I try to make up in utility, such as BoP my shaman and priest, followed by aura mastery, so we can stay in P1 as long as possible.

    Is it normal that I'm getting crushed this badly on Thok? HS, Judgment, CS, LoD, HR is the general spam rotation, of course HR reduced as Screenches increased.

    Additionally, I want input on how to build my paladin to coexist with the other 2 healers, Shaman & Disc. On fights where we can 2-heal, the shaman goes Enhance, therefore it leaves myself and the disc 2-healing. While I can easily attain the 2nd haste breakpoint for EF, I've read that EF build doesn't play well with disc and it can cause a lot of overhealing, therefore I am current SH (which is awesome, reforging out of spirit feels fantastic).

    Should I switch to EF? Since going SH, anything else makes me feel like I'm Holy Power starved. It's addictive how SH plays, but I wouldn't mind going back to EF & HA if it's a better compliment to a disc priest. (I really want him to go Holy, but he doesn't want to, and I'm not going to force him, we're not that hardcore).

    Thanks fellas.
    We have kinda the same gear (you have better trinkets Q_Q)

    My kill was 1min ~ faster than yours and i have almost 16 more holy shock than you, you get a total of 129 holy power and i get 157. I use EF with holy avenger, also try to use more your CD. Ignore your recount in fights with low damage any other healer will stomp us, the only fights where i can fight and beat him is malkorok, thok*, spoil, garrosh.

  14. #1014
    I 2 heal with a disc priest....I let her worry about bubbles.....haste and EF complimented with disc is a very strong pairing. As for Thok, with my haste as high as it is I can get a holy radiance off between every screech. I stay EF haste for every fight btw and never get beat on meters regardless of fight. I'm too competitive to lose!

  15. #1015
    @pallyopness
    Could you provide an armory link please?

    I am currently sitting at 43% mastery buffed with ~4800 haste...
    I could reach the 4th and 5th haste breakpoint...the last one would drop me down to ~25% mastery...and i'm not sure if it's worth it :/
    I find it hard to factor in haste into the calculations...sure...it gives you faster casts, a shorter HS cd thus more HP to spend and the EF ticks...but dropping 18% shieldpower of every heal...phew...dunno...
    Last edited by Vallerian; 2013-10-11 at 07:41 PM.

  16. #1016
    Armory- http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...rusader/simple
    World of Logs-http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-j63n4n5t480hdwee/sum/healingDone/?s=6055&e=6478-General 2 healed
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...66&e=3323-Iron Jug 2 healed
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...79&e=8074-Malk 3 healed
    My concerns-I listed a fight that we 2 heal and 2 fights we 3 heal. For whatever reason our thok kill didnt actually log so im not going to link that even though its something i wanted to show as a comparison also.

    My biggest concern is should i be going for the next haste breakpoint of EF with my current gear, and also is my gemming incorrect?
    I see tons and tons of top holy pallys gemming INT. I also see tons of top holy pallys gemming mastery and artful gems. I am currently at 18k spirit with a heroic horridon trinket (just got it). Sometimes i feel like its way to much on the majority of fights but on fights like Fallen Champs will all the dispelling going out, it feels right(only fight). I gemmed so much spirit cuz i figured with us starting to 2 heal alot more and pushing into heroics, itd be the way to go but maybe im wrong. WHen the blackfuse trinket drops its going to me. Ive heard alot of debate about it but I was thinking i should go blackfuse trinket and the sha AMP trinket, but ive seen people say to run the blackfuse trinket and the heroic Horridon on but I havent had it fully explained how it would be better than the amp trinket. But i could see it could let me lower my spirit alot.

    I heal with a very good MW monk that is hard to get better HPS just hoping my logs show you something im not doing correct and maybe you can help me beat him! Fights we 3 heal, he normally crushes everyone. On all but like 2 fights when we 2 heal were fairly close. Thanks in advance

    EDIT: I am not in Heroics yet only normals, but will be in heroics in about 2 weeks.
    Last edited by pretiwhitboy; 2013-10-12 at 04:23 AM.

  17. #1017
    Armory: WoW EU: Hoozio - Argent Dawn (Cannot post links :[)

    - Debating and never coming to a solid conclusion about Haste vs Mastery. At the moment I'm going with around 13/13.5k spirit and hitting the 3506 breakpoint then mastery afterwards. Not sure if hitting the next breakpoint yet would be of benefit or not.

    I heal in raid with a disc priest and a resto druid, however I reliably come out top on every fight with my shield being the biggest heal.

    Any help/advice would be appreciated.

    Hooz

  18. #1018
    The Patient
    Join Date
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    Utrecht, Holland
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    Quote Originally Posted by pretiwhitboy View Post
    text
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/1z96m...?s=9722&e=9968 my malkork
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=7779&e=8074 your malkorok

    if you look at yours and mine malkorok kill, you see that your shock usage is 20% lower, yet your fight lasts 25% longer. This is something you can certainly work on, and using HR(or flash/divine in my case with a full ranged group) to maximize holy power gain grants you alot more EF casts. No use of GoAK, 1 HA cast during the kill and 15 EF's less than I did in a shorter fight. What I would personally do in a 10N fight is to keep EF on everyone, even if that means 1 hopo EF's. call this whorign if you want, but at least you contribute to keeping the shields alive, and you can try to get out as much 2 or 3 hopo EF's as possible. HA is a great tool here, try and use it as much as possible, 3 hopo EF on the whole raid is 300k hps for 30 seconds which is a huge survivability increase for the whole group since is pretty much outheals the dot on it's own, and will make the beacon's shield being maxed out all the time.

  19. #1019
    Quote Originally Posted by Viriel View Post
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/1z96m...?s=9722&e=9968 my malkork
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=7779&e=8074 your malkorok

    if you look at yours and mine malkorok kill, you see that your shock usage is 20% lower, yet your fight lasts 25% longer. This is something you can certainly work on, and using HR(or flash/divine in my case with a full ranged group) to maximize holy power gain grants you alot more EF casts. No use of GoAK, 1 HA cast during the kill and 15 EF's less than I did in a shorter fight. What I would personally do in a 10N fight is to keep EF on everyone, even if that means 1 hopo EF's. call this whorign if you want, but at least you contribute to keeping the shields alive, and you can try to get out as much 2 or 3 hopo EF's as possible. HA is a great tool here, try and use it as much as possible, 3 hopo EF on the whole raid is 300k hps for 30 seconds which is a huge survivability increase for the whole group since is pretty much outheals the dot on it's own, and will make the beacon's shield being maxed out all the time.

    Thx I will do that for me is my hardest fight to focus on for some reason and I get caught up saving some CDs for oh shit moments

    Any thought on my gemming and reforging pertaining to all fights in general? I feel I'm doing it wrong and want to improve.

  20. #1020
    The Patient
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by pretiwhitboy View Post
    Thx I will do that for me is my hardest fight to focus on for some reason and I get caught up saving some CDs for oh shit moments

    Any thought on my gemming and reforging pertaining to all fights in general? I feel I'm doing it wrong and want to improve.
    You have a bit too much spirit for my personal taste, but spirit is an example of personal preference. That's the only thing I can say really on gemming, talents look fine aswell, but I have no personal experience with the divine plea glyph, so I have no clue if it is better than the tooltip suggests, cause I dont personally use it.

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