[Holy] Fix my Heals!

[Kyaza]

2* (x/6) = y, where x = fight duration (in seconds) and y = total HP benchmark to aim for, so a 10 minute fight would be 600/6 *2 = 120 HP gen ideal from all sources, it doesn't work very well with HA and other such mechanics but it gives you a general idea

Theres also, x/6 = HS benchmark, more HS HP gains than that = good, less = bad

And don't worry about being bad with Maths, I'm terrible with algebra so doing these expressions took a bit more thinking than I'd of liked :/ once you've done it a few times it becomes very easy and you just open the calculator and automatically type it so don't worry

Also the DP glyph doesn't MS, its just a flat 50% off all the base DP stats now

Thank you SO MUCH for the equation.

One question though...

Using that equation for a 10 minute fight.
x = 600
x/6 = 600/6 = 100

Then

2* (600/6) = y
2* (100) = y
200 = y

So wouldn't the HP benchmark be 200, not 120?


Now if I take that equation and use it for the 7:01 fight I was reviewing...

x = 421
x/6 = 70.1 ... rounding down to 70

so then
2* (421/6) = y
2* (70) = y
140 = y

So for a 7 minute fight, the HP benchmark should be ~140.

Feel free to check my math.

[Xs]

So wouldn't the HP benchmark be 200, not 120?

Yeah, derp, thats what I get for trying to do maths during the raid break. Other than me being dumb thats all correct

[Kyaza]

You said you were bad with algebra, but you came up with the equation!

I'm good at working equations, but I can't create them.

It seems like we have the opposite problem of each other :P

[bouchbagfett]

I'm good at working equations, but I can't create them.

I can't follow why you are trying to find out how many 6 second rotations take place in a fight and are multiplying that by 2. Why is someone doing 2 HP EF's? Why is 6.0sec the number one should take to finish that rotation for the course of a fight?

[Kyaza]

@ Bouchbagette

You'll need to go back a couple pages and take a look at my WoL analysis of another hpally to figure out where Xs equation came from.

[bouchbagfett]

@ Bouchbagette

You'll need to go back a couple pages and take a look at my WoL analysis of another hpally to figure out where Xs equation came from.

I did see and read it but it doesn't make any sense. You talk about a 2 hp rotation and xs lists both 2 and 3 hp rotations. And the 6sec seems arbitrary. How do you get a value of 6?

[Shinra1]

Sorry to interrupt the math talk. But I was wondering which 2 gems I should be using for the JC bonus. I know JC is a crap proffession but I cannot afford to change it atm.

So 320 int x2 or 480mastery x2?

I should mention I'm gemming pure 320 mastery in yellow slots + slots that the socket bonus award 60+int or spirit/haste. For the red ones those artful gems.

Any help appreciated.

[Xs]

I did see and read it but it doesn't make any sense. You talk about a 2 hp rotation and xs lists both 2 and 3 hp rotations. And the 6sec seems arbitrary. How do you get a value of 6?

You take the time
You divide that by the number of standard Holy Shock rotation times to get the benchmark for HS casts
You times that by two to give you an idea of total HP gained in a more real environment (usually HR HP is fairly equal to HS HP over a fight, give or take a few extra)
Obviously in the real world, your HS is on a less than 6 cooldown and you have the potential to cast 2 HRs in that cycle, but this is only simple maths to give an idea of performance before you take a closer look
Its not supposed to be for a 2 HP EF rotation, its just a generalization that you very rarely get to do the perfect HR>HR>HS rotation, but more likely HR>x>HS>HR>EF>HS>x>HR>HS etc.

[Viriel]

Sorry to interrupt the math talk. But I was wondering which 2 gems I should be using for the JC bonus. I know JC is a crap proffession but I cannot afford to change it atm.

So 320 int x2 or 480mastery x2?

I should mention I'm gemming pure 320 mastery in yellow slots + slots that the socket bonus award 60+int or spirit/haste. For the red ones those artful gems.

Any help appreciated.

Since it is twice the value of int, and 1.5 times the value of mastery(compared to a normal gem), I would personally go with int.

[bouchbagfett]

Depends on how you value the stats. If you are valuing Mastery to be 0.8 and Intellect 1.0 then Mastery will win both times. If you value mastery at 0.67 or less then the intellect gem will win.

[UR1L]

Sup,

Tonight we really struggled on Garrosh normal and there was a noticeable lack in healing. I can't help but feel like I'm playing badly here. Mostly on empowered whilring corruption as I have to move from shit while the raid is taking alot of damage. My fellow raid members also seemed to have an issue standing within 10 yards for Holy Radiance aswell when possible so that didn't help either.
If you could check the logs/armory for any obvious mistakes I'm making that would be great. Feels like I need to improve loads before heroics.

Thanks!

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...lmanz/advanced

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/p...ses&boss=71865

[Xs]

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...lmanz/advanced

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/p...ses&boss=71865

Only thing I can really pull out is you've got a lot of Crusader Strike and Tower of Radiance procs that you don't really need, remember that HR>DL even if it only hits 2 targets, and Crusader Strike is pretty much a waste of time specially in a 2 healing situation, every time you use CS you're dropping behind on healing/bubbles which potentially could be a big problem.

You might want to try out the next Haste breakpoint if your mana is sitting fairly good, I found it helped out a lot in 10 mans.

[PosPosPos]

Sup,

Tonight we really struggled on Garrosh normal and there was a noticeable lack in healing. I can't help but feel like I'm playing badly here. Mostly on empowered whilring corruption as I have to move from shit while the raid is taking alot of damage. My fellow raid members also seemed to have an issue standing within 10 yards for Holy Radiance aswell when possible so that didn't help either.
If you could check the logs/armory for any obvious mistakes I'm making that would be great. Feels like I need to improve loads before heroics.

Thanks!

Minor:
1) Glorious Stats gives more mileage than Mighty Spirit(chest enchant)
2) You should macro Arcane Torrent with Divine Plea(same cd and all)

Major:
1) Glyph of Divinity isn't slotted, and by extension, you aren't running unbreakable spirit on a magic heavy fight.
2) Light's Hammer - useful for 1st phase and maybe the first part of 2nd phase. In other words, it's useful for the parts of the fight you shouldn't have problems healing, but useless for the parts of the fight you have problems healing(empowered whirling corruption/final burn phase). Slot Holy Prism for this.
3) Holy Radiance usage low, Crusader Strike shouldn't even be touched at all.
4) 7170 haste smooths out cast times and rotations.

[nightfalls]

2) You should macro Arcane Torrent with Divine Plea(same cd and all)

Would not recommend. Other advice is a little bit questionable, but I don't disagree with all of it. Certain a lot more debatable than "Major" would imply.

[Piando]

Sup,

Tonight we really struggled on Garrosh normal and there was a noticeable lack in healing. I can't help but feel like I'm playing badly here. Mostly on empowered whilring corruption as I have to move from shit while the raid is taking alot of damage. My fellow raid members also seemed to have an issue standing within 10 yards for Holy Radiance aswell when possible so that didn't help either.
If you could check the logs/armory for any obvious mistakes I'm making that would be great. Feels like I need to improve loads before heroics.

Thanks!

Well, using cooldown during Empowered Whirling Corruption is necessary. So spare your Devotion Aura for that. I also like to use Holy Avenger during that phase just to spread those Eternal Flames (I don't even care if HR heals all targets, it's just for HP generation). And if you struggle moving then just cheat and pop Divine Shield.
You can tell your raid to use personals or a healthstone aswell. Most dps tend to forget to use the healthstone and it's quite funny to call out in TS and seeing all healthbars going up for 200k.

[UR1L]

Only thing I can really pull out is you've got a lot of Crusader Strike and Tower of Radiance procs that you don't really need, remember that HR>DL even if it only hits 2 targets, and Crusader Strike is pretty much a waste of time specially in a 2 healing situation, every time you use CS you're dropping behind on healing/bubbles which potentially could be a big problem.

You might want to try out the next Haste breakpoint if your mana is sitting fairly good, I found it helped out a lot in 10 mans.

Yeah I started to notice Crusader Striking was bad. But when moving and HS was on cooldown I didn't really think of anything better to do. I used DLs because only the tank was taking damage most of the time and I didn't really feel the druid's hots were doing much to keep him up.(she was new with us so couldn't really 'trust' her healing, if you know what I mean) But I'll try to hard-code using HR instead into my brain. I'll also try the next breakpoint after our x-mas break. I felt my regen hurt a bit without our usual healer's mana tide but will have to adjust to playing without it.

Minor:
1) Glorious Stats gives more mileage than Mighty Spirit(chest enchant)
2) You should macro Arcane Torrent with Divine Plea(same cd and all)

Major:
1) Glyph of Divinity isn't slotted, and by extension, you aren't running unbreakable spirit on a magic heavy fight.
2) Light's Hammer - useful for 1st phase and maybe the first part of 2nd phase. In other words, it's useful for the parts of the fight you shouldn't have problems healing, but useless for the parts of the fight you have problems healing(empowered whirling corruption/final burn phase). Slot Holy Prism for this.
3) Holy Radiance usage low, Crusader Strike shouldn't even be touched at all.
4) 7170 haste smooths out cast times and rotations.

minor:

1) probably yeah, will change that
2) absolutely not. the aoe interrupt is very useful and if I don't need it I can use them at the same time without macroing them.

major:

1) I use it on garrosh instead of BoL glyph but switch back to BoL after so I don't forget to. I don't need it on other fights.
2) Our AoE healing was seriously lacking because of rangeds not standing as close as they should for HR when possible. Being frustrated doesn't even begin describing my feelings when I see rangeds standing 20+ yards away from the boss during transition phases for example. Using Light's hammer helped during transitions and non empowered whirling so I chose it. But will revert back to Prism when we fix those parts.
3) explained that above, and CS is useful when moving and there's nothing else to do.
4) also hurts mana alot especially with no mana tide. but will test it after our x-mas break.

[Berianther]

Btw, arcane torrent doesn't work reliably all the time, and if you have to rely on that for aoe interrupt on 10 man with only 2 interrupt targets, your dps/tanks are doing something really wrong.
On empowered whirling, you're gonna have to coordinate raid cds for them. You have good throughput raid cds, and devotion aura.

[Xs]

Yeah I started to notice Crusader Striking was bad. But when moving and HS was on cooldown I didn't really think of anything better to do. I used DLs because only the tank was taking damage most of the time and I didn't really feel the druid's hots were doing much to keep him up.(she was new with us so couldn't really 'trust' her healing, if you know what I mean) But I'll try to hard-code using HR instead into my brain. I'll also try the next breakpoint after our x-mas break. I felt my regen hurt a bit without our usual healer's mana tide but will have to adjust to playing without it.

4) also hurts mana alot especially with no mana tide. but will test it after our x-mas break.

You can easily run the 7170 build with DSoD, PPoP, LMG and 15.5-16k Spirit w/o external modifiers, its really not that bad, just try to avoid slotting Haste unless its like a 160 gem to get you perfectly capped. But as Berianther says, I'd recommend not saving AT as an interrupt, if you need more than your default interrupt and everyone else's then theres something quite wrong.

[Viriel]

Yeah I started to notice Crusader Striking was bad. But when moving and HS was on cooldown I didn't really think of anything better to do. I used DLs because only the tank was taking damage most of the time and I didn't really feel the druid's hots were doing much to keep him up.(she was new with us so couldn't really 'trust' her healing, if you know what I mean) But I'll try to hard-code using HR instead into my brain. I'll also try the next breakpoint after our x-mas break. I felt my regen hurt a bit without our usual healer's mana tide but will have to adjust to playing without it.

minor:

1) probably yeah, will change that
2) absolutely not. the aoe interrupt is very useful and if I don't need it I can use them at the same time without macroing them.

major:

1) I use it on garrosh instead of BoL glyph but switch back to BoL after so I don't forget to. I don't need it on other fights.
2) Our AoE healing was seriously lacking because of rangeds not standing as close as they should for HR when possible. Being frustrated doesn't even begin describing my feelings when I see rangeds standing 20+ yards away from the boss during transition phases for example. Using Light's hammer helped during transitions and non empowered whirling so I chose it. But will revert back to Prism when we fix those parts.
3) explained that above, and CS is useful when moving and there's nothing else to do.
4) also hurts mana alot especially with no mana tide. but will test it after our x-mas break.

There are 2 tanks and 6 dps. 2 people get mindcontrolled. Why is it your job to interrupt as a healer, with a racial even? Especially when 1 healer get's MC you should never have to interrupt. Besides that, it doesn't work in p3 afaik, and that's the part of the fight for which I have my interrupt bound.

Divinity is my preffered glyph over BoL. I don't switch often, but I do use LoH often. It's a choice you make, either is good, but for e divinity was reason to drop some spirit.

If your aoe healing is lacking because ranged are not stacked, why do you even bother taking hammer? Prism is and will be my way to go, even when perfectly stacked.

Holy Radiance already has use if you hit 2 people. Hit both tanks and it's beneficial, hit 2+ ranged and it works. Use it, CS is bad imo, especially since it can be dodged/parried. Save up hopo for moving parts? The healing isnt that demanding often, unless youre behind because youre not healing in the moving parts. behind behind and using emergency healing also burns mana.

I've been playing with the 7170 for most of the tier and I like it. It smoothes out the cast time and shock usage, and the extra EF tick is nice aswell. I don't have problems with my mana(well, unless hell breaks loose on a fight like IJ/Malk hc). You do run with 1k more spirit than I, have siegecrafters(whih is more regen than hc horridon iirc) and you have a shadowpriest for hope, and a boomkin for innervate. You shouldnt have mana troubles in my opinion.

edit: What I understand the least of all is how you can pull 145k hps on Garrosh over 9 minutes. Do you stand in the weapons or something?

[PosPosPos]

I think most of the other posters here have explained why AT would do a lot better macroed with DP than not.