1. #1

    Pet/Guardian AI in Legion

    So as most of us know, one of the biggest worries for Warlocks at the moment is how heavily the reworked Demonology specialization will rely on the Pet/Guardian AI. In the meantime, after the Hunter preview the class developers for Hunters did a Q&A on reddit, detailed here.

    One line stood out to me in particular:

    So, question on Dire Beast. Since it's BM's only chance to regain focus now, are we extra-extra-extra-screwed on fights where our pets simply can't reach a valid target? This happens every now and then (sometimes bugs/glitches, sometimes valid pathing issues like the target flying) and I'm not sure its avoidable in WoW's engine. It's going to really suck if we've got the same limitations as a melee class when these situations arise.

    Fair point, may look into a solution that doesnt require Beast to attack, maybe just a focus per second while guardian active kinda deal. (andrewchambers)

    Now, this is obviously some reading into things on my behalf, but that seems to suggest to me they have no intention of updating the Guardian AI system. Which, I guess is fine, as Hunters will still be able to generate their Focus.

    This will however likely cause some major issues during raiding (don't have much PvP experience, sorry) if they really intend to make Demonology's damage rely on summoning swarms of Demons which all run on the Guardian AI. We'll have to wait and see what they unveil during the preview and beta, but it doesn't bode particularly well in my opinion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Baconeggcheese View Post
    I think there'll be a shitstorm.

    period.

  2. #2
    I'll wait and see how pets act once I actually get to say it but my baseline, gut reaction to Demo shifting away from Meta and towards summoning a bunch of demons is: Fuck that, pets are absolutely retarded. Anything that makes me rely on a bunch of pets that have terrible pathing, take time to switch targets and sometimes even take a few seconds to just recognize that you've sent them a command is something that I REALLY hate. There are things you can do to relieve some of this like moving pets ahead of time and predicting boss movement but the overall AI still sucks and it upsets me lol
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbamboozal View Post
    Maybe dress my kid as a fel guard and rip shit up in the neighbourhood.

  3. #3
    Pit Lord
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    Beta

    Now it's more important for them to have a working core and good theme for the spec. Next comes ironing the spec out and fixing/changing all things that don't work or are problematic in use.

  4. #4
    The Patient Woolock's Avatar
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    Let's wait for beta and see how it plays out. It might be a clunky nightmare or maybe Blizzard surprises us and it feels fluent and good.

  5. #5
    Brewmaster
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    Too early to worry. Necro this when you actually played Demo on Beta.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Fabinas View Post
    Too early to worry. Necro this when you actually played Demo on Beta.
    Sorry, but I'm not petty enough to necro this topic at that time to tell you I told you so. That's entirely beyond the point of this thread.

    I hoped to start a reasonable discussion on how we could communicate with Blizzard in regards to our worries as a class in advance, while they still have time to overhaul these mechanics. Or discuss possible work-arounds and so on. When beta feedback is pouring in, it's way past the time for a developer to massively overhaul such a system. That will likely not be an option anymore at that point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Baconeggcheese View Post
    I think there'll be a shitstorm.

    period.

  7. #7
    Ultimately, problems with pets are not about AI, they are about terrain generation and shoddy QA.

    The game world in WoW is three things:
    1) The macro geometry that you see. Terrain objects like hills and mountains that are generated via heightmaps.
    2) The micro geometry that you see. Static mesh objects like houses, trees, big bad enemy fortresses, etc that are made as separate 3D models and imported as in-game features.
    3) The pathing mesh that you DONT see. This mesh does not render and is not textured but it is there. And it is crucially important. It is also the source of all of this game's pet "AI" issues.

    The path mesh is laid over the top of the previous two types of terrain objects and dictates where you can and cannot travel. More to the point, it dictates where NPCs can and cannot travel, including your pets and guardians. The problem with pet pathing arises when either two or more path meshes overlap or when the path mesh clips into the terrain mesh and/or static mesh. This can happen for several reasons, but it is usually just the result of poor optimization by the world generation team.

  8. #8
    I hoped to start a reasonable discussion on how we could communicate with Blizzard in regards to our worries as a class in advance, while they still have time to overhaul these mechanics. Or discuss possible work-arounds and so on. When beta feedback is pouring in, it's way past the time for a developer to massively overhaul such a system. That will likely not be an option anymore at that point.
    Increase range for pet attacks so they can actually attack/ hit the enemy so long as they are within range regardless of flying or whatnot. The other option, for Warlocks anyway, is to just have ranged pet attacks, no melee pets. That's why I've always preferred the Imp and now Doomguard, because they're ranged I don't have to worry about pathing or mob switching.
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