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  1. #821
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seran View Post
    funny thing, for that 20B$ number you quoted... you can buy 120+ F-35s, as the flyaway cost is 154M, might want to check your facts, or cut the dishonesty next time.
    The flyaway cost is only 154M for the cheapest variant. Every other (and more commonly used) variants are over 200M.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  2. #822
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fugus View Post
    Almost all I have heard of were heirs or old as hell. But I haven't read up too much on them.
    And here is why you learn what you are talking about before you let your fingers make you look um... foolish.

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  3. #823
    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    There was a time when the minimum wage was considered just dandy. It's kept pace with inflation, and suddenly it's "sub-human". Time change, eh ?



    We've had a 60 year policy of continually raising the minimum wage. What you want is more of the same. If you keep doing what you've been doing, you'll keep getting what you've been getting.

    As for carbon copying Canada's system... why on Earth people can't be happy we got the ACA is beyond me. You're not even willing to give it a fucking chance before you decide that it's not enough.

    Min wages have been falling behind a lot in the last few decades And it has NOT been keeping pace with inflation.

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-1...f-the-day.html

    Not opinion just mere facts. this slacking behind is a major reason for all the welfare we have to pick up, think of it as WELFARE to WALMART since they arent paying a living wage someone has to pick up the tab and it is the taxpayer so infact we are subsiding walmart.

    The price of cheap is anything but cheap when you factor in all costs around this business that hits the taxpayers in the end

    If it wasnt for the increases in federal min wage that took place in 2008-2010 at the end of 2007 Min wage was when adjusted for inflation 41% LESS as in LOWER than it was in 1967. If losing 41% of the wage when adjusting for inflation is "kept pace with inflation" I hate to see what is not keeping pace with inflation.

    Yeah there was a time when min wage was a decent wage but it was a long long time. And we have not continually been raising the min wage we have gone decades without it. Fair Minimum Wage Act of 2007 contained 3 increases in the federal min wage that was at $5.15 at this point 5.85 6.55 and finally 7.25 was part of this Fair Minimum Wage Act of 2007. We got the 5.15 level on September 1st 1997. we had 2 cases on min wage increases happening in the 1990s April 1990 was the 1st change of the min wage before that it had been laying unchanged since January of 1981. at the level of $3.35

    ""The federal minimum wage has never included a feature by which it automatically increases each year to ensure that it maintains its purchasing power. As a result, Congress has to act to provide such adjustments.

    These adjustments have not always occurred in a timely fashion. Nonetheless, from 1938 to 1981, they did occur with enough regularity that the minimum wage generally either rose in purchasing power or remained relatively stable in real value."" Last being commentary from CBPP but it displays that up until 1981 min wage was mostly keeping pace with inflation after that it stopped.

    And an interesting thing happened at the same time Reaganomics spread like a plague across the country. We have had right wing hard agenda being the business model for 30 years and this is where the welfare checks to corporations started to be given out and fast forward and min wage is slave wages no doubt about it since at just a few years ago it was slacking behind by over 40% in just keeping pace with inflation. That is a massive welfare check to guys like Schnatter that complains over having to pay 3-4 cent in healthcare per pizza he sells. Guess he didnt complain when wages never increased for decades while his profit did.

  4. #824
    Hey!

    Let's all get mad at this guy now.

    "Florida Restaurateur to Impose Surcharge for ObamaCare".

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/florid...obamacare.html

  5. #825
    Quote Originally Posted by araine View Post
    Min wages have been falling behind a lot in the last few decades And it has NOT been keeping pace with inflation.

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-1...f-the-day.html

    Not opinion just mere facts. this slacking behind is a major reason for all the welfare we have to pick up, think of it as WELFARE to WALMART since they arent paying a living wage someone has to pick up the tab and it is the taxpayer so infact we are subsiding walmart.

    The price of cheap is anything but cheap when you factor in all costs around this business that hits the taxpayers in the end

    If it wasnt for the increases in federal min wage that took place in 2008-2010 at the end of 2007 Min wage was when adjusted for inflation 41% LESS as in LOWER than it was in 1967. If losing 41% of the wage when adjusting for inflation is "kept pace with inflation" I hate to see what is not keeping pace with inflation.

    Yeah there was a time when min wage was a decent wage but it was a long long time. And we have not continually been raising the min wage we have gone decades without it. Fair Minimum Wage Act of 2007 contained 3 increases in the federal min wage that was at $5.15 at this point 5.85 6.55 and finally 7.25 was part of this Fair Minimum Wage Act of 2007. We got the 5.15 level on September 1st 1997. we had 2 cases on min wage increases happening in the 1990s April 1990 was the 1st change of the min wage before that it had been laying unchanged since January of 1981. at the level of $3.35

    ""The federal minimum wage has never included a feature by which it automatically increases each year to ensure that it maintains its purchasing power. As a result, Congress has to act to provide such adjustments.

    These adjustments have not always occurred in a timely fashion. Nonetheless, from 1938 to 1981, they did occur with enough regularity that the minimum wage generally either rose in purchasing power or remained relatively stable in real value."" Last being commentary from CBPP but it displays that up until 1981 min wage was mostly keeping pace with inflation after that it stopped.

    And an interesting thing happened at the same time Reaganomics spread like a plague across the country. We have had right wing hard agenda being the business model for 30 years and this is where the welfare checks to corporations started to be given out and fast forward and min wage is slave wages no doubt about it since at just a few years ago it was slacking behind by over 40% in just keeping pace with inflation. That is a massive welfare check to guys like Schnatter that complains over having to pay 3-4 cent in healthcare per pizza he sells. Guess he didnt complain when wages never increased for decades while his profit did.
    HOLY SHIT DID YOU REALLY IGNORE MY ENTIRE POST POINTING OUT HOW MIN WAGE HAS KEPT UP WITH INFLATION? BOTH OF THEM?!

    Minimum wage started in 1938. Why don't you take a look at what a chart that actually extends that far back looks like.

  6. #826
    Quote Originally Posted by Riidii View Post
    Hey!

    Let's all get mad at this guy now.

    "Florida Restaurateur to Impose Surcharge for ObamaCare".

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/florid...obamacare.html
    I can't eat at Denny's, that food gives me the grippers.

  7. #827
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zigzagzoom View Post
    I can't eat at Denny's, that food gives me the grippers.
    Funny part is, Obamacare doesn't affect them by 5%. That surcharge is basically an excuse to gouge.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  8. #828
    Now if a place like Starbucks were to follow suit, minds would be blown. Not saying they are. But Denny's, not so much.

  9. #829
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    Funny part is, Obamacare doesn't affect them by 5%. That surcharge is basically an excuse to gouge.
    Obamacare could well affect them by 5%.

    Restaurants are allowed to pay their workers a fraction of the minimum wage because of tips. Because of that, an increase in spending from ACA is more likely a much larger percentage of their expenditures than it would be for corporate Papa Johns.

  10. #830
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    Obamacare could well affect them by 5%.

    Restaurants are allowed to pay their workers a fraction of the minimum wage because of tips. Because of that, an increase in spending from ACA is more likely a much larger percentage of their expenditures than it would be for corporate Papa Johns.
    I'll believe it when I see it. Preemptive surcharges, however, are ludicrous.

    PS: The dude has 40 locations (with average of 35 workers per) and has health insurance coverage for 250 of them.

    That's bullshit.
    Last edited by Rukentuts; 2012-11-16 at 07:03 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  11. #831
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    I'll believe it when I see it. Preemptive surcharges, however, are ludicrous.
    Do you have access to his records?

    Why do you automatically assume he's using Obamacare as an excuse to gouge when he's well within his rights to raise prices in response to increased costs?

    You guys seem to get update when companies DON'T raise their prices and instead attempt to appeal the decision and you get upset when they DO raise prices and don't fight it.

  12. #832
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    I'll believe it when I see it. Preemptive surcharges, however, are ludicrous.
    Why is it ludicrous?

    You deny the basic effects of this legislation?

  13. #833
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riidii View Post
    Why is it ludicrous?

    You deny the basic effects of this legislation?
    Effects that haven't happened yet, and are unknown even if they will.

    Yes. It's not just ludicrous, it's absolute bullshit; similar to the average quality of food at a Denny's.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  14. #834
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    Effects that haven't happened yet, and are unknown even if they will.

    Yes. It's not just ludicrous, it's absolute bullshit; similar to the average quality of food at a Denny's.
    Nothing about this is unknown.

    Every single business in the US is going to have to adjust to these new costs. Or else have smaller profit margins.

    Maybe the effects are just unknown to you. People have been preparing for awhile.

  15. #835
    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    Do you have access to his records?

    Why do you automatically assume he's using Obamacare as an excuse to gouge when he's well within his rights to raise prices in response to increased costs?

    You guys seem to get update when companies DON'T raise their prices and instead attempt to appeal the decision and you get upset when they DO raise prices and don't fight it.
    Many liberals are emotionally invested in Obama. Insulting him is the same as insulting them.

  16. #836
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    Effects that haven't happened yet, and are unknown even if they will.

    Yes. It's not just ludicrous, it's absolute bullshit; similar to the average quality of food at a Denny's.
    One does not need to be an economist to figure out that suddenly having to pay for something you did not have to before will cost more money. It's gonna have to come from somewhere.

  17. #837
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zigzagzoom View Post
    One does not need to be an economist to figure out that suddenly having to pay for something you did not have to before will cost more money. It's gonna have to come from somewhere.
    Yes, but an economist would also figure out that with these employees now having healthcare insurance of their own, costs would be saved elsewhere.

    Personally, I don't give a flying fuck if these 40 Denny's locations charge 5% more. Now that their employees with have healthcare, my premiums will go down. That saves me money.
    Last edited by Rukentuts; 2012-11-16 at 07:18 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  18. #838
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    Yes, but an economist would also figure out that with these employees now having healthcare insurance of their own, costs would be saved elsewhere.

    Personally, I don't give a flying fuck if these 40 Denny's locations charge 5% more. Now that their employees with have healthcare, my premiums will go down. That saves me money.

    Yea that all sounds lovely but Denny's still has to pay for it somehow.

  19. #839
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    Yes, but an economist would also figure out that with these employees now having healthcare insurance of their own, costs would be saved elsewhere.

    Personally, I don't give a flying fuck if Denny's charges 5% more. Now that their employees with have healthcare, my premiums will go down. That saves me money.
    Not so fast.

    "In Wisconsin, Obamacare to Increase Individual Insurance Premiums by 30%, Says Obama Adviser".

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/201...obama-adviser/

  20. #840
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riidii View Post
    Not so fast.

    "In Wisconsin, Obamacare to Increase Individual Insurance Premiums by 30%, Says Obama Adviser".

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/201...obama-adviser/
    Nice crystal ball that guy has there. Where can I buy one of those?
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

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