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  1. #861
    Moderator Kasierith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riidii View Post
    So should the cost be entirely passed onto the pizzas? It sounded like Papa Johns was doing a split between the pizzas and the workers.

    If it was entirely passed onto the business, the price increase would be much larger. Surely lowering demand.

    And that isn't what anyone wants.
    His declaration was that he would have no choice but to pass it on to the work force, because the cost to the business would be a 14 cent increase to pizzas, although other sources put the increase to be much lower.
    “…the whole trouble lies here. In words, words. Each one of us has within him a whole world of things, each man of us his own special world. And how can we ever come to an understanding if I put in the words I utter the sense and value of things as I see them; while you who listen to me must inevitably translate them according to the conception of things each one of you has within himself. We think we understand each other, but we never really do.”
    XKCD is always relevant. Always.

  2. #862
    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    So I guess this is the new thing. Blame layoffs and price increases that were already going to happen on Obama.
    Considering that Romney was going to effectively undo and get rid of everything Obama put in place--Obama-care, letting the Bush tax-cuts expire this time around, never before scene spending levels, etc.--which led to higher unemployment, then yes, there is a causal connection.

    Low- to middle-income people are in for a very, very rude awakening in the next 4 years because of this election.

  3. #863
    Merely a Setback Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasierith View Post
    His declaration was that he would have no choice but to pass it on to the work force, because the cost to the business would be a 14 cent increase to pizzas, although other sources put the increase to be much lower.
    Was like 4 cents iirc.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    Both of those links don't provide any evidence. They make unsubstantiated statements

  4. #864
    Old God Grizzly Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Congelatore View Post
    Considering that Romney was going to effectively undo and get rid of everything Obama put in place--Obama-care, letting the Bush tax-cuts expire this time around, never before scene spending levels, etc.--which led to higher unemployment, then yes, there is a causal connection.

    Low- to middle-income people are in for a very, very rude awakening in the next 4 years because of this election.
    Things weren't looking good for either candidate. And, honestly, I'm not sure I would want a single party that held the Presidency and and most of Congress.

  5. #865
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by orissa View Post
    This is getting stupid. Like really. Why punish employees for what Congress does?

    Fuck Denny's your food sucked anyways.
    I really hate to say this, but you didn't REALLY expect business owners to shoulder the entire cost of the new healthcare legislation, did you?

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  6. #866
    This is something you will see across the board due to obamacare, nearly every nonmanagement fulltime hourly position is going to be eliminated soon.

    This is due to the requirement that no more than 20% of a paycheck can be healthcare costs, but to meet the bare minimum on required by obamacare that business have to provide, am hourly employee making around 8-9 dollars an hour would have to work 48-50+ hours to meet the minimum payment.

    I'm upper management at a gas station/convience store chain of about 60 stores, we had to basically elimate all our full time cashier positions, we haven't hired anyone for a nonmanagement position in over a year because our business that has been around over 50 years would be bankrupt in months if we didn't. Many small businesses don't make enough to handle paying our employees the wages required to pay for obamacare

  7. #867
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morogoth View Post
    The sad thing is if we boycott the restaurant, the owner will still have his millions and a lot of poor people will lose their job...FML

    edit: we should march on his manor, 100k people marching and burning everything on their path! That would make a beautiful movie.

    p.s. hello NSA
    Thats the spirit, commit crimes, at least when you get arrested you'll have free room and board....

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  8. #868
    oh yea right blame obama. try blaming the ceo's themselves along with all the other rich greedy vp's, politicians and whatnot who live in million dollar homes and drive 200k cars for screwing up the economy. ur shady crooked ways screw over the tax payers. without the workin man this country crashes. too bad these selfish richies cant figure that out. make sure the middle class has what they need 1st then worry about ur toys.

  9. #869
    So how do we solve all this? The employees already work full time and still can't afford health insurance. So what should they do? Should they go to the emergency room and let the tax payers foot the bill? Or should they just simply die?

  10. #870
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Seran do you ever respond to people who ask you questions or do you just post random responses to posts from 10 pages ago?
    I've been busy with other things... so I"m playing catch up... and yes, I do respond to folks that ask me questions... just like I responded to yours.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-16 at 02:17 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Grokan View Post
    A bit late there Seran.
    As explained above, I'm playing catch up... love your new avatar... I have about a foot of global warming on my drive, wanna come take care of it for me?

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  11. #871
    Quote Originally Posted by Bling View Post
    This is something you will see across the board due to obamacare, nearly every nonmanagement fulltime hourly position is going to be eliminated soon.

    This is due to the requirement that no more than 20% of a paycheck can be healthcare costs, but to meet the bare minimum on required by obamacare that business have to provide, am hourly employee making around 8-9 dollars an hour would have to work 48-50+ hours to meet the minimum payment.

    I'm upper management at a gas station/convience store chain of about 60 stores, we had to basically elimate all our full time cashier positions, we haven't hired anyone for a nonmanagement position in over a year because our business that has been around over 50 years would be bankrupt in months if we didn't. Many small businesses don't make enough to handle paying our employees the wages required to pay for obamacare
    Thanks for that perspective.

  12. #872
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    The flyaway cost is only 154M for the cheapest variant. Every other (and more commonly used) variants are over 200M.
    even so... they certainly do NOT cost 20B each as claimed by who I was responding to.

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  13. #873
    Herald of the Titans Aqua's Avatar
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    Oh good Papa Jonnyboy is trying to put their nose here in the UK.
    I know 80% of the gamers in my area, you KNOW their pizza orders will make a difference.
    Screw you P.Johns.

    There's a nice little local place, and a Dominoes around our area... bit further but... egh. I can walk a bit further if I really need pizza, I only have pizza like once every 3 months tops. But when I want it, I waaant it. But not from that.

    When a Recession hits, all levels of income should be brought more in line, but as it is, the people at the top in the U.S. seem to be cutting every corner they can to retain their 12 car, mansions and billions. At the expense of the trust from the public. I sure hope they studied the revolutions in Russia and Europe in school because they're digging their way to it. Just because they don't call themselves Duke/Lord/Czar or what-have-you, doesn't mean they aren't sitting at exactly the same spot. Yes, hard work should be rewarded, but you should also take a good deal of introspection when you are AT the top to see how much of that might have been luck and circumstance, and to try and hold onto some of your humanity.

    I'm appalled at how many people think that isn't necessary and people who have had set back after set back in their life should just wallow in their shit and die in a ditch. While those who've had lucky break after lucky break should lord it over the plebeians.
    It's a nice dream thinking that every thing you work for will be justly rewarded, and if you're poor you've simply never worked hard enough, but that's a horrible self delusion, many wealthy people feed themselves.


    Edit: Sadly companies with this attitude simply have to be left to fall apart, another company will pick up the slack and have to recreate those jobs. P.Johns and that other company don't deserve your business.
    Same happened to GAME in the UK, Shoddy business practices, nice employees, many of whom lost their jobs purely because of the idiots at the top.
    Last edited by Aqua; 2012-11-16 at 08:26 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by savutitus View Post
    Yeah, it's always WAR WAR WAR untill..BY ALL THAT IS HOLY DO YOU SEE THAT ENEMY OVER THERE?? GLORIOUS LOOT!!!!!

  14. #874
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    Yes, but an economist would also figure out that with these employees now having healthcare insurance of their own, costs would be saved elsewhere.
    While true, that's not the concern of a business owner. A business owner doesn't (and shouldn't be expected to) simply accept that someone else is saving money at his expense.

  15. #875
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    Quote Originally Posted by Congelatore View Post
    Considering that Romney was going to effectively undo and get rid of everything Obama put in place--Obama-care, letting the Bush tax-cuts expire this time around, never before scene spending levels, etc.--which led to higher unemployment, then yes, there is a causal connection.

    Low- to middle-income people are in for a very, very rude awakening in the next 4 years because of this election.
    While i despise obama and everything he stands for...his obamacare, his blatent disregard for america, and peoples liberties...it is laughable to think romney would have been any better. They are birds of a feather...but people eat this shit up thinking there is actually a difference between republican and democrat. I actually think i despise the people who support obama more than i dislike obama himself. How people can have such a willingness to throw away liberty and american values for...i dont even know what you really thought you were going to get out of it, is utterly sickening.

  16. #876
    Not matter how much people want to deny the facts. No matter what you do you will not hurt the rich people...Left wing Right wing whatever...simple fact of the matter is rich people create jobs and when anyone / anything starts cutting into their pie they cut those same jobs they created to stay to keep up the life style. That's why trickle up economics will NEVER work. Personally I work in the finance field and out of our 300 plus client; no less than half are doing the same thing. This will be the norm before the next 4 years is over, get use to it.

  17. #877
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snakeseye0 View Post
    So how do we solve all this? The employees already work full time and still can't afford health insurance. So what should they do? Should they go to the emergency room and let the tax payers foot the bill? Or should they just simply die?
    because taxpayers arent going to be footing the bill now anyways?

  18. #878
    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    Papa Johns CEO threatens to reduce employee hours or increase pizza prices so he doesn't have to pay for healthcare.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobile...n_2104202.html


    Murray energy fires 150+ employees in response to Obama re-election.
    http://m.washingtonpost.com/business...684_story.html


    So I guess this is the new thing. Blame layoffs and price increases that were already going to happen on Obama. Murray energy should probably blame the free market for its layoffs, since they are a direct result of the rising competitiveness of Natural Gas via fracking. It's no wonder they deny climate change and lobby for unsafe working conditions to reduce cost.

    Oh look a picture of John Schnatters house. i.imgur.com/T7W2j.png

    Your pizza sucks anyways, John.


    Few points to mention:

    1. The idea that business owners will/should sacrifice personal income, over cutting costs, is ******* delusional. People don't start business's to support other, less ambitious, people. They start business's to make money.*

    2. The idea that paying more taxes is, somehow, patriotic is completely idiotic. How does giving more of my hard-earned money to a bureaucrat, just so they can then send it to Pakistan or Afghanistan (or some other foreign nation), make me more patriotic to the US? How does handing over the money I worked for, so it can be given to someone who hasn't worked at all, make me patriotic?**

    3. Most, if not all, of these companies (and many more) announced that they would issue "cost-cutting measures" to deal with Obama's policies. Some of these measures include raising prices, adding an "Obamacare" surcharge, or cutting hours and jobs. These concepts were announced long before the election. However most news networks opted not to cover the story. The few that did often painted it as "voter intimidation."*** (As if these multi-state business owners would, somehow, magically know which employee voted for Obama.)

    4. When the economy started to tank, during the Bush administration, many companies went under. The ones that survived learned how to cut costs and pass expenses on to the consumer. This has been an established principle for running a successful business for DECADES. When expenses go up, costs should be cut where possible to compensate. Instead of learning from this lesson, however, Obama decided to heap more "expenses" (in the form of tax's) on business's big and small. To act surprised that they responded by cutting expenses (an established pattern) demonstrates a total disconnect with the reality of our economy. Then again, we are talking about a President who has failed to make even a meaningful attempt at balancing the national budget.

    5. The simple audacity of the double-standard here is shocking. Obama spent four years blaming Bush, Republicans, and the wealthy for his inability to do his own job. (His job, which he stated in his own words, being to fix the economy.) At the exact same time business owners, big and small, were practically screaming about how damaging his policies would be. They came out, in droves, during the election and flatly stated that further beatings from his anti-business (especially small business) policies WOULD result in jobs being cut and prices going up. And what was the response? A lot of complete and utter idiots saying, "raising tax's on business owners won't hurt anyone else." If someone tells you that putting your hand in a bear trap is dangerous, and you do it anyway, and you lose that hand, is it your own fault or the fault of the person that warned you?

    6. It's very simple in the end. Everyone, every single person in this country, was warned BEFORE the election. They were all given the facts. A lot of people decided to cover their ears and go on living in Obama-land. Now the reality of their willing ignorance is catching up with them. You can choose to blame the business owners, the wealthy, the Republicans, or who-ever else you want. Just remember that you WERE warned. More business WILL cut jobs and more business's will raises costs. And you can only live in denial, blaming everyone else, before you have to admit that something isn't working. Much like Obama can only blame Bush for so many years before he admits that maybe, just maybe, he's the one that's failing now.


    *The concept that business owners should pay "out of pocket," instead of cutting expenses and raising costs, was expressed by several Liberal pundits post election. This even after several franchise owners said they would go broke and shut-down if they tried to do that. (Most of their money is tied up in the business. A reality many Obama supporters like to ignore.)

    **It was Joe Biden that, during the campaign, suggested paying more tax's is patriotic. Apparently the "insult" was lost on the poor and working poor who don't pay Federal Income tax. (They may have a higher rate, but don't make enough to actually pay. Rather the Feds give them a refund, in essence paying them, at the end of the year.)

    ***Several Liberal outlets referred to the warnings, given by business's small and large, as "voter intimidation." Most of these same outlets ignored the Black Panthers that stood in front of polling station doors, with bats, on election day.

    ****Obama's definition of "wealthy" is a moving mark. At one point he defined it as someone making more than 250k a year. For the record my employer, under those guide-lines, would be considered wealthy. He lives in a small ranch-style house on one-acre of land. He drives a pick-up, not a limo. And he works an average of 70-80 hours a week. Most people would define that as "middle class" and the "American Dream."
    Last edited by Twotonsteak; 2012-11-16 at 08:41 PM.

  19. #879
    Quote Originally Posted by vaeevictiss View Post
    because taxpayers arent going to be footing the bill now anyways?
    So whats the best solution?

  20. #880
    Quote Originally Posted by Riidii View Post
    Don't be a talking parrot.
    the irony is strong with this one

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