1. #1

    MSV Normal progression question

    Hey all, sorry if this is a bit late to post, i know heroics are on the way already...
    I had a bit of bad luck with guild i was previously in, which resulted in me creating my own level 25 guild (10man raid) just so i could run my own team ^^ (1 week before mop raids came out) so raiding has been delayed.

    We have raided twice, Tuesday - and this reset Thursday

    My questions basic, in regards to kill times, is it something i should be worried about? a lot of people are new to raiding, should i just let the group get use to raiding?
    Stone guards: (1st week we killed 7 min 40 secs) this week we killed it (with a harder combo) in 6 mins 13 seconds, this shows an improvement
    Feng: we killed within 8 mins i believe... (we killed this 1st week, again, we improved)
    SPiritbinder: We killed it for the first time Thursday, 20 secs before enrage
    Kings, we wiped on 4th/last at 50% life, basically around 15-20% (adding all bosses?), wipe time was just over 8 mins.

    In my opinion i think the dps is quite low, for normals but at the same time i keep telling myself things will get better, i'm thinking in regards to elegon to be honest, comparing the kill times stated above, are they miles off what your first kill times were? Should i be expecting to wipe on elegon to enrage issues or could we push the dps req.

  2. #2
    I think your best bet for help would be to create a world of logs account for your guild and upload some logs so people here can look over them and see if there is anything to worry about. In my opinion fresh raiders killing gara'jal with 20 seconds on timer is good and I wouldn't worry to much.

    Here are my guilds time for those boss' and we kill Elegon just fine.

    Stone Guards: 6:01
    Feng: 7:18
    Gara'jal: 4:57
    Spirit Kings: 8:04
    Last edited by pnfirehawk; 2012-11-10 at 01:35 AM. Reason: Giving OP more information

  3. #3
    I would wait until you get to Elegon, before worrying about Elegon. Bosses are different, certain classes work better with different mechanics. You won't know until you get there whether it will be a problem or not. Besides, you should always be encouraging people to do the highest DPS they can do, so analysing kill times is kind of pointless.

    Also, ^ getting WoL is a good idea. Everyone wanting to improve should be using programs of this nature to analyse their play.
    Last edited by Halaberiel; 2012-11-10 at 03:30 AM.

  4. #4
    If you kill garjal 20 seconds before enrage then its fine. Like others said, analysing kill times is a bit pointless. People keep going on about Elegon being a pure dps check, it isn't, its as much about the mechanics and preventing "dead time" when you aren't hitting the boss.

  5. #5
    Elegon really isn't that difficult. When my guild was going through MSV normal modes we were killing Gara'jal about 1-10 seconds before enrage and beating the Elegon enrage in over a minute.

  6. #6
    I am Murloc! draykorinee's Avatar
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    Elegon was a huge cockblock for us, just downed him this thursday, but its impossible to judge just by times of previous kills, need logs etc. Spirit is a cake walk compared to elegon, so if you're struggling with those mechanics I do wonder, but dont let it get you down, if you're a new raid team you take time to gel, we built a whole new one around our officer foundation this expac, we are all starting to get use to each others nuances, once you start working better as team it will improve

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Glurp View Post
    Elegon really isn't that difficult. When my guild was going through MSV normal modes we were killing Gara'jal about 1-10 seconds before enrage and beating the Elegon enrage in over a minute.
    We barely got Gara'jal down as well, breezed by Kings and the only night we've tried Elegon in which we were just testing the fight to get everyone familiar with it, we got them down to berserk, but struggled a lot with orbs and timing. We only got them down to 46%. I assume getting enough wave of orbs down both phases makes a huge difference dps wise?

  8. #8
    You're going to have a bad time after the first 4 bosses in MSV in terms of beating the enrage timers if your dps aren't on their game. I don't know the exact numbers but pretty much anything beyond that acquires dps that is at least in the lower 50s out of all your raiders (excluding gimmicks of course)...I know a lot of 476+ geared raiders that can't do that holding still, nevermind while an actual encounter is taking place. Yeah, Elegon may not be that much tighter than Spiritbinder in terms of dps output but there are a lot more mechanics to the fight, Spiritbinder is the simplest boss in the entire tier as far as that goes, while Elegon is pretty tight in addition to offering some mechanics that require lots of proper execution. HoF is a little higher ilvl of a raid and thus you need better dps despite that the bosses don't really get complex until the fourth boss or so.

    Now, if you have some experienced players that can carry that weight, *and* your newer players actually have the incentive to do well and get better, you'll be okay in the long run, I guess. As for boss kill timers, don't get discouraged by that, if you beat it you beat it...you will naturally improve upon them, half of it from gear and the other half simply from people being much more comfortable with the fight and delivering improved performance.

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