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  1. #81
    Pandaren Monk Moosie's Avatar
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    0 rogues on last kill, probably 10 rogues on Garalon, enough said.
    Moosie <After Hours> : Feral / Restoration

  2. #82
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    Wait.. NO ROGUES!?/?!!ELEVENTYONE!!

    Guys get to the forums asap, rogues need a major buff right now, increasing their aoe damage by 500% and giving them permanent invisibility.

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
    Wait.. NO ROGUES!?/?!!ELEVENTYONE!!

    Guys get to the forums asap, rogues need a major buff right now, increasing their aoe damage by 500% and giving them permanent invisibility.
    That's a good idea, then maybe they will match the flavor of their class. It's laughable when druids and hunters have better everything.. including stealth. But the sarcasm in your post was very very funny. <- see i can do it too.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Sarac View Post
    And theres almost always only 1 viable specc for PvE so why bother, it doesn't make a single difference to what I said. They are doing decent dmg just like some others are only doing decent damage. The only difference is rogues are number 1 dps in some patches compared to those others dps so when you are not top dps you start crying.

    Unless you are bottom dps as a pure dps class I see no reason for whining. Being in the middle isn't a bad thing...and if that makes top guilds stop taking rogues for 1-2 weeks because of lack of gear to fill that few dps loss than so be it.
    I've said this a few times, but if the class is the least played and not even legendaries managed to give an important pump, something is wrong, something is very wrong.

    And GC can come and tell us how the class is perfect, but numbers don't lie.
    Shadow Walk : Significantly increases Stealth effectiveness for 6 sec, but causes Stealth to be nerfed to justify its usage. In addition, it uses old Enveloping Shadows icon and has no sound, animation or spell effect to show that the skill is actually doing something.

  5. #85
    Pit Lord Frolk's Avatar
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    Mage wasnt used on first LK HC, reason?
    Mage wasnt optimal on that fight, prolly same for rogue on Empress. It WILL be that some classes r less valuable on certain fights that other classes, accept it
    So quit ur whining ><
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  6. #86
    Pandaren Monk Moosie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sendai View Post
    I've said this a few times, but if the class is the least played and not even legendaries managed to give an important pump, something is wrong, something is very wrong.

    And GC can come and tell us how the class is perfect, but numbers don't lie.
    legendary for rogues didn't give an important bump? I'm not sure if we are playing the same game or not.

    I'm not sure what numbers you are looking at either. According to WoL and Gara'jal (A tank'n'spank fight for melee), rogues are topping most of the melee specs, not only that but the are doing double the damage of everyone else on Garalon.
    Moosie <After Hours> : Feral / Restoration

  7. #87
    Classes are never going to be absolutely perfectly balanced. When it comes to world first race, there will be class stacking and there will almost (if not always) be a class left out. This DOES NOT mean that rogues will never kill empress, just like it never meant that shamans will never kill the bosses they were left out on for the world first kill. These are top of the world guilds who are racing for the world first kill, they could have killed it with one or more rogues, but it may have made it that much harder.

    As the strategies get out there and players get better at knowing what they should be doing at what time, the kill times will be reduced, the classes will become more even, and guilds that are not world first guilds will be getting kills with (and probably without) rogues. None of that will bother you, and this shouldn't either.
    You're just jealous because the voices are talking to me!

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by hoodrogue View Post
    Your thoughts?
    Paragon, Method, and Blood Legion didn't use mages for their H Will of the Emperor kills, I guess that means mages are bad. Thoughts?

  9. #89
    World first is literally the biggest outlier by definition. You're not going to draw any statistically significant conclusions from it.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    Seriously, just because rogues aren't #1 on DPS with or without trying, there's no need to make a personal crusade claiming they're broken. They've been the dominant DPS class for 8 years. I'd imagine a lot of rogue players switched over the nerf (heck, over any nerf) even while some rogues said they needed adjustment down.

    I'm not a world first raider, not anywhere remotely close, but we didn't have a mage or warlock in our raid in Cataclysm. Had nothing to do with the class, just that we didn't have anyone that wanted to bring one. We had multiple druids, multiple hunters. We would have possibly benefited from more class diversity, but....you bring the player, not the class right?

    What if those monks were previously rogues and the players in BL wanted to try the new class and liked it?
    I'm not joining the "omfg we're broken buff us" bandwagon, but you do realize your example is absolutely not the same thing right? You didn't have those classes because there was no one you wanted to bring. I'm 100% sure that if BL wanted to bring a rogue, they had one to bring. In this case, it had quite a bit to do with the class. Class stacking is what people do for super serious progression to min/max. I guarantee you they did it on purpose. I don't know who their monks are, but I am pretty sure they didn't get taken because they played rogue amazingly in cata...

    This is getting blown out of proportions though... omg we suck at some encounters. We are also really strong on some.

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Bryntrollian View Post
    Most rogues these days have the First or Last outlook on pve dps
    Welcome to being a class that brings zero raid utility. Pretty much the only thing we have going for us is elusiveness/cloak, but being able to take a bit less damage really doesn't stack up against raid cooldowns, on demand self or even raid healing, etc. Why bring a rogue when a druid can do the same DPS but also has symbiosis? The list goes on. Either we get raid utility or we have to be the top of the meter to be a viable member of a raid team, that's what this is all about.

    Still, the bigger issue with these fights is that melee is almost always a hindrance. This doesn't just apply to rogues, no one disagrees with that.
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  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowe View Post

    P.S: While Blood Legion did not use 1Rogue, it does not mean that Rogues are bad now.
    That's WHY people are saying rogues are fine. It's just BL didn't want rogues. Trust me you'll be seeing plenty of rogues in the top 10 kills.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-11 at 07:39 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Meatboll View Post
    Paragon, Method, and Blood Legion didn't use mages for their H Will of the Emperor kills, I guess that means mages are bad. Thoughts?
    This. Just to emphasize the point.
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  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by razorback07 View Post
    legendary for rogues didn't give an important bump? I'm not sure if we are playing the same game or not.

    I'm not sure what numbers you are looking at either. According to WoL and Gara'jal (A tank'n'spank fight for melee), rogues are topping most of the melee specs, not only that but the are doing double the damage of everyone else on Garalon.
    Read again my post. I'm talking about popularity and legendaries brought rogues...above warlocks. Amazing feat.

    And they are doing such thanks to one particular skill. Is that good design?
    Shadow Walk : Significantly increases Stealth effectiveness for 6 sec, but causes Stealth to be nerfed to justify its usage. In addition, it uses old Enveloping Shadows icon and has no sound, animation or spell effect to show that the skill is actually doing something.

  14. #94
    There is no point in arguing, we will only know the true reason a rogue didint get brought if Ahdehl would tell us.
    It could be because he is combat and they needed better single target and he did not have 2 daggers or time to change his gear up for full min/maxing to get brought in.
    Also like others have said they did not take a mage in their WotE heroic kill
    The GM is a mage probably took an alt or another class more suited for the fight.
    Also Ahdehl took an alt to their Wind lord kill seeing as his rogue doesnt have a kill count for him but has the ach.
    Last edited by fallschick; 2012-11-11 at 09:53 PM.

  15. #95
    Meh...usually things like this piss me off...but this time I just don't care. The mechanics likely didn't favor rogues or perhaps rogue dps just isn't quite high enough. You know those hardcore types are crazy and if rogue dps is lagging just a tiny bit they won't take them. Either way I know from personal experience that rogue dps is competitive enough. I'm regularly tops in raid finder and any Sha of Anger groups I get into and I don't even have good gear. Perhaps if I start raiding for realz and find myself struggling to keep up I'll start bitching.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by fallschick View Post
    There is no point in arguing, we will only know the true reason a rogue didint get brought if Ahdehl would tell us.
    It could be because he is combat and they needed better single target and he did not have 2 daggers or time to change his gear up for full min/maxing to get brought in.
    Also like others have said they did not take a mage in their WotE heroic kill
    The GM is a mage probably took an alt or another class more suited for the fight.
    Also Ahdehl took an alt to their Wind lord kill seeing as his rogue doesnt have a kill count for him but has the ach.
    Wind Lord was about maximum burst over a 70-90second span, and my Enh Shaman had better burst for that time frame, which was all the fight required. Once a couple more kills come in, I'll gladly explain why my Rogue wasn't in for Empress.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-11 at 09:09 PM ----------

    Streaming Vaults Heroic tonight from the Rogue PoV

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  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Maglio View Post
    0 DPS DK's your thoughts?
    Welcome to Cata Shaman, enjoy your stay.

  18. #98
    Bloodsail Admiral Ninaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whoranzone View Post
    Rogues obviously need a tank spec.
    I'd play the shit out of a Rogue tank
    Ex-Rogue; Ex-Paladin
    Mastery will fix it.

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Ninaran View Post
    I'd play the shit out of a Rogue tank
    BC bro =).

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  20. #100
    no rogues because they were going for world first, the end

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