Page 17 of 81 FirstFirst ...
7
15
16
17
18
19
27
67
... LastLast
  1. #321
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Virgo Supercluster, Local Group, Milky Way, Orion Arm, Solar System, Earth, European Union, Croatia
    Posts
    5,220
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    I give no fucks about the Geneva convention right now. I'm talking about honor. It is dishonorable to use civilians as shields, and good men would prefer to die in battle than to hide like a coward.
    Oh please, honor? In war? And how the hell do you know what good men would do in life-threatning situations? You're just assuming things and idealizing the world too much.

    Also, i'm not defending the methods of Palestinians. I just don't get what you're trying to argue. Why are you focusing on them using civilians as shields so much?

  2. #322
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    Also, i'm not defending the methods of Palestinians. I just don't get what you're trying to argue. Why are you focusing on them using civilians as shields so much?
    well, because it's pretty shitty to make sure the people you are allegedly fighting for die with you. and the world wants to vilify armed forces that kill civilians, whether they are really collateral damage or not

  3. #323
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Virgo Supercluster, Local Group, Milky Way, Orion Arm, Solar System, Earth, European Union, Croatia
    Posts
    5,220
    Quote Originally Posted by smelltheglove View Post
    well, because it's pretty shitty to make sure the people you are allegedly fighting for die with you. and the world wants to vilify armed forces that kill civilians, whether they are really collateral damage or not
    No, sure, what i don't get though, is what he's actually trying to prove. That Palestinians are the bad guys here? What? I also find it pretty funny and hypocritical seeing as Israel has done their fair share of killing civilians and acting without honor. And that's the Israel ARMY. The Palestinians who fight against Israel are terrorists at worst and freedom fighters at best. Civilians nevertheless.

    I also can't really take any of his arguments seriously when he's called for Israel to exterminate Palestinians a few pages back.

  4. #324
    i dont consider terrorist or freedom fighter to be civilians personally. either one is fighting or one is abstaining (unless it is a matter of immediate self defense)

  5. #325
    I will start feeling pity for the Palestinians when they decide to grow up and stop trying to use violence to effect political change. Israel isn't perfect, but their general handling of the situation is pretty reasonable considering the incredible stupidity of the Palestinian approach. It sucks that civilians die as a side effect of Israeli strikes against terrorists. It sucks worse when a Palestinian kid blows himself up in the food court at the mall.
    Quote Originally Posted by RICH8472 View Post
    In North Korea Dog eats man!

  6. #326
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Virgo Supercluster, Local Group, Milky Way, Orion Arm, Solar System, Earth, European Union, Croatia
    Posts
    5,220
    Quote Originally Posted by smelltheglove View Post
    i dont consider terrorist or freedom fighter to be civilians personally. either one is fighting or one is abstaining (unless it is a matter of immediate self defense)
    My point was that they're not trained professionals. Some higher standard at war is expected from 1st world soldiers, now isn't it?

  7. #327
    Mechagnome Alakir the Windlord's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    European Union
    Posts
    743
    The State of Israel and the Palestinian Authority need to find a compromise, these conflicts only serve to further destabilize the region.

  8. #328
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    My point was that they're not trained professionals. Some higher standard at war is expected from 1st world soldiers, now isn't it?
    yes. but the more training one has, the more disdain one generally develops for untrained people performing the same function. this is pretty much the same in any profession really.

  9. #329
    Pit Lord
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic, Euro-Atlantic civilisation
    Posts
    2,381
    Quote Originally Posted by Zhangfei View Post
    That's what is happening, whether you like ir or not.



    Palestine was also created out of that mandate; they rejected it for damn good reasons. You invaded them when they decided it was a tad unfair that despite owning 93% of the country, Israel was getting a ridiculously disproportionate amount of land. Straight after the civil war happened because Israel wanted even more land, despite being the invaders.



    Yes, it's ever so bothersome when your country kills tens of thousands of innocents and educated people find that loathesome.
    Please tell me you are still not confounding the Israel independence war of 1948 with the Six days war of 1967, because like 5 people corrected you in the last thread about this issue and it is getting quite sad. You calling yourselves educated is just the proverbial cherry on top of the cake.
    Quote Originally Posted by belfpala View Post
    This law abiding person doesn't consider taking your guns away to be a punishment.
    Quote Originally Posted by JfmC View Post
    someone who disagrees with me is simply wrong.

  10. #330
    Pandaren Monk Mnevis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Buckeye State
    Posts
    1,814
    Quote Originally Posted by Zoranon View Post
    Please tell me you are still not confounding the Israel independence war of 1948 with the Six days war of 1967, because like 5 people corrected you in the last thread about this issue and it is getting quite sad. You calling yourselves educated is just the proverbial cherry on top of the cake.
    There were offensive campaigns in '48. I mean, think about it logically, they had to go from Tel Aviv and a few other settlements and towns (the 7% they'd accumulated (more or less) legitimately) to the 1949 Green Line somehow, right? He said "Straight after the civil war happened"; I think it's pretty obvious the period of time that he's talking about. Just because our mythology pretends that all Israeli military action is defensive (except for taking the Sinai, which they gave back), doesn't mean he's the one that's confused.

    And the word is 'conflate'.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    I don't think I could convince them. And that's not my point. I'm just sick of people glorifying them when they act like cowardly animals.
    There are people who glorify the tactics of Palestinian militants, but you won't find them here. I'm probably one of the people you're talking about, right? What opinion of Hamas did I post on the first page of this thread?

    Being capable of sympathy for the innocents on both sides, pointing out which side has all the power, realizing that even the poor, angry, kids manipulated into blowing themselves up to murder innocent Israelis are in fact humans, that's hardly glorifying. Many would say it's a necessary step to realizing a peace.
    Last edited by Mnevis; 2012-11-14 at 01:08 AM.

  11. #331
    Scarab Lord Zhangfei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Cola, SC via Devon
    Posts
    4,357
    Quote Originally Posted by Zoranon View Post
    Please tell me you are still not confounding the Israel independence war of 1948 with the Six days war of 1967, because like 5 people corrected you in the last thread about this issue and it is getting quite sad. You calling yourselves educated is just the proverbial cherry on top of the cake.
    Israel attacked Palestine in 1948. Nice comment calling it an "independence war" when it was already independent though. Great doublethink.
    In fact as far as I'm aware the UK is the only european nation that outright bans guns for civilians.
    Shotguns I'll give you (provided you're allowed 12 and larger gauges... because I mean... come on...) but not .22s.
    This is why people ban guns. Gun supporters don't know what guns are.

  12. #332
    The Unstoppable Force RICH816's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Portsmouth, UK
    Posts
    22,925
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    I give no fucks about the Geneva convention right now. I'm talking about honor. It is dishonorable to use civilians as shields, and good men would prefer to die in battle than to hide like a coward.

    Geneva Convention or not, only dogs do such things.
    How much combat experience do you have?
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes View Post
    I do sympathize with these so called terrorist organisations. As far as I'm concerned, at least they are fighting for something they believe in, and for what they see to be the greater good. They're not fighting to line the pockets of statesmen, governors and oil barons. I wish we could the same about the people on this side of the planet.
    Hobbes talking about Al Qaeda and ISIS.

  13. #333
    Titan Kalyyn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Indiana, US
    Posts
    11,278
    Quote Originally Posted by RICH1471 View Post
    How much combat experience do you have?
    Only what I got in basic and periodic exercises. Never actually been in combat. But it doesn't matter. I know for a fact that I would NEVER under any circumstance use civilians as shields. And don't tell me that you would. I know enough about the British armed forces to know that's a lie.

  14. #334
    The Unstoppable Force RICH816's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Portsmouth, UK
    Posts
    22,925
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    Only what I got in basic and periodic exercises. Never actually been in combat. But it doesn't matter. I know for a fact that I would NEVER under any circumstance use civilians as shields. And don't tell me that you would. I know enough about the British armed forces to know that's a lie.
    No, I would never use civvies as a shield, But I would never make a statement without knowing 100% how I would react. My biggest fear used to be freezing up in combat and getting people killed, it still is. My point is, you know jack shit until it happens to you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes View Post
    I do sympathize with these so called terrorist organisations. As far as I'm concerned, at least they are fighting for something they believe in, and for what they see to be the greater good. They're not fighting to line the pockets of statesmen, governors and oil barons. I wish we could the same about the people on this side of the planet.
    Hobbes talking about Al Qaeda and ISIS.

  15. #335
    Pit Lord
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic, Euro-Atlantic civilisation
    Posts
    2,381
    Quote Originally Posted by Zhangfei View Post
    Israel attacked Palestine in 1948. Nice comment calling it an "independence war" when it was already independent though. Great doublethink.
    Ok so you are telling me that had Israel lost in 1948, that it would go on existing? I dont think even your in your super biased position can claim that.

    Seems you are so uneducated and/or biased that we will simply have to go back to the very basics:
    Israel declared independence in accordance with the UN resolution, and all of the Arab countries in the region reacted by attacking Israel, forces from Palestine joined in this attack.
    Arab countries lost their war of aggression and Israel decided to take some territory to make more defensible borders, which is nothing new, states that begin aggressive wars tend to loose territory (just look at eastern Prussia for an example just 3 years earlier)

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-14 at 10:23 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Mnevis View Post
    There were offensive campaigns in '48. I mean, think about it logically, they had to go from Tel Aviv and a few other settlements and towns (the 7% they'd accumulated (more or less) legitimately) to the 1949 Green Line somehow, right? He said "Straight after the civil war happened"; I think it's pretty obvious the period of time that he's talking about. Just because our mythology pretends that all Israeli military action is defensive (except for taking the Sinai, which they gave back), doesn't mean he's the one that's confused.

    And the word is 'conflate'.



    There are people who glorify the tactics of Palestinian militants, but you won't find them here. I'm probably one of the people you're talking about, right? What opinion of Hamas did I post on the first page of this thread?

    Being capable of sympathy for the innocents on both sides, pointing out which side has all the power, realizing that even the poor, angry, kids manipulated into blowing themselves up to murder innocent Israelis are in fact humans, that's hardly glorifying. Many would say it's a necessary step to realizing a peace.
    Go study the original 2 state UN solution before going on about 7% of the territory, for other points, see my reply to Zhangfei.
    Quote Originally Posted by belfpala View Post
    This law abiding person doesn't consider taking your guns away to be a punishment.
    Quote Originally Posted by JfmC View Post
    someone who disagrees with me is simply wrong.

  16. #336
    Are you people still trying to beat sense into Zhangfei? He lives in a parallel dimension in which the holocaust never happened, where zionists descended from their high towers to take over the peaceful lands of the Palestinians, and where the Jewish overlords torture children for pleasure on a daily basis.

    Trying to talk sense with such people is like attempting to ask a rabid dog to sit. All they will ever do is bark back at you and attempt to bite.

    Infracted for flaming.
    Last edited by Wikiy; 2012-11-14 at 11:54 PM.

  17. #337
    Pit Lord
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Czech Republic, Euro-Atlantic civilisation
    Posts
    2,381
    Quote Originally Posted by Valort View Post
    Are you people still trying to beat sense into Zhangfei? He lives in a parallel dimension in which the holocaust never happened, where zionists descended from their high towers to take over the peaceful lands of the Palestinians, and where the Jewish overlords torture children for pleasure on a daily basis.

    Trying to talk sense with such people is like attempting to ask a rabid dog to sit. All they will ever do is bark back at you and attempt to bite.
    Oh I am well aware that he is quite the racist. Thing is, you are completely correct that he will probably not come to see reality, but you can influence the people that read the threads and might be swayed by his claims of being educated.

    Misinformation and outright lies must be corrected and getting such a person to change their mind would be a bonus, not a necessity.
    Quote Originally Posted by belfpala View Post
    This law abiding person doesn't consider taking your guns away to be a punishment.
    Quote Originally Posted by JfmC View Post
    someone who disagrees with me is simply wrong.

  18. #338
    Bloodsail Admiral soulcrusher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    A Black Land of Sorcery and Nameless Horror
    Posts
    1,145
    the biggest holocaust denier i see here is you zoranon. you refuse to see the holocaust inflicted on the palestinian people by zionist europeans who have stole their land.

  19. #339
    Quote Originally Posted by soulcrusher View Post
    the biggest holocaust denier i see here is you zoranon. you refuse to see the holocaust inflicted on the palestinian people by zionist europeans who have stole their land.
    The fact that you even compare the two situations is more than enough evidence that you have no inkling of what said situation is.

  20. #340
    Brewmaster Klingers's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Parliament of the Daleks
    Posts
    1,442
    Sick to bloody death of hearing about this. At what point can we just syphon all the oil out of the middle east, offer a plane ticket to anyone living there that just wants a good life and is rational and decent enough to leave their useless blood-feuds at the door, then build a concrete fence around the place and let them destroy each other? Nothing short of that'll fix the problem.
    Knowledge is power, and power corrupts. So study hard and be evil.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •