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  1. #1021
    The Undying Wildtree's Avatar
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    Let's not derail this thread.

  2. #1022
    Quote Originally Posted by The North Remembers View Post
    I didn't know that setting up a naval blockade to prevent other countries from giving relief is considered "aid" in Israel..
    Perhaps you should check into what 'aid' was on the ships that tried to run the blockade miss. Also, why is it they refused to allow it to be inspected? hmm? if it truly was 'aid' what was the harm in having it inspected, additionally, where is the news coverage of the tons of food, and other things that Israel DOES allow into Gaza AFTER inspecting it?

    Reckon that doesn't fit the narrative of Israel being evil and needing to be wiped off the map.

  3. #1023
    I'm struggling with Hama's rational for continued rocket strikes.
    Not from a moral aspect, I can understand that, even though I disagree with it.
    But tactically, they’re just ineffective and only prolonging the conflict.

    On that note, the Iron Dome is certainly living up to all the hype.

  4. #1024
    Brewmaster soulcrusher's Avatar
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    So youd have us believe that

    There is no blockade
    There is no such thing as Palestine
    Palestinians should be grateful for the aid we give them

    Really all of the above show the mass of lies and delusion that is the israeli view point.

    Israel enforces a blockade whilst drilling for gas off the coast of gaza. The people killed and injured in international waters may not agree on the legality of your blockade.
    People lived in Palestine long before modern Israel was bought from the British
    Grateful for aid that they wouldn't need if you hadn't stolen their land and walled them up in a ghetto.

    I quote your own founders acknowledging stealing the land. Proposing ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians and still you trot out lie after lie.

  5. #1025
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    Oh great....
    Congrats on the stupidest posting so far in 52 pages..
    War against Islam..... unbelievable.. you want to start a religious war, which would likely be another world war, to end religion? How idiotic can it be?
    Educate yourself about the sheer number balance.... Islam etc/Christianity
    Your post isn't a lot better. Where does he say he wants a religious war, hmm? Where does he say he's christian? Assume much?

    Anyway, as for me I couldn't care less if the entire area was nuked. Both sides can be wiped off the map for all I care. I'm not saying I would actively work towards that outcome, but if it happened I wouldn't have any problem with it. Only way for there to be peace in that part of the world apparently.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-19 at 07:20 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by smelltheglove View Post
    really? just... damn. mind amending that to a war against religious zealotry instead of singling out islam?
    Well, to be honest Islam is probably the worst. Judaism isn't a whole lot better. Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc are relatively peaceful.

    But yeah, reducing religious zealotry is the right way to put it. But if only it were that easy.

  6. #1026
    Mechagnome lupii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardstyler01 View Post
    Well, to be honest Islam is probably the worst. Judaism isn't a whole lot better. Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc are relatively peaceful.

    But yeah, reducing religious zealotry is the right way to put it. But if only it were that easy.
    Historically, Christianity was the big problem. What, with it's 10+ crusades under the church, attacking Judaism and Islam.

    Now, up to the conflicts with Israel and the Gaza strip, I do not know of any war started in the name of Judaism. Please correct me if I am wrong.

    Islam is the really interesting thing because it is probably the most peaceful in nature of the religions. it is the leaders that propagate these wars and label it religion as a reason. But that is like anything. For example, Al-Qaeda practice a corrupted variant of Islam to meet their needs, where they are taught to sacrifice themselves, etc.

  7. #1027
    To me this isn't a Palestine vs Israel deal.

    It's a Hamas vs Israel. For whatever reason a group of extremists got power in Palestine and are using the the fact that everyone feels that Israel is going too far to their advantage.

    However I do question several things.

    1)For more than a few strikes that the Hamas claim have hit civilian areas and killed civilians why is it that they've hurriedly removed all traces of the shells. You'd think they'd want people to take pics to demonstrate how evil Israel is. Food for thought.

    2)They're blatantly and proudly firing their missiles indiscriminately into densely populated areas while crying foul about Israel's retaliation. And the international media's lapping it up. Does Israel need to allow a missile to strike an area and suffer numerous casualties for people to realise that the Hamas are NOT playing by the rules laid out by most civilised countries?

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-19 at 08:46 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by lupii View Post
    Historically, Christianity was the big problem. What, with it's 10+ crusades under the church, attacking Judaism and Islam.

    Now, up to the conflicts with Israel and the Gaza strip, I do not know of any war started in the name of Judaism. Please correct me if I am wrong.

    Islam is the really interesting thing because it is probably the most peaceful in nature of the religions. it is the leaders that propagate these wars and label it religion as a reason. But that is like anything. For example, Al-Qaeda practice a corrupted variant of Islam to meet their needs, where they are taught to sacrifice themselves, etc.

    So much this.

    Let's assume for a moment that Israel didn't exist, or Israel was defeated and dissolved. Would the middle east become a peaceful zone with everyone happy and ponies for everyone?

    Hell No.

    Most Middle Eastern countries have their own personal beefs with one another ranging from ancient insults that they themselves only remember to differing ways that they interpret the Koran. The only thing currently binding them together is that they all dislike Israel to some degree. Ironic that the only thing stopping the Middle East from erupting into a free for all is the very country so many love to hate.
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  8. #1028
    Merely a Setback Reeve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lupii View Post
    Historically, Christianity was the big problem. What, with it's 10+ crusades under the church, attacking Judaism and Islam.
    Don't forget the Inquisition.

    Now, up to the conflicts with Israel and the Gaza strip, I do not know of any war started in the name of Judaism. Please correct me if I am wrong.
    /sing Joshua at the Battle of Jericho, and the walls came tumbling down. /stopsinging

    And remind me again, how many Philistine foreskins did David have to collect in battle in order to win the hand of Saul's daughter?
    Last edited by Reeve; 2012-11-19 at 08:57 PM.
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  9. #1029
    Quote Originally Posted by Olo View Post
    I'm struggling with Hama's rational for continued rocket strikes.
    Not from a moral aspect, I can understand that, even though I disagree with it.
    But tactically, they’re just ineffective and only prolonging the conflict.

    On that note, the Iron Dome is certainly living up to all the hype.
    This just smells fishy. It seems like this all might have been just to test their new defense system.

    Either way, what do you expect Palestinians to do? They've effectively been wiped off the map and have blockades stopping rations/aid to come to them. Firing rockets seems to be their last and only resort against growing settlements.
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  10. #1030
    The Undying
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyanEX View Post
    Most Middle Eastern countries have their own personal beefs with one another ranging from ancient insults that they themselves only remember to differing ways that they interpret the Koran. The only thing currently binding them together is that they all dislike Israel to some degree. Ironic that the only thing stopping the Middle East from erupting into a free for all is the very country so many love to hate.
    Very interesting point. I wonder if any one there understands that, too?

  11. #1031
    The Lightbringer N-7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardstyler01 View Post
    Well, to be honest Islam is probably the worst. Judaism isn't a whole lot better. Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc are relatively peaceful.

    But yeah, reducing religious zealotry is the right way to put it. But if only it were that easy.
    You know about history as much as my grandma knows about smartphones which isn't really much...

  12. #1032
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flaks View Post
    Either way, what do you expect Palestinians to do? They've effectively been wiped off the map and have blockades stopping rations/aid to come to them. Firing rockets seems to be their last and only resort against growing settlements.
    They could try not electing terrorists and killing random civilians. Blockades are only happening because they won't let the ships be inspected for weapons, and are really being used for political purposes, rather than aid. Israel provides aid to Palestine, fyi.

  13. #1033
    The Lightbringer N-7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyanEX View Post
    So much this.

    Let's assume for a moment that Israel didn't exist, or Israel was defeated and dissolved. Would the middle east become a peaceful zone with everyone happy and ponies for everyone?

    Hell No.

    Most Middle Eastern countries have their own personal beefs with one another ranging from ancient insults that they themselves only remember to differing ways that they interpret the Koran. The only thing currently binding them together is that they all dislike Israel to some degree. Ironic that the only thing stopping the Middle East from erupting into a free for all is the very country so many love to hate.
    It is not like that Israel is being attacked by these countries 24/7. If you really think that Israel existence has anything to do with how the region will interact with itself, you're hugely mistaken.

    EDIT: hint hint who waged most of the wars in the Middle East? it wasn't the Arabs.

  14. #1034
    Quote Originally Posted by soulcrusher View Post
    People lived in Palestine long before modern Israel was bought from the British
    And yet, no nation on Earth, not even a Muslim nation would take the Palestinians in. Israel has absorbed millions, and were willing to let the Palestinians live there too - provided they didn't have to be recognized as a separate nation - and as nomadic people, that probably shouldn't have been a big deal - but no. They (through Arafat) refused any sanctions, demanding to be either Palestine or nothing.

    Something is telling in the fact that no one wants the Palestinians except the Israelis' - too bad they burned the bridge, stole the charred remains, buried them in the sand and left them to rot.

    I hear Iraq has a lot of new openings for immigrants though. /sarcasm.

  15. #1035
    Immortal SirRobin's Avatar
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    I have to say I'm confused by this one. Granted they have generations, even centuries, of built in hate over there. Still, if you start killing people in a country's government, whether a legitimate regime or not. They are going to try and strike back. So that whole "we had no choice" thing sounds a little fishy to me.
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  16. #1036
    The Lightbringer N-7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    They could try not electing terrorists and killing random civilians. Blockades are only happening because they won't let the ships be inspected for weapons, and are really being used for political purposes, rather than aid. Israel provides aid to Palestine, fyi.
    Again one of cubby's pointless post. Could you give us a plan on how a group of unarmed civilians can take out Hamas out of the picture? You condemning the Palestinians over something that they have no control over is disgusting.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-19 at 09:20 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Theodoxus View Post
    And yet, no nation on Earth, not even a Muslim nation would take the Palestinians in. Israel has absorbed millions, and were willing to let the Palestinians live there too - provided they didn't have to be recognized as a separate nation - and as nomadic people, that probably shouldn't have been a big deal - but no. They (through Arafat) refused any sanctions, demanding to be either Palestine or nothing.

    Something is telling in the fact that no one wants the Palestinians except the Israelis' - too bad they burned the bridge, stole the charred remains, buried them in the sand and left them to rot.

    I hear Iraq has a lot of new openings for immigrants though. /sarcasm.
    Is it wrong to want to be recognised as a nation?

  17. #1037
    Quote Originally Posted by N-7 View Post
    Again one of cubby's pointless post. Could you give us a plan on how a group of unarmed civilians can take out Hamas out of the picture? You condemning the Palestinians over something that they have no control over is disgusting.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-19 at 09:20 PM ----------


    Is it wrong to want to be recognised as a nation?
    Palestine is a nation in name only - they were nomads, living in the area for generations. Different tribes that claimed a spit of land that had been wiped out by the Romans. They weren't even unified until Israel was granted by the British. It's only because no one would take them in and incorporate them that they created the PLO and began plotting the overthrow of their 'oppressors'. Arafat was really the big evil here. This is just a continuation of his pogrom. It's sad. But as was noted, those in the Middle East seem to have the longest memories regarding insults and retaliation.

  18. #1038
    Quote Originally Posted by N-7 View Post
    Again one of cubby's pointless post. Could you give us a plan on how a group of unarmed civilians can take out Hamas out of the picture? You condemning the Palestinians over something that they have no control over is disgusting.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-19 at 09:20 PM ----------


    Is it wrong to want to be recognised as a nation?
    In a country full of guns and rockets, I'm sure Johnny McPalestinian can conjure up some munitions.

  19. #1039
    All the racism in this thread. How is it not locked? Israel and America are the only terrorists, the other people are doing what little they can against a giant.

  20. #1040
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodoxus View Post
    Palestine is a nation in name only - they were nomads, living in the area for generations. Different tribes that claimed a spit of land that had been wiped out by the Romans. They weren't even unified until Israel was granted by the British. It's only because no one would take them in and incorporate them that they created the PLO and began plotting the overthrow of their 'oppressors'.
    I think you just flawlessly described the Jewish people for the past 4000+ years right there.
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