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  1. #21
    Herald of the Titans Seriss's Avatar
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    We tried with 0 tanks, but our pally was taking so much damage, it was ridiculous. So our pally remains tank, our dk goes frost, we run with 3 healers and 5 dps.

    Pheromones: DK takes first, then pally-tank, then resto druid, then resto shaman (me). That leaves our dps fully on the boss. Before we tried this strat, we had a lot of 5% or so wipes. As soon as we tried this one, Garalon was dead as soon as no silly mistakes were made.

  2. #22
    My 10m guild killed is this week with pretty much the same setup, 5 dps, 2 tanks 3 healers.

    Almost all of our enrage wipes were because we were doing the legs wrong and having everyone nuke them as soon as they popped up, after we left our warrior and rogue to do the legs and got everyone else to focus on the body 100% of the time he just rolled over.

    Also your rogue is doing terrible dps, he should be hitting 110-120k minimum, I'm guessing it's partially due to you not leaving the legs up long enough, try to find a sweet spot where you have 1-2 up at all times, if you're getting 3 active at the same time move the dk onto them temporarily to help out.

    TL;DR There should always be a leg alive for your rogue & warrior to cleave off of, everyone else kills the body, don't panic if you get more than 2 legs up, just assign 1 extra dps to help out.
    Last edited by Thisisanalt; 2012-11-13 at 03:41 PM.

  3. #23
    Brewmaster smegdawg's Avatar
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    Gonna toss this in here so I don't have to make my own thread.

    Last night we spent 3 hours on garalon and in the last our we got him to 15%->13%->11%->9%->5%. So he is going down and will die this week. I looking for any ways to maximize our dps so that this kill can happen faster.

    Set up

    Prot pally
    Blood Dk

    Resto Shaman
    resto Druid
    Disc Priest

    Unholy DK
    spriest
    fire mage
    affy warlock
    surv hunter(I think)

    Our kiters are Shaman>Lock>Druid>Hunter. I want to use the tanks but they are not able to do it so this is what we have.

    The Unholy DK is full time leg duty and the tanks are front left leg(kiting clockwise) and if the front right leg is up.

    Now is it more beneficial to have me Spriest and mage chasing the legs around or just have them standing in the middle punching the boss?

    There was a miss communication last night as to who was recording logs so sadly I do not have any, however over most of the attempt the unholy dk was towards the bottom.

  4. #24
    Preface : My experience
    first kill last night : 2 healers, 1 plate dps soaking front, 3 range + 1 healer kites. We had to put more pressure on healers(HPal, MW) because DPS just wasn't there. I (am the MW) asked our hybrid dps to save their cooldowns to my demand (wether it's tranq/T5 shaman/T6 shadow priest etc.). While it is indeed 2 healable, I hate to aknowledge this but it's MW being part broken for the encounter mechanics. I'm sure elite players can do it with most 2 healers setup but the average progression guild will likely need to 3 heal for another while before 2 healers can outgear it.

    @OP - My advices
    1. Do not use 2 tanks AND 3 healers in 10m. Assuming both your BrM and prot warrior have similar DPS gear, you should have the prot warr go dps(as he has better cleaves than WW) and soak the cleaves while cleaving from a front leg to the boss while staying in the cone.

    2. Have at least 2 if not 3 of your healers do the kite. In order to not render them completely useless while they kite (aka don't kite 50 miles ahead of boss), I recommend kiting in a Z shape rather than a straight line (leave pool top left, then top right then back left then back right and so on). By far the worst kiting healer is MW(as all of his chi gen comes from jabs on this fight) and likely priest afterwards. Aka your healer setup really allows for good healer kites - esp if there's a shaman-druid symbiosis for SWG on druid.

    3. Have your Rdruid spec HotW, prepot and spam wrath for the first 45s (and hopefully again 6 mins in after everyone has been picked up from a pheromone swap crush). Noticed a bear tank hit 50k dps with 33% of it being from Wrath spam on some log yesterday. (just now noticed this was done through mangle+FB spam on a log)

    4. I would refrain from having your hpal soak with the tank. It is wiser to just use him as a kiter instead thus freeing your dps from loss of dps through movement. A plate dps standing in front can do the job. At worse, warrior can stance dance on the cleaves at high pheromones stacks.

    5. Save legs (esp front) to dps with natural cleaves. Your rogue has faaaar too low %dmg from Blade Flurry. It is actually wise to leave front legs to a single cleaver even on the pull like front left to the warrior(s) and front right to the rogue for example.

    6. Have your lock run a diff spec. I understand from your post that he was kiting so his dps should, indeed be lower but it is just way off. Our GM has 5-6 Ilvl above his and he was pulling 75k on failed attempts as the first kiter as affliction. 85-90k ish if I remember on kill shot since then there is no decay from the time it takes to wipe -_-. This way he can just keep fulls dots on respawned back legs and boss at all time and you eventually call a quick burn on primed back leg when needed rather than forcing yourself to consistently swap to it.


    Also @Rawhammer
    We tried 3 healers/7 dps setup having 2 rets soaking, 2 healers kiting (MW and Hpal) and 2 range (aff lock and mage). Part of the wipes were me kiting (MW) instead of our Rsham since MW can cover aoe dmg solo up to 20 pheromones fairly easily while the sham needed help from hpal which would eventually result in either of the 2 tanks not receiving enough heals on a cleave/crush/pheromone(20) combo.

    I'm not saying it's not doable but it requires major monitoring of which healer is asigned to soakers at what time (since depending on kite and raid-wide dmg it becomes harsh to keep up on soakers). Unless you run 2 hpals (for dbl beacon) I'm affraid it's easier to run 1 tank 1 soak + 2 healers rather than 0 tank 2 soaks + 3 healers.


    *edit*
    Quote Originally Posted by smegdawg View Post
    Our kiters are Shaman>Lock>Druid>Hunter. I want to use the tanks but they are not able to do it so this is what we have.
    The Unholy DK is full time leg duty and the tanks are front left leg(kiting clockwise) and if the front right leg is up.
    Now is it more beneficial to have me Spriest and mage chasing the legs around or just have them standing in the middle punching the boss?
    Since UH Dk doesn't have any clear cleave button, I would recommend trying to keep 2 legs up at almost all time for your SP, Aff and Fire mage to cleave the legs off. Your fire mage should also have a "leg of his own" (only holds whenever combust is up) under which he will go stand (green line - - -) to get his first full combust with the damage buff that he can then spread to the boss.

    The underlying DPS gain, while the 3 casters might not always be within the circle when they cleave the legs, is that they get additionnal procs, use higher DPC spells etc. etc. It also helps a lot with the necessary movement esp for shadow priests.

    As for positionning, I had ranged stack somewhere close to me (MW) between the 2 legs "inside" the kiting circle in case I would need to SCK for slight extra healing than jab as chi gen. Ultimately it didn't matter that much although I think it's wise for casters to play "sightly mobile" like near melee such that they can dot cleave all availible legs. It also helps for the various aoe heals like WG and possibly healing rain since you guys are ranged heavy while retaining range on soakers for all healers.

    Other than that, 5% for a 2 tank/3 heal setup is still very nice. Means your DPSers are actually pulling good weight. I'm guessing your disc is attonement-healing shortly after people get picked up after crushes and pulls a 15k+ dps too right? If not that should be the first place you look for to close the 5% gap. Next place probably to turn a tank into a dps soaker. This is really potent.
    Last edited by Deau; 2012-11-13 at 05:12 PM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by smegdawg View Post
    Gonna toss this in here so I don't have to make my own thread.

    Last night we spent 3 hours on garalon and in the last our we got him to 15%->13%->11%->9%->5%. So he is going down and will die this week. I looking for any ways to maximize our dps so that this kill can happen faster.

    Set up

    Prot pally
    Blood Dk

    Resto Shaman
    resto Druid
    Disc Priest

    Unholy DK
    spriest
    fire mage
    affy warlock
    surv hunter(I think)

    Our kiters are Shaman>Lock>Druid>Hunter. I want to use the tanks but they are not able to do it so this is what we have.

    The Unholy DK is full time leg duty and the tanks are front left leg(kiting clockwise) and if the front right leg is up.

    Now is it more beneficial to have me Spriest and mage chasing the legs around or just have them standing in the middle punching the boss?

    There was a miss communication last night as to who was recording logs so sadly I do not have any, however over most of the attempt the unholy dk was towards the bottom.


    We spent our first night on him and got the kill after a few hours. Get your blood dk to tank in full dps gear, we had the same setup with kiters/tanks/healers just different classes and we were 5% off a kill, we switched a rogue in for a pally tank and got him to use cds to soak the the furious swipes and we got the kill.
    Tell the dps to prioritize the back legs and the boss. Get your tanks to kill the front legs as they have nothing to do and leaves dps with more boss uptime.
    Your cd rotation for the crushes should go something like:

    1) Tranq
    2) Healthstones + Vampiric Embrace
    3) Healing Tide Totem + Devoution Aura
    4) Spirit Link Totem
    5) Barrier + Tree form

    Rinse Repeat

    Our healing comp consisted of Restro druid, Mistweaver Monk and Disc/Holy priest. The mistweaver just sat on the boss throughout and raid healed along with the druid. The disc priest covered pheramone targets. We ended up switching our disc out for the holy priest because a) disc wasnt contributing much dps b) Divine Hymn is stronger than barrier on this fight, and spirit shell can be a pain to utilize effectively with raid being so spread. Heroing at 20% worked better for us to help the healers and dps because of execute/SW abilites etc...

    TLDR: Bench a tank for a mdps who's good with his cd's to soak Furious Swipes, or tell your tank to tank in full dps/strength gear.

  6. #26
    Thank you for all the help.

    We caught our error. Our dps was lost by nuking legs at all times. Our rogue was using Blade Furry only 46%. We are going to keep the legs up for the dedicated melee. I think with that change and possibly loc going affliction, we ll be able to down it. One thing that I find interesting is that most kill logs (I have seen) show very high uptime from tanks and all dps in the group. Our active time was lacking a bit. I am hoping that by keeping tanks closer to the boss and having the range/healer kite barely outside the frontal cone attack, we can also gain active dps time.

    Few tricks that I found from my resto perspective.

    Resto shaman can take the swipes, I had no problem with it (earth ele+talent, bulwark totem+extra reset talent, stone form, safeguard, plus a stam flask). I could take the swipes as well as lay pheromone trail with 40k hps going out and 99% active time. Its not necessary, I am just saying that it can be done.


    We are going to go with 3 healers, 1 BrM 1 Fury (soaking), 2 healers and 2 soakers on pheromones, arms warrior/rogue on legs (except the first pull), the rest of dps on the boss.

    Tomorrow, here we come.

    Thanks for all the help

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-15 at 02:09 PM ----------

    @rawhammer

    On my resto shammy:

    I soaked the swipes and took part in the pheromone rotation as a healer. We wiped at 16 mil. I could do it with a warrior tank using safeguard. I dont think that soaking with 2 healers will benefit you much. The healing output will be severely nerfed by the swipes, the range issue, and the pheromone trail mechanics.

    Damage wise, here is the log http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=3456&e=3882

    I took only a bit more damage then the warrior tank. Stone bulwark totem absorbed over 1 million damage alone. Overall the issue for me was range to my HST and HTT. I think I could have solved it with the totemic projection. Same with spirit link, it became useless.

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