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  1. #41
    I do like it when the Blues call people on the crap they post, because on the whole that's what it is, crap.

    People would get on better if they understood that it's not a direct line to blizzard, that it's a forum for players that they happen to read, that whatever amazing little bit of insight you have, should be posted in the thread that exists not a new one and especially not a new one with BLIZZARD READ THIS!! in the title.....

    You only need to look here, at the people posting thinking this is the official site to see the number of people who simply don't read or understand.

    The mentality of too many people is "I pay my money, now you must listen to me and do what I want" and those people are always going to be disappointed because it's hard to sift through the river of shit that posted for the nuggets, the fact that they try (to me anyway) is impressive.
    Last edited by Mooboy; 2012-11-13 at 03:54 PM.
    "The fact that you don't get it or like it is fine. The fact that you wanna ruin it for everyone else - that's why you're a cocksucker." - Bill Hicks
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    The playerbase has been desiring this for years and when it's finally here, everyone wants to grab a pitchfork. Ridiculous. This community is disgustingly toxic.

  2. #42
    A thousand and one times yes, very much yes. They are walking a fine line, but so far I'm loving the blue text lately. I hope they keep it up.

  3. #43
    Bloodsail Admiral Rickmagnus's Avatar
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    Blizzard CMs are owning the complainers with simple logic. I approve.
    "I don't believe in an afterlife, so I don't have to spend my whole life fearing hell, or fearing heaven even more. For whatever the tortures of hell, I think the boredom of heaven would be even worse."
    “Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'” - Issac Asimov

  4. #44
    Blademaster Autier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by katji View Post
    I'd prefer Blizzard employees post constructively like they tell everyone to do, but they've lowered their standards to those complaining and have a blue clown running around with his head cutoff, drowning boats with his clown car from Twisted Metal. Yet nothing is getting accomplished.
    Have you read anything Zarhym has posted lately?

    I don't know why forum-goers expect blues to take as much disrespect and abuse as they do and react to it as shining paragons of chastity and virtue, turning the symbolic 'other cheek,' all the while coddling and placating every person that drops a qq bomb.

  5. #45
    Titan Kangodo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeverin View Post
    I wonder about something: why is it acceptable for us that a customer should complain about a defective car, bad hotel conditions, a rude waiter, lousy internet connections to the ISP, but when it comes to video games, the general reaction is to tell the complainer to STFU and to mock him?
    Interesting.
    Next time that you're in a hotel, you should tell them that you don't like the colour of the rooms.
    A week later you should book a room again.
    This time, you yell at them for not doing anything with your feedback.

    And I love that you bring up the ISP-thing, because I worked at the CS of an ISP.
    We'd get people on the phone that are yelling and raging because we wouldn't fix their dead monitor.
    I have talked to people that insulted me because we don't support their "Walmart"-router.
    One day I had a guy threatening to sue me because I wouldn't fix the outside-cable that is city-property.

    If a customer is making retarded and impossible demands, you should tell them that.
    The rest of the customers will appreciate that and have more respect/loyalty to you.

  6. #46
    As funny as the guy crying about dailies yet has 9 90s was, he did raise a good point in that reputation this expansion is quite ridiculous. First off, I'm not asking for a WotLK/Cata tabard system, as I agree with the points people made about it making dungeons the one-stop shop for everything. As for my complaints on the current reputation system;

    1. Aside from Brood of Nozdormu pre-AQ gates opening, I can't think of a non-vanity reputation (i.e. only offers mounts, tabards, pets, or titles) that had a single reliable way of gaining rep before MoP.

    2. Until MoP, no reputation has ever gated your progress into other reputations (SP and AC requiring revered with GL before you can continue/start gaining rep with them).

    3. Why does Wrathion care about you killing no-name Mogu and Mantid out in the world when his rewards only affect people who raid?

    Just to repeat myself; I AM NOT ASKING FOR THE WOTLK+CATA TABARD SYSTEM BACK. All I would like is another way to get rep beyond grinding dailies (i.e. killing bosses in dungeons related to a specific faction on heroic mode), hoping for random zone drops (Dread Amber Shards are the bane of my existance) or just remove the Golden Lotus gating so that I can pursue any reputation at my discretion. If any of these 3 points are wrong, please correct me.

  7. #47
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeverin View Post
    While it is new, refreshing and soap opera material when devs "biting back" at forum QQ, I still somehow have the feeling they are disrespecting the customer.

    I wonder about something: why is it acceptable for us that a customer should complain about a defective car, bad hotel conditions, a rude waiter, lousy internet connections to the ISP, but when it comes to video games, the general reaction is to tell the complainer to STFU and to mock him?
    Interesting.
    I'm going to take this one, as someone who has worked in customer service (IRL) for well over a decade. It's not that someone is complaining, it's HOW and WHY they're complaining. Let's take two examples.

    Example 1 : "Excuse me, but I ordered this burger with no pickles and it has pickles on it. Can I get this corrected , please?"

    Example 2 : "I TOLD the lady that took my order I didn't want any pickles, and there's pickles on this burger. I demand a free combo now because your cashier can't do her job right!"

    Now, let's do some word replacements. Let's replace pickles with anything involving WoW's progression path (dailies, LFD, LFR, random BG's, ect.) and burger with the end results of the progression path (heroic mode raiding, RBG's, ect.). Now, guys. You tell me...how would you respond to both of those situations?

    Example 2 is how 99.999999999999999999999% of the complaining is done in the video game industry, and I'm pretty sure it's noticed the most in regards to Blizzard online games (WoW and D3 mainly). Now, I don't know about you, but if someone comes to me with the second example as their attitude, I'm 99.99999999999999999% likely to tell them to go self-fornicate with a rusty iron pole. Which, to my knowledge, Blizzard blue posters have never told anyone to do. So, if anything, give Blizzard credit where credit is obviously due. They're showing an INCREDIBLE amount of restraint for the garbage that gets tossed at them on an hourly basis by the people that play their games.

  8. #48
    In some cases it's warranted, but by and large the devs are huge assholes. I honestly they sooner fire every CM and I didn't have to see blue-post assholiness every day. And even when it is warranted - it's not refreshing, and it's not humorous. Most of us already know those guys are just blowing off steam, so it's really not a big deal. The CMs' job should honestly be to try to elucidate the real problem rather than validating the rest of the fanboy kingdom's undying love for the game.

    But w/e - when 2Q2013 subs #s get released, we'll see who's still laughing. If these guys continue to be obstinate pricks about the shitty parts of the game a lot of folks are gonna vote with their free time and move on.
    Last edited by Stede; 2012-11-13 at 04:23 PM. Reason: spelling, I know - shoft+F7 didn't do anything...

  9. #49
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenixdown View Post
    Now, let's do some word replacements. Let's replace pickles with anything involving WoW's progression path (dailies, LFD, LFR, random BG's, ect.) and burger with the end results of the progression path (heroic mode raiding, RBG's, ect.). Now, guys. You tell me...how would you respond to both of those situations?
    Now apply the same for forums. Then also look at the culture of acceptance of it. Then look how things have become as a result of it.

    Blizzard got what it got for being AWOL. Coming back now, and doing it very harshly, they'll make the same mistake SOE did.

    But hey, if they refuse to learn history, they're doomed to repeat it.
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
    Blizzard's blame game in action: Deleting 6,100+ of Kevyne's posts and threads from the WoW forums.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by adam86shadow View Post
    But WoW isn't defective or not providing what's intended

    There's warranted complaining and then there's unfounded complaining. If you're really not happy don't pay SIMPLE

    You forget, most people who post these unfounded complaints over and over and too retarded to quit.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenixdown View Post
    I'm going to take this one, as someone who has worked in customer service (IRL) for well over a decade. It's not that someone is complaining, it's HOW and WHY they're complaining. Let's take two examples.

    Example 1 : "Excuse me, but I ordered this burger with no pickles and it has pickles on it. Can I get this corrected , please?"

    Example 2 : "I TOLD the lady that took my order I didn't want any pickles, and there's pickles on this burger. I demand a free combo now because your cashier can't do her job right!"

    Now, let's do some word replacements. Let's replace pickles with anything involving WoW's progression path (dailies, LFD, LFR, random BG's, ect.) and burger with the end results of the progression path (heroic mode raiding, RBG's, ect.). Now, guys. You tell me...how would you respond to both of those situations?

    Example 2 is how 99.999999999999999999999% of the complaining is done in the video game industry, and I'm pretty sure it's noticed the most in regards to Blizzard online games (WoW and D3 mainly). Now, I don't know about you, but if someone comes to me with the second example as their attitude, I'm 99.99999999999999999% likely to tell them to go self-fornicate with a rusty iron pole. Which, to my knowledge, Blizzard blue posters have never told anyone to do. So, if anything, give Blizzard credit where credit is obviously due. They're showing an INCREDIBLE amount of restraint for the garbage that gets tossed at them on an hourly basis by the people that play their games.
    And you'd get fired for that - at a burger joint. EVERYONE puts up with shit on a semi-regular basis - it's what's kept us all alive with the advent of things like nuclear weapons. Blizzard CMs are paid to elicit valuable feedback from the community and return that information to the devs. Restraint is part of the job. Getting righteous isn't. And if they'd bother to drop the Burger King / Slim Shady attitude, they might actually be able to help Blizzard make a better product, rather than alienate a solid portion of the community.

    Remember Cata's early months? The decline in subs? Most poor reviews cite the attitude of the CMs towards the community as a reason for the poor rating. Now, you'll all yak-yak about how these are QQ, greifers or whatever. They're an asset. Yeah. How many other games have folks this involved in providing critical feedback for the games they're playing? Likely none. Now - ragers aside, Blizzard has this huge asset in the contingent of folks who will tell them what they don't like, why they don't like it, and give Blizzard a chance to make it better before they unsub. Any other game and most people just head to GameStop, pick up something that 'doesnt suck' and move on.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by adam86shadow View Post
    I found the QQ U MAKE ME DO DAILIES WHEN I HAVE A WIFE AND KIDS P.S. I HAVE 9 LVL 90S guy hilarious in a 'Oh deary me' way
    I was finding that pretty idiotic as well. I have a 50 hour a week job, a wife and kids and I have one level 90 and two level 87s. If I had 9 level 90s right now and was complaining about being forced to do dailies my wife would have left me and taken the kids. I just do dailies when I feel like it, if not then I level an alt or run a dungeon or do a scenario or anything that is not a daily. Not going to complain about dailies. They are only mandatory if you are in a cutting edge progression guild and need to min/max your gear as fast as possible to give your guild every possible edge. But those people also have all day every day to play the game. Otherwise they are just something to waste 30 minutes to an hour on and then find something else to do.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Moradim View Post
    i dont mind when they reply, but when their responses read like a blizzard memo, its just annoying.

    dont give me the PR response, tell me what you think as an individual.
    They can't there's a major gag order going on in Blizzard right now, all I can say is I sincerely hope it's worth it to them.

    Friend of mine who actually does games reviewing for a major syndicate says all the other game producers are ecstatic with Activision/Blizzards current antics. "Sales have never been better for us, cheers Blizzard keep it up we're absolutely delighted to have your customers; seeing you don't want them anymore."

    I honestly believe in my opinion all this is being fueled by a large player in Activision so he can grab the company, my question what good will it do you if you enrage a good portion of your customer base to the point they never want to buy another game you produce?

    Granted I'm a 25 year Public relations/CSR specialist and trainer. What do I know.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by adam86shadow View Post
    I found the QQ U MAKE ME DO DAILIES WHEN I HAVE A WIFE AND KIDS P.S. I HAVE 9 LVL 90S guy hilarious in a 'Oh deary me' way
    Yea, that was pretty great. He was SUPER tactful about pointing out that his playtime was some flavor of crazy already, but he still did it, which was great.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Stede View Post
    And you'd get fired for that - at a burger joint. EVERYONE puts up with shit on a semi-regular basis - it's what's kept us all alive with the advent of things like nuclear weapons. Blizzard CMs are paid to elicit valuable feedback from the community and return that information to the devs. Restraint is part of the job. Getting righteous isn't. And if they'd bother to drop the Burger King / Slim Shady attitude, they might actually be able to help Blizzard make a better product, rather than alienate a solid portion of the community.

    Remember Cata's early months? The decline in subs? Most poor reviews cite the attitude of the CMs towards the community as a reason for the poor rating. Now, you'll all yak-yak about how these are QQ, greifers or whatever. They're an asset. Yeah. How many other games have folks this involved in providing critical feedback for the games they're playing? Likely none. Now - ragers aside, Blizzard has this huge asset in the contingent of folks who will tell them what they don't like, why they don't like it, and give Blizzard a chance to make it better before they unsub. Any other game and most people just head to GameStop, pick up something that 'doesnt suck' and move on.
    Problem is Blizzard just seems to be downtalking to their customer base. I've seen it happen in other companies, I've been asked to come in as a consultant role to some companies to help them with their losses of market share. One company lost 46% of his customer base, I agreed to do a walk around his company for a preliminary inspection. You'd be amazed what wallking around like an electrician inspecting lighting can reveal from employee's who just ignore you.

    After the preliminary I told the company I would not be taking the contract. When they asked why, I was brutally honest. "If I came in to help your company you'd have no employee's when I was done; I'd be forced to tell you to fire all of them." Worst customer service I thought I'd ever seen.

    Blizzard is starting to rank up with that company.

    Oh and how did that company I did investigate do, they were out of business by 3rd quarter of that year.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Tharn View Post
    I honestly believe in my opinion all this is being fueled by a large player in Activision so he can grab the company, my question what good will it do you if you enrage a good portion of your customer base to the point they never want to buy another game you produce?

    Granted I'm a 25 year Public relations/CSR specialist and trainer. What do I know.
    This is among the most hilarious nonsense ever posted in a forum with plenty of already dubious posters. This warrants tin foil body armor, no simple hat.

    On topic, while it's entertaining to see some morons being banned by Blizzard, the ship to get their forums into some resemblance of order has sailed years ago. They ceded the forums to the 24/7 whiners and drove away 95% of mature, respectful discussion. Getting rid of some of the trash now will not get the majority of paying customers involved in what could have been a meaningful way to generate feedback on their design decisions.

  17. #57
    Stood in the Fire raintrees's Avatar
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    basically the people in this thread who think what blizzard is doing wrong, as well as the people who actually make those disgusting crybaby posts, are usually people who are mad fun of on a constant basis, are so awkward and sub-human that they need to feel some form of ability to attack someone, so they attack with words the people who (they think) cant fight back. but then when they actually do get some lip they're so taken aback that they couldnt get someone kissing their ass that it infuriates them. thus getting the little remarks like in this thread.

    tl;dr grow a pair and stop being little whiney bitches to CS reps

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by raintrees View Post
    basically the people in this thread who think what blizzard is doing wrong, as well as the people who actually make those disgusting crybaby posts, are usually people who are mad fun of on a constant basis, are so awkward and sub-human that they need to feel some form of ability to attack someone, so they attack with words the people who (they think) cant fight back. but then when they actually do get some lip they're so taken aback that they couldnt get someone kissing their ass that it infuriates them. thus getting the little remarks like in this thread.

    tl;dr grow a pair and stop being little whiney bitches to CS reps
    Rain, that's there jobs to deal with customers good and bad, most all CSR's face the enraged customer - that's a CSR's job description. If CSR's are suffering burn out, which happens a ton, they need to re-evaluate their own professional goals. Good long term CSR's are very hard to find and when you do get them you as an employer better make sure you damn well keep them happy. Blizzard as an employer should be talking with their CSR's and finding ways to alleviate the stress on them from this "corporate directive the company has taken."

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Stede View Post
    Remember Cata's early months? The decline in subs? Most poor reviews cite the attitude of the CMs towards the community as a reason for the poor rating.
    Complete and utter bunk. Tying Cataclysm's subscription loss to CM comments is the ultimate stretch with no actual facts behind it, and plenty of facts against it. Starting with the fact that the majority of the player base never even reads the forums.

    Your post smells of someone who has engaged in these types of rant posts and is looking for justification.

    (Besides, everyone reading forums knows full well that its subs went down because the game was too hard / too easy / too casual / too old / too static / too changed, all at the same time. )

    My respect for a company goes up when they challenge rude customers back in a respectful way, which is as far as Blizzard takes it. Any company which rolls over with a neutered "we appreciate your feedback" response is a company which isn't listening anyway.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-13 at 05:21 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Tharn View Post
    Rain, that's there jobs to deal with customers good and bad, most all CSR's face the enraged customer - that's a CSR's job description. If CSR's are suffering burn out, which happens a ton, they need to re-evaluate their own professional goals. Good long term CSR's are very hard to find and when you do get them you as an employer better make sure you damn well keep them happy. Blizzard as an employer should be talking with their CSR's and finding ways to alleviate the stress on them from this "corporate directive the company has taken."
    For a guy who talks about how his credentials so much, you seem to be confusing the basics between a customer service rep and a community manager.

    Blizzard's reputation of customer service reps is quite good. Perhaps you could share with us some of these other gaming companies with better customer service?
    Help control the population. Have your blood elf spayed or neutered.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Tharn View Post
    I honestly believe in my opinion all this is being fueled by a large player in Activision so he can grab the company, my question what good will it do you if you enrage a good portion of your customer base to the point they never want to buy another game you produce?
    .
    And I honestly believe that a large portion of the playerbase is just burnt out. And when you're burnt out you complain...ALOT! I'd guess half the playerbase is probably at a place where it's time to move on. The guy with nine level 90s, complaining about dailies. I actually get his point. I have three 90s and I absolutely hate that I need to do the same boring dailies on all of them to unlock some of the VP gear I want\need. But the difference is, I refuse to do the dailies if I don't feel like it. I completely get the OCD behavior that makes me feel like "I have to do them" and when I do them and hate it, I hate on myself not Blizzard.

    I do think they should of already had in place or already implemented the double Rep gains, like they have for the Valor. Which OBTW, Blizzard doesn't seem to get much praise for doing that, only "give me more more more" I don't know that Blizzard is ever going to have the happy customer base it enjoyed back in Vanilla and TBC. Times have change, people are looking for more instant action, like they get from Call of Duty or Battlefield 3. Grinding along just isn't what the new generation wants.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stede View Post

    Remember Cata's early months? The decline in subs? Most poor reviews cite the attitude of the CMs towards the community as a reason for the poor rating. .
    Well, you'll probably say it was just spin. But the general answer Blizzard gave (Tom Chilton, New York Times interview) was because many of those people found the game too hard. Sure some didn't like Ghostcrawler's Heroics are hard post, but what someone posts rarely leads to people quitting something they enjoy, unless they called everyone mindless monkeys or something over the top.
    Last edited by Mad_Murdock; 2012-11-13 at 05:35 PM.

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