Extreme nostalgia is one of the biggest thing hurting the game.

[MasterHamster]

If only the nostalgics could leave instead of spreading their unsatisfied rants over and over, or passive aggressive crap. How ironic that these often talk about how the community has gotten worse when all they do themselves is to spread negativity around them.

Another thing, in what alternate universe would people still play classic today if they never added expansions to improve the game? Since barely anyone ever got into Naxx, what would they do? Start doing parallel raids? Then again classic survived by gating players with endless grinds, onyxia scale cloaks, resistance and other shit so they wouldn't really need to produce a lot of content to keep us occupied with hitting our heads into a wall.

WoW is kinda like pokemon. Doesn't matter how much improvement the new games have, in terms of quality-of-life changes and balancing, there will always be these purists who yell about Gen 1 and 2 being the best. And yet they keep playing.

[rayden54]

Agreed!

Especially when the topic is LFD. I don't care how loudly you yell about it, playing on a low-pop RP server during daytime hours and having to spend sometimes two or three DAYS at a time in town spamming trade for a group for a leveling dungeon, or begging a higher-level friend to run you, was not in any way, by any stretch of the imagination, at all better than being able to just queue and get it done.

Even on a medium population server during peak hours it could take hours to find a group at max level. People forget that LFD wasn't implemented until the near end of Wrath. I joined too late (right before ToC) to see the "good ol' days" everyone talks about, but they were gone long before LFD.

From what I've heard of Vanilla and BC, I'm glad I missed them. Sounds like grind-city to me.

[Killington]

Nostalgia wouldn't be a problem if Blizz would just open up legit server specific realms like one for Vanilla and BC. Of course this won't happen but if it did all these nostalgic people would at least have somewhere to go.

Retro gaming is alive and well, there's nothing wrong with it, I go back and play a bunch of old games on all my old consoles. Too bad there's no way you can do that in an mmo.

inb4 "Oh that dead horse" "The dead horse can't be beaten no more" "blah blah blah dead horse" ect.

[LuminousAether]

So why am I enjoying myself more on the vanilla server i'm currently playing on?

Because you prefer an easier experience with dramatically simplified mechanics.

[Keske]

No it's not but that is a handy tool to use to never ever take any criticism. Because ofcourse the vast majority, the by far vast majority does not actually miss BC, for BCs sake. They still want new stuff to do, they miss the design mentality of the burning crusade. But that will never get acknowledged by those that claim that NOSTALGIA HURTS THE GAME. Because that is a legit concerns, and here in fairy land we do not concern ourself wich such trivial stuff. No I kid, I kid. But it gets really boring hearing the same wooden argument that argues against a ghost that doesn't exist. I am one of those that wish wow was designed with the BC mindset, doesn't mean I want to play the burning crusade again, because that means I have to give up alot of improvents the game has had. And it also doesn't mean that it would be some kind of requirment for that mindset.

[Haven]

Vanilla was interesting and new.

TBC was hard and design was very sketchy. You're in a blue mushroom swamp... BOOM, you're in needle-like mountains without transition. Draenei race also wasn't a perfect decision. They still feel out of place.

Wrath was perfect. The story, the style, everything felt right.

Cataclysm felt pointless, although many people underestimate the real purpose of Cata, the overhaul of 1-60 content, which is good.

MoP... I've only took a peek at Jade Forest (mainly because I level a monk), but what i've seen, is one of the best things I have in this game. I wonder if those dailies everyone whines about are as bad as grinding for Netherwing.

[Keske]

Vanilla was interesting and new.

TBC was hard and design was very sketchy. You're in a blue mushroom swamp... BOOM, you're in needle-like mountains without transition. Draenei race also wasn't a perfect decision. They still feel out of place.

Wrath was perfect. The story, the style, everything felt right.

Cataclysm felt pointless, although many people underestimate the real purpose of Cata, the overhaul of 1-60 content, which is good.

MoP... I've only took a peek at Jade Forest (mainly because I level a monk), but what i've seen, is one of the best things I have in this game. I wonder if those dailies everyone whines about are as bad as grinding for Netherwing.

I guess this is what it boils down to people not understanding, since no matter how I twist and turn it I can't understand how anyone can feel that WotLK was good.

[yyil]

It's really biological! Back when wow first came out a large amount of people received a very large amount of dopamine. If you weren't receiving another larger source of dopamine you became addicted to wow. The dopamine release is controlled by you're point of view or perspective. It's fascinating. A lot of people addicted to wow are getting lower and lower amount of dopamine while playing and it causes crankiness from withdrawal. It's profound and amazingly being alive. Let people complain. they literally can't help it.


I was addicted to vanilla wow when i was 15.

[Keske]

It's really biological! Back when wow first came out a large amount of people received a very large amount of dopamine. If you weren't receiving another larger source of dopamine you became addicted to wow. The dopamine release is controlled by you're point of view or perspective. It's fascinating. A lot of people addicted to wow are getting lower and lower amount of dopamine while playing and it causes crankiness from withdrawal. It's profound and amazingly being alive. Let people complain. they literally can't help it.


I was addicted to vanilla wow when i was 15.

And lets post the 4 medical studies you would need to actually back that claim up.

[Deleted]

I guess this is what it boils down to people not understanding, since no matter how I twist and turn it I can't understand how anyone can feel that WotLK was good.

Bingo!

Some people like cats, some people like dogs and some people like killing them. We don't need to, nor do we want to (in most cases) understand or discover why.

The internet, for whatever reason, and in some cases portions of society, seem hell bent on changing people's minds. Especially in this case there is an almost complete lack of trying to understand someone's reasoning. But that is happily contributed to by people not giving enough of a damn to explain their feelings fully, or to be able.

[Zaqwert]

Nostalgia isn't a problem, it's just a fact of life.

WoW's time has come and gone for most people and the magic can never be recaptured, it's just reality.

Even the people still playing it and having fun, it still doesn't have the sense of wonder and amazement it once did.

Just accept it, there's no fighting it. Something can be new only once.

Like your favorite movie, whatever it is, you can still enjoy watching it, but the magic of watching it that first time will never happen again.

Such is life.

[Outofmana]

I'm getting quite sick of it.
......
Some nostalgia is fine. Heck I have it sometimes while exploring through Northrend, we all do . The thing that annoys me is when people are downright OBSESSED about every single little thing that happened in BC/Classic (even though most of it has to deal with thepeople they played with), and refuse to accept ANY change to that model, even if it's obviously better.

Extreme nostalgia BS is one of the things that's killing the game the most.

Hahaha Northrend, you haven't even played TBC/vanilla and yet you still make this thread? Of course you would say the amount of nostalgia is overkill, because after WotlK the game has been getting better and better again. But never quite reaching the high standard of vanilla/TBC, although Pandaria for me comes close being immersed in the whole worldzone again.

I wouldn't get it if anyone was being nostalgic about WotlK either, but vanilla is a whole different story.
But yeah, what on earth do you know about "BC/Classic" ?

[fizzbob]

It does not feel the same for you.

Frankly, as a player that has played longer then any of the people likely in this thread (Phase 2 Beta), the game is way better then it's been in years.

better to you
frankly as someone who played back before the 'reintroduced sexier troll females' the game is catered more to people who have an hour or two to play. NOBODY started playing vanilla and only had an hour or two a day to play. MMORPGs have always been timesinks and now, they're so convenient they're not really MMORPGs anymore. it's an MMO-something i guess. kind of a MMOGAMELOBBY since you sit in queue to do shit most of the time

convenience sells though. just doesn't make for a great game

[Zaqwert]

WoW has changed and is changing.

People are allowed to think those changes are better and people are also allowed to think those changes are worse.

A large percentage of the people who think it's gotten worse have voted with their feet and quit.

[Stormspellz]

even if they are wearing rose tinted glasses doesn't mean they are wrong, the pace and mechanics of pvp for example.

[Seolla]

Sorry to tell you OP, but it's the opposite; Nostalgia is what's keeping the game alive. ALOT of people are still subscribing simply because they've been playing the game for years. Things like raiding becomes a weekly habit. I still play and raid, but not because I enjoy the game as much as I used to, but because it just doesn't feel right to suddenly stop doing something that I've been doing for over 6 years.

[Deleted]

Extreme nostalgia BS is one of the things that's killing the game the most.

Explain.

I can't see how it is in any way "killing the game". How exactly does a portion of the playerbase that love classic wow, which was a fantastic product, in any way hurt what the game is now? Sure, they'll moan about the changes, for better or worse, but blizzard is doing their own thing - they're not going to have the direction they take the game diverted by complaining forum posts by a minority of the playerbase. Nor do I expect the complaints to make other people quit, if people quit it's because they don't like the game, not because they enjoy it but a forum poster doesn't.

I cannot fathom how you can come to the conclusion that nostalgia is killing the game, not one bit.

[Deleted]

Hahaha Northrend, you haven't even played TBC/vanilla and yet you still make this thread? Of course you would say the amount of nostalgia is overkill, because after WotlK the game has been getting better and better again. But never quite reaching the high standard of vanilla/TBC, although Pandaria for me comes close being immersed in the whole worldzone again.

I wouldn't get it if anyone was being nostalgic about WotlK either, but vanilla is a whole different story.
But yeah, what on earth do you know about "BC/Classic" ?

You appear to have completely missed OPs point. It is understandable because he did a pretty good job of hiding it behind sensationalist language and name calling, but he is trying to get a point across. At least that's what I read from his post.

He claims, however right or wrong he might be, that "nostalgia" or constantly looking back with futility is harming the game and gaming in general. I don't think he needs to have experienced the content to feel nay saying is having a negative effect on the community and game. You might think differently, but that's my opinion.

If I were to expand on what I believe his point to be I'd ask what benefit does negativity without solutions do for anyone? Criticism is great as long as it helps produce better future results. But reading between the lines I'd imagine his hatred towards nostalgia stems from that.

Then again I could be wrong and he might just be a fuming crack-pot.

All I know for sure is adding "In my opinion" to almost every sentence of everyone's posts certainly makes MMO Champion easier to read.

[Dblbaconator]

I dunno if it's been linked here, but Alex Brazie (yes, the same one who got fired a couple weeks ago) did a blog post relevant to this discussion.

Those who make the claim that WoW was a better game back in the day would do good to read it. To summarize, the game comes off as worse now because the stimuli that initially hooked you into the game aren't as effective anymore. When you started and everything was fresh, you wanted to hit that next level, you went gaga over a new piece of gear or spell, and felt accomplished when you downed a troublesome boss. If you ever completed a legendary, it was a magical feeling, like you were on top of the world.

But eventually, the feelings you get after each shiny thing start to dwindle. When a boss went on farm, it was less like defeating an old nemesis, more like stabbing it in the gut and walking out with some more loot. In an attempt to shift the blame on these feelings from the player to something else, it's easy for them to blame Blizzard for changing the game and making it unappealing to them, when in actuality nothing that Blizzard does will remove their ennui. They've run their course, and it's time for them to move on.

That's why, no matter when you start playing, the game was at its best then...according to you. Sure, those that started in Classic or BC mock those who claim that Wrath was the best expansion, but that's only because the former started earlier and were deep in ennui's throes by the time the latter started playing. Down the line, there WILL be players who claim that they had the most fun in Cata.

Now, I'm not saying you should agree with every decision Blizzard makes. Far from it, criticism helps the devs understand problems or concerns. But at the same time, you should question whether your dissatisfaction with WoW is specifically due to a particular decision, or if you're just worn out. I started in Wrath, and back then, I gladly spent countless hours questing, dungeon grinding, raiding, and more, because everything was so fresh and new to me. Cata began to wear me down, and while part of that was due to a feel of a lack of content, and another part was my personal situation involving a crumbling guild trying to hold itself together, a third part was just the fact that I was getting tired of the game. It just wasn't as magical as it had once been. Today, I don't play as often as I used to because I don't want to get burnt out so quickly. The game is just fine nowadays and (I believe) is better off development-wise than it was in Cata.

In short, if you played back in the beginning, you're just not going to get those feelings you did when you started, no matter what. Find something else to play. It's okay to let go.

[ringpriest]

I dunno if it's been linked here, but Alex Brazie (yes, the same one who got fired a couple weeks ago) did a blog post relevant to this discussion.

Those who make the claim that WoW was a better game back in the day would do good to read it. To summarize, the game comes off as worse now because the stimuli that initially hooked you into the game aren't as effective anymore. When you started and everything was fresh, you wanted to hit that next level, you went gaga over a new piece of gear or spell, and felt accomplished when you downed a troublesome boss. If you ever completed a legendary, it was a magical feeling, like you were on top of the world.

But eventually, the feelings you get after each shiny thing start to dwindle. When a boss went on farm, it was less like defeating an old nemesis, more like stabbing it in the gut and walking out with some more loot. In an attempt to shift the blame on these feelings from the player to something else, it's easy for them to blame Blizzard for changing the game and making it unappealing to them, when in actuality nothing that Blizzard does will remove their ennui. They've run their course, and it's time for them to move on.

That's why, no matter when you start playing, the game was at its best then...according to you. Sure, those that started in Classic or BC mock those who claim that Wrath was the best expansion, but that's only because the former started earlier and were deep in ennui's throes by the time the latter started playing. Down the line, there WILL be players who claim that they had the most fun in Cata.

Now, I'm not saying you should agree with every decision Blizzard makes. Far from it, criticism helps the devs understand problems or concerns. But at the same time, you should question whether your dissatisfaction with WoW is specifically due to a particular decision, or if you're just worn out. I started in Wrath, and back then, I gladly spent countless hours questing, dungeon grinding, raiding, and more, because everything was so fresh and new to me. Cata began to wear me down, and while part of that was due to a feel of a lack of content, and another part was my personal situation involving a crumbling guild trying to hold itself together, a third part was just the fact that I was getting tired of the game. It just wasn't as magical as it had once been. Today, I don't play as often as I used to because I don't want to get burnt out so quickly. The game is just fine nowadays and (I believe) is better off development-wise than it was in Cata.

In short, if you played back in the beginning, you're just not going to get those feelings you did when you started, no matter what. Find something else to play. It's okay to let go.

This has some validity, but it's ignoring some things too. The game much is less complex now. There are no more big, complicated dungeons to figure out, at all. There are virtually no long quest chains (maybe 1 per legendary, if that?) to take you across the world. Dungeons and raids are far easier to access. The world is a more forgiving and less dangerous place. (I'm not playing MoP, so maybe that has changed in Pandaria.) There are no more weapons like Benediction or Rhok'delar. Class quests are now short and easy. Profession related quests seem confined to dailies. There's no more hunting for that elusive trainer, be it for enchanting, specialized leatherworking, or a unique and awesome demon summoning.

There are more, but I think that gets the gist of it across. The blog post you linked to claims the "the game hasn't changed". It has. Drastically. WoW is not the same game as it once was. That doesn't mean it's bad, but it is different. Just because I don't like a new version of something doesn't mean I'm bored with it. I still play tabletop rpgs that are 10 or 20 years old. I like D&D 3.5 (and currently play Pathfinder), but not D&D 4. Does that mean I'm bored with D&D? Of course not.

Why is it so difficult to understand that 1) the game has changed, and 2) some people don't like the changes?