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  1. #1

    To Bloom or not to Bloom? And serious mana issues.

    Hey y'all!

    So, I raid in a 10-man group that's been having some issues raiding due to people leaving the guild. So far, we've only managed to down the first two bosses in MSV10. Trying to help my guild out, I main swapped this expansion from my warlock to a resto druid.

    Now, I love my resto druid, even though I haven't healed on her since Wrath and ICC days, she was feral through Cata.

    I have two questions that maybe someone here could help me answer.

    1) - Lifebloom.
    I've heard some people talking about how they let the Lifebloom stacks fall off so that the person they're rolling Lifebloom on gets the bigger heal instead of just the ticks.
    I realize that a lot of times, this is going to be completely situation, depending on the amount of damage that said target is taking.
    That being said, even if the target isn't taking a lot of damage, do you let Lifebloom expire for the bigger heal? Or do you just keep it refreshed with Nourish so that there is an extra HoT rolling?
    Isn't letting it expire a bigger strain on mana (the mana cost of 3 Lifebloom stacks vs. one Nourish to keep it rolling)?

    2) - This is more of an issue than a question. I'm decently geared (Sabbywabby on Aggramar, if you'd like to take a gander at her) but I still struggle with mana. A lot. Especially as far as the other healers seem to go at comparable gear levels.
    I know that every class if different, but the group I lead on my priest is as far as my druid's group, but I never feel the strain of mana conservation on my priest as I do with my druid.
    I usually pop Innervate at 85% mana and use it on CD, as well as using the August Celestial's spirit increase trinket on CD. Yet, I'm scrapping the bottom of the barrel for mana before the fight is 75% done. And my overhealing isn't massive.
    Any suggestions?

  2. #2
    Keyboard Turner
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    You're logged out in feral gear, so I can't see what's going on there. Raid logs would help, too.

    I don't let lifebloom fall off ever (intentionally). Refresh it with Regrowth on cc proc.

    Nourish is useless now. If you need a filler, use HT.

    As a HoT class, your overheal is going to be pretty big. If it's not, the raid is taking too much damage (standing in fire etc).

  3. #3
    Since the realms just came back up, I logged in to swap to my resto gear and logged back out so Armory should update with that.

    I would post logs but I'm still trying to figure out WoL and the fact that it keeps giving me an error (I never cared so much until this point but then I decided I wanted to be the best druid healer EVAR).

  4. #4
    Keyboard Turner
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    Still in feral spec tho so the spell stats are off. I'm looking for combat regen - after I hit ~10k I felt very comfortable in 10m raids.

    Is dynasty of steel really your 2nd resto trinket?

  5. #5
    Oh, no no! I equipped that by mistake. My second resto trinket is the Scroll of Revered Ancestors from the Shado-pan.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-13 at 10:18 PM ----------

    My combat regen is 9016.

  6. #6
    Keyboard Turner
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    tbh that combat regen should be fine.

    The first thing I learned in 10m's was to stop doing to much stuff, pay attention to where the fight was going, and predict where heals would be needed. I'd find myself mindlessly casting a WG when 2 people needed 10k hp, stupid stuff like that. More swiftmends, less rejuv spam. Never nourish, always ht. Ironbark a lot.

    Incarnation is a mana cooldown -- blanket the raid with lifebloom and get infinite instant regrowths. Tranq does crazy hps and is on a short cooldown now, use it.

    Also make sure your other healers are doing their regen things (mana tide etc).

    Sounds like either:

    1) your raid is standing in the fire too much, or
    2) your other healer(s) aren't pulling their weight, or
    3) your rotation needs attention

    That's about all I can tell you w/o logs, hth.

  7. #7
    I will see what I can do about posting some logs from my next raid.

    Thanks so much for your tips! =)

  8. #8
    Your gear looks great, just some points:

    1) Your haste rating is wrong. You need 3043, not more or less. (Maybe this is because you recently got a new weapon?)
    2) Glyph of healing touch is pretty much useless right now, as well as Glyph of Rejuvenation. Swap in Glyph of Regrowth and Glyph of Lifebloom (not Blooming) and you'll feel a lot better.

    Your mana problems are either from wrong spell usage, or the raid taking too much damage. That's hard to tell without logs.
    Don't ever let lifebloom fall off unless your are busy healing massive raid damage. With the glyph, you can even transfer the full 3 stacks to the second tank on a tank swap.

  9. #9
    Initially I ran into some serious mana issues as well on my resto. I had 10k mana regen as well. Then we fixed a lot of raid issues in my group by having people standing in crap. Also I was more conservative with my heals. I'd rejeuv targets at 70% so there wouldn't be as much overheal. 3+ targets below 90% would get a wild growth. Doing my best to use ht only with natures swiftness. Swiftmend on cooldown. Ironbark the tank during big damage abilities so to lessen damage. Remember also you have incarnation which does a lot of raid healing for cheap (free regrowths).

  10. #10
    Legendary! Thelxi's Avatar
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    I almost never let LB bloom. Not really worth the effort, and extremely situational.

  11. #11
    1) - Lifebloom.
    I've heard some people talking about how they let the Lifebloom stacks fall off so that the person they're rolling Lifebloom on gets the bigger heal instead of just the ticks.
    I realize that a lot of times, this is going to be completely situation, depending on the amount of damage that said target is taking.
    That being said, even if the target isn't taking a lot of damage, do you let Lifebloom expire for the bigger heal? Or do you just keep it refreshed with Nourish so that there is an extra HoT rolling?
    Isn't letting it expire a bigger strain on mana (the mana cost of 3 Lifebloom stacks vs. one Nourish to keep it rolling)?
    You shouldn't be letting lifebloom fall off for a few reasons.

    1) It procs CC which allows you to regrowth and refresh stacks for free.
    2) Its does a good chunk of healing if the target is missing some health.
    3) Having 3 stacks up allows you to switch it to a new target (with glyph) and saves GCD's.

    Its a cheap and good heal that should always be rolling unless you need it to fall off. An example would be for the target that takes the blast from Heroic Elegons ability. I swap it to the person that runs out so when it blooms is bring them over 80% and saves me time having to run out.

    2) - This is more of an issue than a question. I'm decently geared (Sabbywabby on Aggramar, if you'd like to take a gander at her) but I still struggle with mana. A lot. Especially as far as the other healers seem to go at comparable gear levels.
    I know that every class if different, but the group I lead on my priest is as far as my druid's group, but I never feel the strain of mana conservation on my priest as I do with my druid.
    I usually pop Innervate at 85% mana and use it on CD, as well as using the August Celestial's spirit increase trinket on CD. Yet, I'm scrapping the bottom of the barrel for mana before the fight is 75% done. And my overhealing isn't massive.
    Any suggestions?
    I took a look at you armory and your haste wasn't at the first cap of 3043. If you dont reach this you lose ticks from heals which in turn makes you heal more and waste more mana. By the sounds of around 9k combat regen you should be more than fine as long as you use the heals correctly.

    Ill go over some of the heals and changes and maybe it will help you manage your mana a little bit better.


    Swiftmend: Very good and efficient heal. It should be used on cd and if possible where it can always hit the most targets. Since panda land was released most raid fights don't allow us to stack up very much anymore making this spell harder to use effectively. The best place would be melee or a tank in need of heals.

    Regrowth: The flash heal for druids with a short hot. Best used with CC procs and also as a tank saver. I dont use this often unless i have a cc proc.

    Rejuvenation: Our bread and butter heal as a druid. Best used if it will heal for 90%+ and not overheal and by that I mean use on targets that are going to take constant damage and wont be topped right away. This was harder to spam in cata until geared and is even harder in mists now but it is our best heal

    Wild growth: Heals 5-6 (glyph) targets over so many seconds. This is a smart heal but does have some issues in panda land. I know i mentioned this with swiftmend but your placement has to be good to get the most out of it. Most of the time no one will stand in the same place for attempts on a boss so I use myself to cast it on and im guarenteeing that way ill hit 5-6 targets and not waste any heals. Another thing you can do if you cant use yourself is look for targets quickly before using and choose one nearby other injured targets.

    Nourish and healing touch I dont really need to go over because they arent used all that much for raids unless you do heroic modes.

    The glyphs i run with are wild growth,bloom and healing touch. Healing touch can be swapped if your not tank healing but if you are the fast swiftmends help out a bunch.

    Ive been healing as a druid since wrath so feel free to bring anything up i missed or any questions.

  12. #12
    Field Marshal Shinerr's Avatar
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    ok, I am my raids 4th healer (back up if someone is not there or if resto druids are really good on a particular fight). Honestly I havent done much research into the spec as I am mainly in Boomy, So during INC regrowths are free or are just saying that because of the frequency of CC procs while everyone is blanketed with lifebloom?

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinerr View Post
    So during INC regrowths are free or are just saying that because of the frequency of CC procs while everyone is blanketed with lifebloom?
    The latter, not the former.

    IE: RG is not free during Incarnation- but if you are spreading out plenty of LB's you'll get more CC procs.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinerr View Post
    ok, I am my raids 4th healer (back up if someone is not there or if resto druids are really good on a particular fight). Honestly I havent done much research into the spec as I am mainly in Boomy, So during INC regrowths are free or are just saying that because of the frequency of CC procs while everyone is blanketed with lifebloom?
    Regrowth is not free during inc, it is an instant cast though so you need to be careful. However, if you have a LB on each of your 10 man players you will be getting CC procs like crazy so it is almost free once they start rolling. Most times I LB half the raid and heal the other half with regrowths because I am getting so many CC procs its easier.

  15. #15
    Field Marshal Shinerr's Avatar
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    Ok, thanks. For a second there I thought I had a major oversight to druid healing.

  16. #16
    Hey Sabby from aggy! I'm from aggy too!

    Lota of good advice here but still going to throw in my two cents.

    I run about 7k-ish spirit. I was used to ABC for resto druids (always be casting) but that play style doesn't work with druids anymore. I have to sit there and let my hots work. I used to fill with nourish in Cata but that isn't the case anymore. Watching CC procs is huge and just refresh with a new lifebloom istead of bothering to cast to extend it unless of course it warrents it.

    I also find that being at 7k-ish my heals tick harder with more mastery and more crit over the spirit. I was at first leery of losing spirit but after finding out 1000 spirit flask means the flask of two rejevs, it was a matter of adjusting my playstyle. I have gotten more mileage out of my healing.
    http://raidbots.com/epeenbot/us/aggramar/royalite/

    I can do 55k healing and I am by no means max/min (I need to reforge etc). If you're pulling good numbers, it really comes down to is your raid following through on the mechanics of the fight. Good luck and if you have any questions, hit me up on aggy!

  17. #17
    WG: do not use on CD anymore, it will drain ur mana away. You have to use it smart.

  18. #18
    I've healed thru normal MV 10m with <7k spirit on my druid (mainspec is feral). I run WG, nourish, and HT for glyphs because I very rarely have to swap LB - if I did, HT would be the first to go. We primarily raid 25m so nourish is more useful (again, mana efficiency since I have really low spirit) and it's a heal to cast while waiting on WG/swiftmend. Dislike RG glyph as you lose the HoT which is nice for swiftmending without casting rejuv (mostly noticeable during Incarnation).


    Like pretty much everyone in this thread has said, get 3043 haste.

    Food and flask should be INT as they swap int:spirit at 1:1 ratio. Gems are 1:2, chest enchant is 80 all stats vs 200 spirit, etc. Only if you are desperate for spirit should you need spirit flasks/food (heroics?)

    Incarnation and tranq are mana CDs for the most part, with exceptions like Feng's pulsing aoe as he removes flame stacks. Being mana efficient means you need to squeeze as many tranqs and Incarnation/NV into each encounter without wasting them on overheal or having them on CD when you really need them. Practice makes perfect here.

    There are lulls where using WG is a waste, but typically you can use it on CD for most of the fight. Haven't tried out the SoTF/WG stuff as it's my offspec since my raid needs dps.

    Swiftmend lots! It's mana efficient healing and if you have 4pc pvp the CD is shorter.

    Ironbark is great, and if you have 4pc pvp the CD is 30s. Toss this on a tank whenever you know he's going to take a decent amount of damage.



    All that stuff being said, raid members standing in fire (bombs on stone doggies are a common one) makes a huge difference. Yell at them to not stand in shit.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Thealbinoguy1 View Post
    You shouldn't be letting lifebloom fall off for a few reasons.

    1) It procs CC which allows you to regrowth and refresh stacks for free.
    2) Its does a good chunk of healing if the target is missing some health.
    3) Having 3 stacks up allows you to switch it to a new target (with glyph) and saves GCD's.

    Its a cheap and good heal that should always be rolling unless you need it to fall off. An example would be for the target that takes the blast from Heroic Elegons ability. I swap it to the person that runs out so when it blooms is bring them over 80% and saves me time having to run out.



    I took a look at you armory and your haste wasn't at the first cap of 3043. If you dont reach this you lose ticks from heals which in turn makes you heal more and waste more mana. By the sounds of around 9k combat regen you should be more than fine as long as you use the heals correctly.

    Ill go over some of the heals and changes and maybe it will help you manage your mana a little bit better.


    Swiftmend: Very good and efficient heal. It should be used on cd and if possible where it can always hit the most targets. Since panda land was released most raid fights don't allow us to stack up very much anymore making this spell harder to use effectively. The best place would be melee or a tank in need of heals.

    Regrowth: The flash heal for druids with a short hot. Best used with CC procs and also as a tank saver. I dont use this often unless i have a cc proc.

    Rejuvenation: Our bread and butter heal as a druid. Best used if it will heal for 90%+ and not overheal and by that I mean use on targets that are going to take constant damage and wont be topped right away. This was harder to spam in cata until geared and is even harder in mists now but it is our best heal

    Wild growth: Heals 5-6 (glyph) targets over so many seconds. This is a smart heal but does have some issues in panda land. I know i mentioned this with swiftmend but your placement has to be good to get the most out of it. Most of the time no one will stand in the same place for attempts on a boss so I use myself to cast it on and im guarenteeing that way ill hit 5-6 targets and not waste any heals. Another thing you can do if you cant use yourself is look for targets quickly before using and choose one nearby other injured targets.

    Nourish and healing touch I dont really need to go over because they arent used all that much for raids unless you do heroic modes.

    The glyphs i run with are wild growth,bloom and healing touch. Healing touch can be swapped if your not tank healing but if you are the fast swiftmends help out a bunch.

    Ive been healing as a druid since wrath so feel free to bring anything up i missed or any questions.
    Question for you: I see this a lot about nourish and HT not being used much anymore. Is this really the consensus? If so I guess I need to change my healing Back in Cata I was just using Nourish as a filler since I gained mana faster than I could spend it. That's not *quite* the case now, but it does seem to provide a lot of nice quick cheap heals for my targets. Should I just stop using it and simply throw rejuvs around instead?

  20. #20
    Keyboard Turner
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkone238 View Post
    Question for you: I see this a lot about nourish and HT not being used much anymore. Is this really the consensus? If so I guess I need to change my healing Back in Cata I was just using Nourish as a filler since I gained mana faster than I could spend it. That's not *quite* the case now, but it does seem to provide a lot of nice quick cheap heals for my targets. Should I just stop using it and simply throw rejuvs around instead?
    Nourish heals for about 1/3 of HT, and costs about 1/3 of HT. But, the cast time is the same as HT.

    I used Nourish all the time when it was a 1.5 sec cast, but now that it's the same cast time as HT I don't see a point.

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