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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Magister View Post
    In reply to the OP, my initial question is why he took reputations all the way to exalted. You only need revered to have access all the VP gear. Therefore I assume he wanted exalted because he was after the mounts and other ‘nice-to-haves’. And tbh, if you want those, I actually encourage Blizzard to change nothing: if you want the mounts you will have to work for them.

    In my opinion, if anything should change, Blizzard should arrange the VP gear that you can get gear for all slots at reputation honored (spread out over different factions) for say ilvl 470 and another set of gear for all slots at reputation revered (also spread out over different factions) at ilvl 476. And hell, they could even add yet another set of gear at ilvl 483 at exalted if they would want. The advantage of this is that people “only” need honored to buy VP gear already, and then can choose for themselves if they have the time and the inclination to continue to revered and/or exalted.

    In short: there should be a full set of VP-gear at both honored and revered (and perhaps even another at exalted) with increasing ilvl.
    Then players are much more free to choose for themselves how many dailies they want to do.
    Not a bad idea, but I think the mistake was tying valor gear to the rep's in the first place which led to some POV that they're mandatory even though they're not really.

    If anything, I think if gear is to be tied to reps it should be the champion badges for 458 or 463 item level and that the valor system to upgrade gear via the etherium should have been in place at launch.....which I can't help but think was the original intent.

    But then you'd get the other side of the QQ that there was no way for them to get grapes other than through raiding.

    On the whole, I'm fine with the system as it stands though. Some folks just want to rush through it and get overgeared as fast a possible, but I'm not one of them...now, off to make sure I get valor capped for the week.

    What? What?

  2. #162
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    The problem is exclusively PR. Blizz did a bad job explaining that dailies are optional and equivalent gear drops in lfr.

    So when DREAM Paragon said jump, players qqed.
    You don't create "justice" by destroying. That includes buildings, cars, or the careers of the people you want "justice" for.


  3. #163
    Here is my epic tale from daillies:
    -At start just when i got lvl 90 , i did some heroics, got some loot , and started doing the golden lotus / Dragon nimbo daillies, while somedays i had more time and did the klaxxi ones aswell, i got klaxi to revered and maxed dragon nimbo reputation, and i had golden lotus at honored, after that i stoped with klaxxi, and keep going with goldenlotus and started the tillers ( as i didnt knew at all about the farm , and tough it wass a mini game and not a reputation/food grind) after a week , i hit revered with golden lotus, stop with them for a while and started lvling shadopan and celestials + keep going with the tillers, got honored with both and maxed the tillers while somedays that i had more time keep going with the golden lotus, after that i keep going to end the golden lotus grind (for me the worse daillies, lot of time for low rep per mision and with the people out there doing them every day , a pain) and after a while got exalted with them (last week) and now i just need to max shadowpan+celestial (revered both) and finish with the klaxi (not doing klaxxi till i have exalted with shadopan and celestial, and only doing celestial when the chiji or the temple of the tiger quest are avalible (best daillies out there), and when i end the klaxi ones i iwll start with the nat plague reputation, i hope i finish before next patch and im done with daillies^^.

    -For me the dailly sistem is fine as it is , but they put to many daillies this expansion , some people like me do them in a dailly basic (i log everyday) but dont want to do ALL the dayllies EVERYDAY, thats the main problem , people want to do everything everyday, and thats a bit to much daillies (hell, i know people that have 2 o 3 alts, and do every dailly every day with all their characters......)

    -I think if blizzard removed the golden lotus daillies , this expansion should have been much better ^^

  4. #164
    Brewmaster dryankem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    I've got a simpler idea... put the daily quest cap back in.

    The problem is stemming from only one sect of players - these insane min/maxers who just want to brainlessly maximize stats at the very expense of their own lives and health. They feel compelled to maximize everything by doing everything that's possible. It's an idiotic and unsustainable way of playing, I know... but there it is.

    Sadly though, I also believe these players make up a significant bulk of the player-base. =(

    I forget which species of dog it is, but there's a breed of dog that if you don't take away the food bowl, it will keep eating until its stomach bursts. It does this purely based on survival instincts of not knowing when the next meal will be. The min/maxers are functioning on a similar instinct to "try to be the best".

    Look, we're not going to convince these players to not do all the daily quests every day and that it's better for them in the long run. They'll look at you and simply call you a "baddie" because you're "not being the best player possible".

    Look - the Valor cap has been in for a while now, and next to NOBODY is complaining about that - are they? Just re-implement the daily quest cap and then people will have to CHOOSE which dailies they want to do without having to brainlessly walk off an edge. Take away their dog dish and tell them "ENOUGH!" :P

    We went through TWO (hell, THREE if you count the end of BC) expansions with NOBODY complaining about there being too many Daily quests - right? I think the cap had a big part to do with it (along with rep tabards, but that's another story...) So... why not put it back in? If you're worried about it taking months to get a faction to exalted, they can always up the rep-return rate per-quest to fix that problem. It's a much easier solution than to convince a sect of brainless zombie min/maxers that their gameplay style is unsustainable. :P
    mvallas, I'd hate to see the cap put back in but your totally right. Such an awesome post.

    It use to be run your 25 dailies and cap your VP and be stuck so you'd switch to your alt and cap them, but right now there is so much to do and people whine about it. I need to quit trying to point it out to people and just accept there are people that won't get it.

  5. #165
    Pandaren Monk schwank05's Avatar
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    I agree with the OP 150% I hate quests in general, so I blast my way to max level asap and try to get through the terror that is leveling, which blows because I have 6 more characters to level, but cannot bring myself to do it. But I have my Pally at 90 and just now hit Revered with the Kalaxi and was Honored with them before 90 so that tells you how much I hate to quest. I have the Golden Lotus sitting at around 8k/12k honored because you start with them at Neutral and it takes forever to get through their dailies.

    I can only play 2-3 days a week for around 3-4 hours at a time, I want my damn tabards back. I would love to only have to do the dailes once a week or at least let all the dailies be as easy and give as much rep as the Tillers, It took me a little over a week to get Exhaulted with them and the dailies take a whole 5 mins to do.

    I haven't even started on the Cloud Serpent people or the Fishing place.

  6. #166
    Mechagnome draganid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    I've got a simpler idea... put the daily quest cap back in.

    The problem is stemming from only one sect of players - these insane min/maxers who just want to brainlessly maximize stats at the very expense of their own lives and health. They feel compelled to maximize everything by doing everything that's possible. It's an idiotic and unsustainable way of playing, I know... but there it is.

    Sadly though, I also personally believe these players make up a significant percent of the player-base. =(

    I forget which species of dog it is, but there's a breed of dog that if you don't take away the food bowl, it will keep eating until its stomach bursts. It does this purely based on survival instincts of not knowing when the next meal will be. The min/maxers are functioning on a similar instinct to "try to be the best".

    Look, we're not going to convince these players to not do all the daily quests every day and that it's better for them in the long run. They'll look at you and simply call you a "baddie" because you're "not being the best player possible".

    Look - the Valor cap has been in for a while now, and next to NOBODY is complaining about that - are they? Just re-implement the daily quest cap and then people will have to CHOOSE which dailies they want to do without having to brainlessly walk off an edge. Take away their dog dish and tell them "ENOUGH!" :P

    We went through TWO (hell, THREE if you count the end of BC) expansions with NOBODY complaining about there being too many Daily quests - right? I think the cap had a big part to do with it (along with rep tabards, but that's another story...) So... why not put it back in? If you're worried about it taking months to get a faction to exalted, they can always up the rep-return rate per-quest to fix that problem. It's a much easier solution than to convince a sect of brainless zombie min/maxers that their gameplay style is unsustainable. :P
    beagles are really bad for eating until they burst. they are also extremly loving and affectionate the rest of the time, which i somehow doubt the "y u make me do so much dailys blizzard?" people are.

  7. #167
    Over 9000! Baar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by draganid View Post
    beagles are really bad for eating until they burst. they are also extremly loving and affectionate the rest of the time, which i somehow doubt the "y u make me do so much dailys blizzard?" people are.

    Self control was the point he was trying to make not their attitude.

    Well I agree he would most likely be right, I personally don't like the idea. I only do 1 rep at a time during the week when my time is limited. Yet on the weekends, I enjoy being able to go around and do them all without having to worry about a cap.

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    We went through TWO (hell, THREE if you count the end of BC) expansions with NOBODY complaining about there being too many Daily quests - right? I think the cap had a big part to do with it (along with rep tabards, but that's another story...) So... why not put it back in?
    The cap had no part to do with it, the fact that you could get rep other ways had all the parts to do with it. Putting the cap back in changes nothing.

  9. #169
    High Overlord Fyersing's Avatar
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    The concept of daily quests isn't the issue -- it's quests in general that are lackluster in general when compared to other areas of the game.

    I feel like the dodge and weave methods you'll employ while simply killing 85-90 mobs around the world and avoiding their "skillshots" is a far more engaging than the "click accept, collect fox poop, click complete" cycle you are presented with while questing. The current game needs dynamic quests, where your goal as a hero of (insert faction) is to defend towns, assault cities, train recruits, rescue allies, etc. in real-time with short-term repercussions.

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Seran View Post
    Aye, as am I... they dont need eleventybillion threads about this, Dailies are here to stay, if they weren't then blizzard wouldn't be implementing the rep changes in 5.1 that they are planning.

    The cadre of those folks that raised hell in Cata about nothing to do got Blizzard's attention... and they are going to bury those hellraisers in dailies. Good idea/bad idea/indifferent it doesn't matter... the hell raisers got what they asked for... lots of stuff to do.
    Why claim that dailies are here to stay? Isn't it equally likely that they'll be removed in favor of some other mechanic in a future patch or expansion?

    I'm sure that, at one time, people claimed that dungeon grinding was here to stay.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Matchu View Post
    You're missing the point of the dailies; they allow people to achieve gear at a longer pace who don't have time/commitment for raiding. If you wanna gear up but you're kind of a solo player, tadah, dailies.
    That's also the point of heroic dungeons, and LFR, and PvP. There's plenty of outlets for casual gear in the game these days. The last thing hardcore players need is another mandatory grind. I'm not going to sit here and argue semantics over whether these dailies are "mandatory", because for some people like myself, THEY ARE. Maybe for you they aren't, but for players like myself they are. End of discussion.

    There's already a crapload of stuff that I have to do every day to maintain a competitive level in this game on 2 characters. Log in, do heroic for VP (20 mins), tend my farm for Motes of Harmony (10mins), manage auctions (20 mins), log over to my alt. Do Golden Lotus dailies (20-30 mins), do heroic for VP (20 mins), tend my farm (10 mins). That's EVERY DAY on top of my 3-4 hours of raiding 4 days a week. That also doesn't even count the EIGHT LFR raids I have to do (30 mins each per week x8), and also doesn't count the extra 2 LFR raids I'll have to do next week (30-40 mins x2). That's a LOT of mandatory time considering this is a video game.

  12. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by Kisho View Post
    The solution is already in the game, but people just aren't paying attention to it.

    Dailies do not need to be done every day. If you want to do them every day, go for it, but you do not need to. A lot of slack has been built into the system to ensure that you can skip a few days every so often (or even an entire week if you like), and you won't fall behind in any significant way.
    This was true of the honor grind in vanilla wow as well. I got rank 14, and I was able to take time off here and there. I think I paused around rank 8 or so. Once I hit rank 10, I powered my way to 14.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by bajskorv View Post
    The cap had no part to do with it, the fact that you could get rep other ways had all the parts to do with it. Putting the cap back in changes nothing.
    I have to beg to differ - it would change everything. People would accept the cap just like they accept the Valor/Justice/Honor/Conquest point caps per-week. Just like they accepted the cap for 3 expansions prior...

    You cap it off, then those min/maxer type people will then feel complete when they can max up to the daily quest cap in order to nab those extra loot chances, max their reps for gear, ect while not having to turn their style of WoW playing into a virtual job. The result: They won't burn out as quickly as they are in the game.

    As for those of us who don't min/max who actually understand it's a game YOU control at your own pace, not let the stats lead you to where to go? Well, this would hardly effects us either. :P

    EDIT: Oh, and one last thing - to answer your question, here's the follow-up sentence I noticed you probably strategically deleted from my quote:
    If you're worried about it taking months to get a faction to exalted, they can always up the rep-return rate per-quest to fix that problem. It's a much easier solution than to convince a sect of brainless zombie min/maxers that their gameplay style is unsustainable. :P



    ---------- Post added 2012-11-15 at 02:22 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by slozon View Post
    Self control was the point he was trying to make not their attitude.

    Well I agree he would most likely be right, I personally don't like the idea. I only do 1 rep at a time during the week when my time is limited. Yet on the weekends, I enjoy being able to go around and do them all without having to worry about a cap.
    Thank you for pointing out what I was trying to say. ^_^

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-15 at 02:27 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by dryankem View Post
    mvallas, I'd hate to see the cap put back in but your totally right. Such an awesome post.

    It use to be run your 25 dailies and cap your VP and be stuck so you'd switch to your alt and cap them, but right now there is so much to do and people whine about it. I need to quit trying to point it out to people and just accept there are people that won't get it.
    Thanks! Yeah - I totally understand how a person could get used to having no cap, especially when that person is probably one of the few do have the time to do every daily quest possible.

    At first, hardcore players would complain that they're limiting their extra loot rolls, ect... but they'll get used to it - ESPECIALLY when they realize they realize they're now more aware than ever during raids due to not being so burnt-out from playing so much.
    Last edited by mvallas; 2012-11-15 at 02:31 AM.
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  14. #174
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    To be completely honest, I WAS one of those that felt I had to do dailies and Valor grind every day/week. But since I to have a full time job now, the dailies really don't bother me. They really don't. I don't even raid anymore and love LFR for that reason. Sometimes I can get dailies done 5 days a week, at minimum 2 or 1 day. It's a good idea but it would feel a little...odd and off base in a way tbh.
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  15. #175
    The solution is very simple. Remove the reward from the daily quests. If dungeons "double dipped" then dailies fucking mega quadruple dip. The offer to much and hence people feel FORCED (by design) down the path to doing them. They don't need all that reward.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    My input:
    1. Some people would still complain it's mandatory.
    2. Another part of the people would complain they have nothing to do.

    Imagine Jeff Goldblum saying: "QQ will find a way."
    maybe this is true... but: do you think that weeklies would be better than dailies?

    Personally I like this idea.

  17. #177
    Pit Lord velde046's Avatar
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    OP, you're base assumption is wrong in my opinion. You already maxed your reputations? Why? There was no need for it. You could have done a few dailies instead of doing them all as much as possible. There are days when I don't do any dailies. And the days I do dailies, it's probably just for 2-3 factions.
    This is what keeps me interested in doing them. I even skip the dailies if I don't enjoy the quest hub for example for that day.

    There's no rush to do them. I just got my Nat Pagle to exalted last week, now I'm continuing on GL and one of the other factions.
    Since the start I focused on the factions that offered the nicest rewards, not looking at gear but mostly other stuff like mounts etc.
    First I did Tillers, then Cloud Serpent and Anglers, in between I did some GL, AC etc. Now I finished Nat Pagle and do the occasional GL plus AC or Klaxxi, AC and SP. Of course it's not as exciting as it was after several repetitions, but then again, not doing them for a while then gives you time to do other stuff and coming back to them is not as bad then.

  18. #178
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dryankem View Post
    But at the rate you gain VP you could easily take your time with the factions. Questing through dead wastes gets you honoured with Kalaxxi and you could be rev with them in a few days, which covers 3+ weeks worth of valour points and 6+ weeks if you also gear for OS (if you cap every week). Come 5.1 you won't even have to worry about factions as you can just spend VP on upgrading gear.

    There are people already exalted with all the factions and there is no possible way they've earned enough VP to buy all the gear possible to them and as I mentioned for us slow pokes 5.1 has gear upgrades.

    So don't know where the issue is.
    Druid Exalted with Cloud Serpent, Lorewalkers, Tillers, Golden Lotus, Shado-Pan, Klaxxi, Anglers, and 2 days from exalted with August Celestials.
    DK Exalted with Cloud Serpent, Lorewalkers, Tillers
    Paladin Exalted with Cloud Serpents, Lorewalkers, Klaxxi, Revered with Anglers.

    And... already Valor capped this week (yes, 2 days)

    And no... I'm nowhere near having all the valor pieces.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-15 at 05:46 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by mosely View Post
    Why claim that dailies are here to stay? Isn't it equally likely that they'll be removed in favor of some other mechanic in a future patch or expansion?

    I'm sure that, at one time, people claimed that dungeon grinding was here to stay.
    I dunno... seems that dailies have been around since um.. BC... Yes? Netherwing, Shat fishing, Shat cooking, BC dungeon, BC heroic... Ogril'a, Skyguard all come to mind for BC dailies... then you have Kaul'ak, Argent, K3, Ebon Blade, Dal cooking, Dal fishing, Explorer, Frostborn all come to mind for LK... correct me if I'm wrong here...

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  19. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryme View Post
    Again, fantastic critique. You perfectly explain why you don't agree with the analogy and I can now reflect on this new information and perhaps refine my own ideas.

    To be clear, I want a discussion, not your waste of forum space rants that you don't agree with me.
    I didn't feel the need to explain since it is very obvious.
    Not getting valor gear is not the same as not studying for exams at all. Maybe if you would have said: It's my choice not to use my notes but only my books to study for my exams. But if I want to be prepared as good as I possibly can I should use my notes also. Would have been better.
    This basically comes down to my other comment on this matter. That dailies are not mandatory. I don't feel the urge to explain that over and over.

    If you wanted a good discussion you would have read the other hundreds of replies that explained why dailies are not mandatory and would have thought twice before posting your analogy.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-17 at 01:29 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    I have to beg to differ - it would change everything. People would accept the cap just like they accept the Valor/Justice/Honor/Conquest point caps per-week. Just like they accepted the cap for 3 expansions prior...

    You cap it off, then those min/maxer type people will then feel complete when they can max up to the daily quest cap in order to nab those extra loot chances, max their reps for gear, ect while not having to turn their style of WoW playing into a virtual job. The result: They won't burn out as quickly as they are in the game.

    As for those of us who don't min/max who actually understand it's a game YOU control at your own pace, not let the stats lead you to where to go? Well, this would hardly effects us either. :P

    EDIT: Oh, and one last thing - to answer your question, here's the follow-up sentence I noticed you probably strategically deleted from my quote:
    If you're worried about it taking months to get a faction to exalted, they can always up the rep-return rate per-quest to fix that problem. It's a much easier solution than to convince a sect of brainless zombie min/maxers that their gameplay style is unsustainable. :P
    So the great solution is to put in more caps? Smaller caps? There is a cap on dailies right now.
    Those caps are destroying the game. You should have no caps at all so you can just progress at your own pace at all times and not finish everything in two evenings and then have nothing left to do the rest of the week while you want to play more. Or when you have a week when you don't want to farm valor but if you don't you can't farm double the valor the next week and you miss out on 1000 points.

    Obviously people are going to accept a daily cap since they have no other choice. Or they could quit but who quits over a cap or no cap on daily quests? No one.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-17 at 01:36 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by TonyIommi View Post
    The solution is very simple. Remove the reward from the daily quests. If dungeons "double dipped" then dailies fucking mega quadruple dip. The offer to much and hence people feel FORCED (by design) down the path to doing them. They don't need all that reward.
    The difference here is that dungeons still give loot that the dailies don't give. But during WotLK/Cata dungeons gave everything and dailies gave nothing more compared to them. The only thing dailies gave was a little faster reputation. That versus everything dungeons gave...
    They can take away charms from dailies if that makes you feel better but that doesn't change anything other than that you get less loot.

    So, all in all this system is better than the previous one. That some people here don't like doing dailies sucks for them but has nothing to do with what is better for the game.
    To me dailies or heroics, it's all the same boring grind. And I rather do dailies than to get stuck with 4 random people who add nothing positive to my dungeon experience but can still ruin it by ninjaing, trolling, slacking, ninja pulling, etc. If you think stomping mobs in dungeons while being half afk and just ramming your keyboard without thinking is better than dailies you should think again. I bet the only reason people are complaining is because they now have to do more to get their rewards and it has nothing to do with daily quests being awefull.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-17 at 01:50 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    That's also the point of heroic dungeons, and LFR, and PvP. There's plenty of outlets for casual gear in the game these days. The last thing hardcore players need is another mandatory grind. I'm not going to sit here and argue semantics over whether these dailies are "mandatory", because for some people like myself, THEY ARE. Maybe for you they aren't, but for players like myself they are. End of discussion.

    There's already a crapload of stuff that I have to do every day to maintain a competitive level in this game on 2 characters. Log in, do heroic for VP (20 mins), tend my farm for Motes of Harmony (10mins), manage auctions (20 mins), log over to my alt. Do Golden Lotus dailies (20-30 mins), do heroic for VP (20 mins), tend my farm (10 mins). That's EVERY DAY on top of my 3-4 hours of raiding 4 days a week. That also doesn't even count the EIGHT LFR raids I have to do (30 mins each per week x8), and also doesn't count the extra 2 LFR raids I'll have to do next week (30-40 mins x2). That's a LOT of mandatory time considering this is a video game.
    Then choose if you want to stay competitive or not.

    If you are still doing Golden Lotus dailies you are not competitive anyway.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-17 at 02:00 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post

    Look - the Valor cap has been in for a while now, and next to NOBODY is complaining about that - are they? Just re-implement the daily quest cap and then people will have to CHOOSE which dailies they want to do without having to brainlessly walk off an edge. Take away their dog dish and tell them "ENOUGH!" :P

    We went through TWO (hell, THREE if you count the end of BC) expansions with NOBODY complaining about there being too many Daily quests - right? I think the cap had a big part to do with it (along with rep tabards, but that's another story...) So... why not put it back in? If you're worried about it taking months to get a faction to exalted, they can always up the rep-return rate per-quest to fix that problem. It's a much easier solution than to convince a sect of brainless zombie min/maxers that their gameplay style is unsustainable. :P
    Yeah, no one was complaining about having nothing to do. No one was complaining about the fact that you could get three chars raid ready in two weeks. I think you really missed something.

    They put a cap on those TBC dailies so players wouldn't go farm them like crazy and gain way too much gold.

    It's also much easier to complain when something changes than to complain about something that has always been the same. Dailies started with a cap and there was plenty to do so no one complained. Then Cataclysm came.
    Last edited by Gilian; 2012-11-17 at 12:44 AM.

  20. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by kojinshugi View Post
    Bullcrap. You have to actively avoid doing ANY dailies to not be drowning in charms. I think I have over a thousand rotting in my bank.
    Which essentially means you've been...what? Doing every daily possible since launch?

    There's nothing "ill thought through" about them. They're fine, close to the hub, and they vary every day. Even if you don't particularly like them, revered takes less than two weeks. Then you NEVER have to do them again.
    Kill 12 Mogu at the gates. Now kill 8 Mogu at the Shrine...only this time you can't see them. Now go to Mistwell and kill 10 Pixies. Now kill 8 pixes. Kill 10 spiders. Find 12 runes. And just to make things full...your targets have more health than normal so it moevs from fun to grindy.

    They are, IMO, repetitive, boring and do little to progress the story. They are however something you need to do to unlock the AC and SP. Granted, YMMV, but the GL daily design is relatively uninspired.

    Dailies are not mandatory. VP gear is not mandatory. You can gear yourself perfectly well using heroics and LFR, and crafted items.
    Technically...true. It is also technically true that a lot of guilds will expect you to do as much as you can to keep up with everyone else.

    No, because you won't have the VP to spend on their gear anyway.
    Which also makes the Rep locks essentially worthless. For all factions.

    VP gear is not intended as raid rewards. Raid boss drops are intended as raid rewards. VP gear is intended as a backup source of gear for raiders, but it is primarily a progression path for non-raiders. By the next tier of raiding, the rep gear will go to JP anyway, making this all moot.
    And new VP gear and new factions and new rep grinds will take their place. And whether or not the VP gear is intended for non-raiding progression, many riaders do report they feel an obligation to go for it.

    Making the gear available at Honoured won't change much because it will still be locked out via VP. What it will change is the obligation to get Rep up for all those factions as quickly as possible.

    It's not a goddamn effort to do half an hour of dailies for under two weeks.
    Yes, it is. You seem to forget its not just the GL. Its the obligation to do dailies for all the factions. To get charms. For VP. To unlock the rep gear. And it needs to be done NOW so the effort is of some value. No point unlocking it in three months when there are new factions and new VP gear and new raids. Who'll wnat Shado-Pan rep gear during the Siege of Orgrimmar? And there is the feel of the system. More rep simply means you get a more visible impact from your days work on that faction. Instead of the feeling many report of doing all that work, which takes longer and is more boring than other rep factions, only to see a small drip, drip, drip effect when getting rep.

    No, there does not. Charms are rewards for doing dailies.
    And if you hate dailies as some do? Most systems in game have multiple paths. VPs, for example can be obtained via dailies, dungeons, scenarios, raids. Is there any particular reason why Charms should be limited to just dailies? I can't think of one.

    Personally - I don't mind the daily system that much as it is now. I do enough dailies to get my 90 charms and thats basically it. However, I can understand the feeling of many when they say there is an "obligation". It is the same obligation that drive many to raid multiple times a week in LK for example. I also feel that the existing daily system can be improved.

    Providing alternate paths for rewards such as Charms or Rep will not break the game...but it would add variety and also ensure those who don't like dailies don't have to do content they dislike.
    Moving the VP gear to Honored also won't affect the game much - as the gear will still be locked out via VP earnings. There are more than enough possible rewards for faction vendors to sell. But it will remove any need for raiders to feel any obligation to do the dailies. It would become content that they can do as and when they see fit, and it would be content that would last some of them for months instead of weeks. You could even lower the rep gain from dailies if the rewards weren't seen as obligatory.

    EJL
    Last edited by Talen; 2012-11-19 at 02:28 AM.

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