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  1. #1
    High Overlord
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    Your thoughts on tier 14

    Not sure i've seen this posted yet apart from the usual 10 vs 25 fanboyism... I understand we still have a week before 'Heroic Terrace' but was just curious to know what peoples thought on the way tier 14 is going so far?

    I've really enjoyed it so far; currently 9/16(H) which I'm more than happy with cause I've felt the bosses so far have been nice and challenging BUT i dont think any of them have stood out to me yet (fingers crossed that with 7 bosses left one of them will


    Whats everyone else think of the tier so far?

  2. #2
    Blademaster
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    Score of Expansion 8/10

    Raiding:
    I think the MSV was well for one for the opening raid. Normal modes weren't hard, but it took people most of the week to down everything, and for the blues coming out of 5-mans the fights were very well tuned. Heart of Fear in my opinion was very enjoyable espeically with the dancing on the first boss, and driving the elemental guy on amber shaper.

    Dailies:
    This is the part of the expansion where i'm just scratching my head saying to myself, "what the hell were they thinking" As most know, Blizzard caters to the casual player, and having to do dailies for 2-3 hours per day isn't something that most player wants to do, nor has the time for. Imagine if you have multiple alts, how many hours of dailies per week that requires.

    Misc (Pet Battles, Challenge Modes, Monks)
    All of this extra material seems very well polished and well done. Although personally I haven't started Pet Battles yet, I've heard from many of my guildies that its addicting and they can't wait to try it once progression is over. Challenge modes were actually very difficult right when the expansion came out, and requires a lot of time to achieve gold on every single one. Monks are awesome. The class feels very well done in terms of the playstyle, and the animations and such. The one thing I Don't agree with was the way that RAF worked for automatically granting 80 levels to a monk, but thats just a side note.


    Overall, MoP took a dump on Cataclysm for a few reasons.
    - Raiding in Wrath was very very very very easy, so going into Cata really shellshocked a lot of people. Going into MoP people knew a little bit of what to expect in terms of first tier of raiding, and didn't take the changes in such a hard and negative way.
    - Having a new class helps an expansion. It gives people something extra to do, and makes the game seem new and fresh.

    THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT I MISSED, THE QUESTING AND LEVELING EXPERIENCE WAS REALLY GOOD. It was obvious that Blizzard put a lot of time and effort into quest lines, and it really got you involved in the story and made it seem the leveling FLY-BY




    so yeah...8/10 score, keep it up Blizzard.

  3. #3
    Way to fast releasing all these raids.
    It's like Cata again, we are going to end up with 1 raid at the end of xpac, and we 're gonna have to grind it for years, when most ppl can't even clear all 3 normals in one week (READ: MOST NOT BEST) ... they should have staggered this a lot more. And made normals harder.

    The bosses are meh, all look the same and do not feel special or unike apart from Ryolith 2.0 (Garalon)

    And less daily quests. All in all, i find the entire Valor system messed up, and i don't see how it's an improvement on previous xpacs

    6/10
    (Cata was 7/10 at launch, 5/10 at end)
    (Wrath (toc ICC) was 8.5/10 and Ulduar rather 9-9.5/10)

    obviously, this is imo etc

  4. #4
    Way too many bosses. For 99.99% of the population, it's pretty overwhelming. Between a constant feeling of needing to do more dailies for a month and having more bosses released than you can kill let alone come close to clearing on HM, it's just been far too much. Wth were they thinking, releasing 16 bosses this tier? Have they completely forgotten that most raiders raid 10 hours or less each week? And it's not like most of the bosses are pushovers. We've killed Garalon twice on normal, and spent a few hours wiping at the enrage timer on him last night after the nerf to cleave dps.. after having already farmed him in 25normal.

  5. #5
    Greatly overtuned; only about 130K people have cleared MV normal.

    I think lots of guilds stuck on earlier bosses will be imploding soon. I expect participation in later raids in the tier to be even more anemic. Progressive nerfs (should they occur, as seems likely) will help a bit, but I think Blizzard is not going to be happy with the numbers.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler

  6. #6
    People's response to this will entirely depend on how fast their guild has chewed through content. IMHO they have released too much raiding and reputation content (dailies) way too quickly. They could have easily split this into two content patches.... especially considering iLvL's for MV and HoF and Terrace are not the same any way.

    Quote Originally Posted by iggyMG View Post
    Dailies:
    This is the part of the expansion where i'm just scratching my head saying to myself, "what the hell were they thinking" As most know, Blizzard caters to the casual player, and having to do dailies for 2-3 hours per day isn't something that most player wants to do, nor has the time for. Imagine if you have multiple alts, how many hours of dailies per week that requires.
    I agree that this expansion doesn't cater to casuals at all...quite the opposite considering the fast clip of raid content release and the amount of dailies. I wonder how we will look back on this when the last tier of content lasts ~1 year...I bet we'll wish they had spread things out a lot more.

  7. #7
    I love the raiding encounters personally.. and I'm no where near clearing everything. Everything includes heroics for me.

    I LOVED driving the construct on the amber fight. Really fun encounter.

  8. #8
    N MSV
    Everything except Elegon was way too easy. None of the encounters are especially fun. Kind of a meh instance.

    N HoF
    The first two bosses are really, really easy but also fun. Well, Blade Lord is only fun <20%, but that's ok. Garalon was way fun prenerf, but probably too hard for a normal mode. Postnerf it's a joke. The last three are interesting and challenging. Great instance.

    N ToES
    Way too easy, but some of the mechanics are interesting. First boss was just faceroll. Second boss was cool, I guess. Kind of lame for pure DPS. Third boss was straight up lame. Sha was boring and long once people stopped fucking up breaths (myself included). Cool mechanics, but very undertuned even for normal modes.

    H MSV
    SG and Feng are pretty damn easy. Gara was challenging when we were less geared. SK, aside from the stupid reset mechanics, was really fun. Elegon was disappointing. Will was insanity; great fight.

    H HoF
    Vizier seems tuned way too high for the first boss, especially when compared to the other bosses. Second boss is pretty simple, but if you fuck up once, it's a wipe. Haven't tried anything beyond that, but Garalon and Wind Lord look fairly easy. Empress looks fantastic.

    H ToES
    Nobody knows! I hope it's much, much harder than normal mode, though. Seriously, normal mode is a joke.

    EDIT: This tier is better than most of Cataclysm. I only liked a few fights from Cata: Al'Akir (prenerf), H Cho'gall, Sinestra, Alysrazor, Rag, nothing in DS. Not one fight.
    Last edited by Squirl; 2012-11-14 at 08:42 PM.

  9. #9
    The Patient Igloo's Avatar
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    Loving it.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Mctriple View Post
    Way too many bosses. For 99.99% of the population, it's pretty overwhelming. Between a constant feeling of needing to do more dailies for a month and having more bosses released than you can kill let alone come close to clearing on HM, it's just been far too much. Wth were they thinking, releasing 16 bosses this tier? Have they completely forgotten that most raiders raid 10 hours or less each week? And it's not like most of the bosses are pushovers. We've killed Garalon twice on normal, and spent a few hours wiping at the enrage timer on him last night after the nerf to cleave dps.. after having already farmed him in 25normal.
    T12: "QQ only 7 bosses, not enough"
    T13: "QQ only 8 bosses, not enough"
    T14: "OMG WTF 16 BOSSES? TOO MUCH QQQQ"

    You people are never happy with anything.
    Quote Originally Posted by Precursor View Post
    "Fall of therzane....." ....um what? if that woman fell , god help us it will be the second cataclysm
    Words that lots of people don't seem to know the definition of:
    "Troll", "Rehash", "Casual", "Dead", "Dying", "Exploit".

  11. #11
    Stood in the Fire Zenko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mctriple View Post
    Way too many bosses. For 99.99% of the population, it's pretty overwhelming. Between a constant feeling of needing to do more dailies for a month and having more bosses released than you can kill let alone come close to clearing on HM, it's just been far too much. Wth were they thinking, releasing 16 bosses this tier? Have they completely forgotten that most raiders raid 10 hours or less each week? And it's not like most of the bosses are pushovers. We've killed Garalon twice on normal, and spent a few hours wiping at the enrage timer on him last night after the nerf to cleave dps.. after having already farmed him in 25normal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kashii View Post
    People's response to this will entirely depend on how fast their guild has chewed through content. IMHO they have released too much raiding and reputation content (dailies) way too quickly. They could have easily split this into two content patches.... especially considering iLvL's for MV and HoF and Terrace are not the same any way.
    What?

    How can you sit there and complain about too much content? I can't stop laughing at your misfortune of having cool raids and awesome vanity items just waiting for you.

    No seriously, what?

    @OP: My guild lost a lot of people during the end of Cata. We started doing 25mans again recently with an entirely new roster. Needless to say, we're generally behind in progression having only just cleared MSV in 25man mode. We're 2/6 in HoF with a quick 10man team that we dont take too seriously, as we're mainly focused on 25mans.

    Having said that, the raids for me have been surprisingly fresh and with a nice balance of mechanic execution and rotation execution. We havn't touched any heroics yet, but I'm looking forward to it.
    Last edited by Zenko; 2012-11-14 at 08:50 PM.

  12. #12
    Field Marshal Tripleblack's Avatar
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    I agree they have released the raids a little fast (inb4 customers complain about lack of raids and then 2 many raids) Right now my guild that raids 12 hours a week (semi hardcore) doesn't even get time to work on MSV Heroics as we are 2 busy working on HoF

    Now for the funnest fights IMO

    1.elegon after the first week of OMG SO MUCH DPS NEEDED it has become my favorite fight of the tier so far (only seen up 2 stone heroic and wind lord normal) From the celestial human skin to elegons voice over, I just love this fight

    2.Garalon, I like the mechanics of the fight, I find it fun having to manage multiple sets of dots, weak point debuff and the smelly debuff :3

    Now for the worst so far

    1. Stone guard, if you get jasper chained to a melee the fight becomes horrible :3 (I'm a shadow priest)
    2. Windlord, because Mindsear "isn't fun" :P

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Zenko View Post
    What?

    How can you sit there and complain about too much content? I can't stop laughing at your misfortune of having cool raids and awesome vanity items just waiting for you.

    No seriously, what?
    I'm not complaining about the amount of content just the pace of its release in consideration of how slow content has been released late in previous expansions. Next time read (and quote) my entire though.

  14. #14
    Bloodsail Admiral rashen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vook View Post
    T12: "QQ only 7 bosses, not enough"
    T13: "QQ only 8 bosses, not enough"
    T14: "OMG WTF 16 BOSSES? TOO MUCH QQQQ"

    You people are never happy with anything.
    Kinda feels like they went the other way this tier, 16 HM bosses in a single tier can be a bit overwhelming for some, having around 12 would been a better amount in my personal opinion considering most of them takes a fair bit of practice to down on heroic.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by evokanu View Post
    Kinda feels like they went the other way this tier, 16 HM bosses in a single tier can be a bit overwhelming for some, having around 12 would been a better amount in my personal opinion considering most of them takes a fair bit of practice to down on heroic.
    But why do you need to kill all of them? You know you won't kill all of them. Not in at least 4-6 months when ~30% nerfs have hit, unless you're in a top 500-700 guild or so. And those who are, will still have plenty of time to kill them all.
    You won't find an expanded version of my avatar here.

  16. #16
    There are some really great fights this tier (Lei Shi, Spirit Kings, Empress) but most fights are just long and/or boring (Garalon, Sha of Fear, Will)

    Sha of Fear and Will in particular are just super boring as a ranged DPS. 15 minute long add fights? No thanks.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Whiskra View Post
    But why do you need to kill all of them? You know you won't kill all of them. Not in at least 4-6 months when ~30% nerfs have hit, unless you're in a top 500-700 guild or so. And those who are, will still have plenty of time to kill them all.
    You see, people like to think they're better than they actually are. The progressive nerf mechanic puts people in their place. This is a horrible game mechanic, that tells most people "you suck!" It's as bad as PvP ratings.

    Properly designed raids would have a dead easy mode, and a hard (not very hard) mode, with a large difficulty gap between them. People who found the dead easy mode easy could tell themselves they were ALMOST good enough to do the hard mode, even if they weren't.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler

  18. #18
    I think they are great, especially after the last two tiers of raiding. My problem is that although things are starting to shape up on the new guild I joined on my server (one of the crappiest in the world since Cata), I am just not nearly as advanced as I'd like to be and know I could be had I had the same crew I had last expansion. But, from what I've seen so far, it seems pretty well tuned, the fights are actually fun for the most part...not so sure we needed 16, but beats the hell out of 8 crappy fights like t13. Only one I don't really like is Will of the Emperor, it's long and boring...maybe heroic is a different story, but...meh.

  19. #19
    Pandaren Monk Yggdrasil's Avatar
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    The amount is fine as long as they can keep it up. The problem with it is the track record says it is easy for Blizzard to dump a ton of raids out on an expansion release and then progress into lack luster small raids for the rest of an expansion. Got a dime on that being the case again. But I like the current amount. I just think with all the dailies and all the bosses the combo became a little overwhelming. At least at first.

    The difficulty is just fine. A few of the bosses are tough, some are easy, others are tuned just right. Honestly how it should be. Not every boss should be a mega challenge and every boss shouldn't be a push over. Should be a nice even mix to give a flow to raids that isn't just brick wall after brick wall and it shouldn't be a hot knife though butter -- so a good mix up here so far.

    I also liked the creative direction of each of the raids as well. Good art, new trash, some interesting mechanics rebooted and other fresh new ones. Not to mention fresher lore that hasn't been pounded time and time again. With all that said it is a pretty good tier. Maybe a little heavy depending on how the other tiers scale to this one, but over all not bad.

  20. #20
    Moderator Fnx-'s Avatar
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    If we just talk from raiding POV, some of the fights got some real potential other should maybe visit the drawing board once more. Another thing would be the order you have to clear each raid in, not just talking about Zor'Lok HC being misplaced a bit, others as well.

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