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  1. #1

    Asking for help on 10Man Normal Garalon HOF (hitting enrage every time)

    Hello,

    Please help me figure out what we are missing on Garalon. I am the resto shaman and here are our logs. There are some attempts days prior to this one. We hit enrage timer every good attempt. We have tried two different approaches:

    Our log world of log entry is /reports/rt-2m93qugexrn21w6c/
    Cant post full links atm


    Our latest approach:

    Two tanks, three healers, 5 dps. I as resto shamy take the pheromones first and start lining the puddles along the stairs. We are trying to keep tanks dpsing the boss as much as possible. We lust with all dps prepotting at start. Our pheromone rotation is me(resto shammy) -> warrior tank -> off tank -> loc -> repeat.
    Tanks deal with pheromones while keeping the hitbox in range. The same applies with the loc. We try to keep as much dps uptime as possible. When I look at our dps uptime, it does not look bad even with the tanks and the pheromone dps.

    We have tried two healing it, but I could not keep up with the pheromone tick damage.

    At the moment I think our best approach is to have shaman or pally co tank the boss with one main tank(warrior) and go with 6 dps (1 tank, 3 healers, 6 dps).

    I am looking for advice on the fight and possibly errors in our execution. Please help

  2. #2
    It can be 2 healed if your smart with it, using CD's well and managing mana.
    As a pala I've been putting beacon on the pheromones guy to cover almost all of the healing on him without much effort. Bubble & CD the first crush >Shaman totems and my Lights hammer 2nd > BoP druid 3rd etc etc
    Worst case you could consider using 5 people to swap the debuff earlier to reduce healing needed, but you'd lose dps.

    Our best try was like this reaching 2% (1 death and for some reason someone decided to try a different spec that try ;S) With 3 healing we just couldn't make it really.

  3. #3
    We tried it on our last attempt this night:
    World of logs entry /reports/rt-2m93qugexrn21w6c/sum/healingDone/?s=2626&e=2783

    I was healing on resto shammy, and we had a pally healer. The issue here that I ran into is that I could not aoe heal. I could not outheal the tick damage from pheromones with single target healing. Mana was not an issue. Our comp was:

    warrior/monk tanks
    resto shammy/holy pally
    warrior/rogue/ench shammy/warlock/dk/boomkin dps

    I also took the pheromones on pull and let all dps with lust/pots.
    Our phermone rotation was shammy(me)->tank warrior -> tank monk -> loc -> boomkin -> tank warrior (repeats)
    We were swapping at 20.

    The thing is that if we swap earlier, lets say 15 stacks, we ll get the extra crush for the pheromone swap. I think that our main problem was inability to throw aoe healing.

    I am starting to think that we ll need a dps on the pheromone trail duty. Monks cant tank actively, if they miss chi generation.

    How many people do you use to deal with the pheromone trail? Is it possible to do with 3 and go to 20?

  4. #4
    Well first of all, Garalon got recently hotfixed (in effect buffing it) and we haven't killed it since that so I can't say for sure how it is now.

    But looking at your logs, some of you dps are just pretty low - rogue and DK especially. Your lock, the kiter is doing about 56 k dps. I think that's too low but knowing nothing about locks can't really offer any advice. Mind that I didn't check anyone's gear so don't know what they should be doing.

    You have a very melee heavy comp, which is good. What we did was leave the easiest to reach - legs to our cleave dps (warrior, rogue) so they could have more uptime on them than if all dps went and zerged them down everytime they spawned. That helped us beat the berserk on our first kill. If there's no other way, you could also try with two healers :P

    If you want comparison, here's a log of our kill:

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...e/?s=535&e=918

    that rogue dps has been nerfed now tho so don't expect quite that high from your rogue.

  5. #5
    There is no secret.. raid group needs to do 500k dps to kill before enrage.. you are 18k short.

    Would be easy to point your warlock's dps, but there are many ways to squeeze more dps. We 2 tank 3 heal it, but disc/monk healers dps the full fight and get 25k by themselves.

    But yes, your warlock dps is why you don't kill this.. seriously.

  6. #6
    I am thinking about not using tanks at all but keeping two melee dps in front of the boss. With 3 healers / 7 dps comp.
    I am thinking of going with 4 people on pheromone rotation: healer 1 -> healer 2 -> range dps -> healer 3 (repeat).

    I took the fury swipes before on the resto shammy, so I am pretty sure we can have rogue/dk on the front of the boss. They can also hit two front legs too. Hoping for the best coming next friday.

    When I look at your log, your rogue blade fury is 38% of his damage. Our rogue blade fury is derped. I am going to look more into it.

  7. #7
    You dont actually need to have tanks in tank spec, just assign 2 plate dps (rogues could work as well with feint) taking the damage in front of the boss.
    Healers and ranged dps for the pheromones. Using melees for the pheromones is just a huge dps waste. Also your wlock shouldnt be destro on a boss like this, because as affli you can do so much more while moving constantly.
    Helps have everyone who can in your raid stacking or at least being close enough for AoE healing in the middle because boss moves around the middle.

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  8. #8
    This is how we did it.

    2 healing it with 1 holy pally + 1 disc priest.
    1 tank + 1 plate dps eating swipes.
    4 man range dps rotation on pheromones 20 stacks each.

    Lust on pull and kill all 4 legs, from there on tank and plate dps incharge of killing 2 front legs. If you have an extra melee put 1 of them on hind legs if they are up. Range stack up at mid and dps boss full time. Raid CD's when pheromones at 15 stacks. Don't Devotion aura on Crush since its physical. Pallies talent clemency and abuse 2x Hand of protection on low health targets when crush incoming. Holy pally should be blanketing the raid with eternal flames. Eternal flame must be his top healing done. Beacon on the plate dpser or the pheromones kiter. Abuse spirit shell as a disc priest.

  9. #9
    Your Rogue's and Lock's damage are straight up terrible. 100k should be the very lowest a Rogue pulls on this fight (I did ~140k this week, post BF nerf). I'm looking at Try 5, your longest one.

    Your Rogue's BF uptime is only 54%. Assuming he's not a dumbass, you guys are not saving legs for your cleavers. This is backed up by your Lock's damage: 56% of it was to a leg. Your Warrior and Rogue should be the only ones focusing legs. You might want to put your DK on them too, but I don't think their 2-target cleave is that great, so probably not unless you're falling behind.

    No one but your Rogue and Warrior should hit legs, and they especially should not hit them from outside a weakened zone. You also need to kite a bit off the wall so your cleavers can get to the outside legs. Having only cleavers hit legs is a raid DPS gain. Non-cleavers hitting legs is a raid DPS loss. Hitting legs from outside the weakened zone is also a raid DPS loss. With 2 cleavers and the nerfed enrage, this fight should not be an issue in the slightest.

  10. #10
    Thank you for your advice. We will be battling it again this friday.

  11. #11
    Stood in the Fire rogoth's Avatar
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    the only options atm until we (th community) have much betetr equipped gear, is to 0 tank 3 heal it, but make sure u have 2 plate DPS to soak the cleave, as they take the least dmg excluding maybe a rogue keeping feint up at all times, but yeah, when i killed it we were 2 ank/3 healing it and literally just beat the enrage timer, this was pre hotfix cockup with regard to my inferno blast spreading and our rogues blade flurry.

    try the 0 tanks 3 heals approach, execution is the same kite around the edge of the room and melee stand in kill zones for legs, ranged focus body and cleave to legs if needed, if dps is good enough, u should be good for a kil.

  12. #12
    Your dps isnt actually that low, you just need to 2 heal. 2 healing it is difficult and frustrating, and unless you have a monk (who are completely OP on this fight) requires your dps to do as much self-healing as possible. Myself(feral) and our shamans were doing 8-9k hps every attempt.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by rogoth View Post
    the only options atm until we (th community) have much betetr equipped gear, is to 0 tank 3 heal it, but make sure u have 2 plate DPS to soak the cleave, as they take the least dmg excluding maybe a rogue keeping feint up at all times, but yeah, when i killed it we were 2 ank/3 healing it and literally just beat the enrage timer, this was pre hotfix cockup with regard to my inferno blast spreading and our rogues blade flurry.

    try the 0 tanks 3 heals approach, execution is the same kite around the edge of the room and melee stand in kill zones for legs, ranged focus body and cleave to legs if needed, if dps is good enough, u should be good for a kil.
    I am going to try two melee dps in front with cleave on both front legs - possibly warrior and a rogue. I am also thinking about doing a pheromone rotation with 2 healers/2 range dps. 3 healing should not be an issue with one healer kiting the boss ( rotation healer 1 -> range 1 -> healer 2 -> range 2 ).

    We have used tanks before in the rotation, and we ll go away from that.

  14. #14
    We had a paladin and a druid healer on our attempt. It's just important for everyone to use their own personal survival cooldowns, along with healthstones if you've got em.
    I as a raidleader, frequently called out to my raid to use their healthstones before a crush if they were low, cause they tend to forget. Healthstones give you 20% of your hp back, and you can use it 3 times in a fight.

    It's a life saver, no doubt.
    Also before every crush i used my Demoralizing banner, and our dps warrior did it aswell, we rotated the banners on the crushes to make it easier on the healers.

    We had 2 tanks, 1 healer and 1 ele shammy to kite. When tanks was kiting it was easy to heal em, since they got many cds and stuff to use. The healer could easily self heal himself and the ele shammy saved his defensive cooldowns for when he kited.

    BTW, if dps is the problem, make sure you do it right on the legs.
    Depending on which direction you're kiting him at, there's gonna be 1 front leg that's gonna be "bad" and be in the void zones at all times. We let this let be dpsed by the tanks. There's no need to rush that leg, all you gotta do is make sure that atleast 2 legs are dead, preferably the "good" legs. Cause then they can respawn.
    The only time we got the dps to focus the "bad" leg is when boss was getting really low and a leg would equal a kill.
    Remember to tell your Rdps not to dot, or do any damage to that bad leg unless they are inside the buff area.
    Last edited by Sanktas; 2012-11-13 at 10:22 AM.

  15. #15
    Brewmaster Nigeldruid's Avatar
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    We use 0 tanks for it having a ret and a rogue doing the soaking. That solved all DPS issues we had.
    Nothing worth having comes easy. That's why hard content is worth doing, and easy content is a waste of time.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by dennisdkramer View Post
    Your dps isnt actually that low, you just need to 2 heal. 2 healing it is difficult and frustrating, and unless you have a monk (who are completely OP on this fight) requires your dps to do as much self-healing as possible. Myself(feral) and our shamans were doing 8-9k hps every attempt.
    How high do you take your stacks to? We were dealing with 20 or so, but actually they would get a bit higher on every rotation.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-13 at 02:33 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    Well first of all, Garalon got recently hotfixed (in effect buffing it) and we haven't killed it since that so I can't say for sure how it is now.

    But looking at your logs, some of you dps are just pretty low - rogue and DK especially. Your lock, the kiter is doing about 56 k dps. I think that's too low but knowing nothing about locks can't really offer any advice. Mind that I didn't check anyone's gear so don't know what they should be doing.

    You have a very melee heavy comp, which is good. What we did was leave the easiest to reach - legs to our cleave dps (warrior, rogue) so they could have more uptime on them than if all dps went and zerged them down everytime they spawned. That helped us beat the berserk on our first kill. If there's no other way, you could also try with two healers :P

    If you want comparison, here's a log of our kill:

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...e/?s=535&e=918

    that rogue dps has been nerfed now tho so don't expect quite that high from your rogue.
    You found our error. Our loc was destro and also was kiting the pheromone trail twice. Our rogue's uptime on Blade Flurry was half of that from Summerwinds log. That would have been a kill in our case in any of our attempts in the past. We have had hit enrage at least 3 times with 5% on the boss. Thanks again.

  17. #17
    We did the fight with only one tank, and our warrior soaking cleaves too. 2 healers should be enough (we used a monk and hpala).

    The kiting part was like this:

    Me (as dk tank) --> Warrior dps --> Elemental sham --> Fire mage

    Make sure that the range classes that you use for kiting, have a decent dps while moving. Thats why we made our sham and mage do it. I wouldnt let the healers kite since they have enough to do already, by only being 2.

    We switched kiters at 20 stacks.

    The comp for the kill was:
    - Dk tank
    - Fury warrior (plate dps soaking cleave)
    - Hpala
    - MW Monk
    - 2x Fire Mages
    - Affli Lock
    - Ele Sham
    - Shadow Priest
    - Feral Druid

  18. #18
    Thanks for the help. Cant wait till next Friday now.

  19. #19
    Killed him using 2 tanks and 3 healers. Without any cleave dps. We had the 3 healers and our weakest dps do the kiting. The trick that helped us beat the enrage timer was simple. We had just two melees take care of the legs. You just need to kill 1 leg every 30sec after the first 4 are gone. The rest did only boss dmg. By that you have as little as possible target switching.

  20. #20
    Bloodsail Admiral rawhammer's Avatar
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    anyone tried using 3 healers / 7 dps set up: 2 pally healers to soak the swipes and pass pheramones with a 3rd healer? we were thinking of trying this tonight, not sure if the healing will be a bit tricky if they are moving too much.
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