Thread: [BM] Colossus

  1. #1

    [BM] Colossus

    So my guild leader and I were discussing weapon enchants, and he thinks that I am crazy for wanting to use Colossus over Dancing Steel. So I just wanted to get some input to see what others thought about the matter.

    My reasoning is pretty much that with Colossus I have a higher up-time on damage absorb. I am aiming for more sustained damage reduction than burst damage reduction, where as Dancing Steel provides me with more burst (mostly hitting Guard + Expel harm). Colossus has a very decent proc rate, and will have an absorb up for almost every other attack. 8k damage reduction doesnt sound like a lot, but when it is damage that I don't have to stagger, it makes my rotation much easier to manage. Another reason behind it is that the two abilities that are scaling from my attack power (Guard and Expel Harm) have cooldowns tied to them, and I would much rather use them in periods of high damage, then waiting for a proc from my weapon.

    Currently I am using a polearm, and when I switch over to DW again I plan on running Dancing Steel - Colossus. But for the time being, I was just looking for input on the two enchants for progression (483 Ilvl, 4/6 MSV, 1/6 HoF) http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...eagle/advanced

  2. #2
    You also have to remember that Dancing Steel will give you more critical strikes which in turn provides you with more elusive brew and more guards on your other raiders.

  3. #3
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    Colossus is pretty bad for BrM's. Absorbs are only useful typically when they can be generated at specific times to meet mechanics, so the relatively small and random proc's are meh.

    Windsong basically boosts both our DPS and survival mechanics (though how is varied per proc) so you get a double benefit from it over Colossus. Dancing Steel 2x will give you the most bang for your buck, just up to you if you want to spend the cash on it.

    The four elements, like man alone, are weak. But together they form the strong fifth element: Boron.

  4. #4
    As far as EB procs are concerned, I usually maintain very decent uptime and feel VERY comfortable with how fast they are coming in. With the absorbs coming in frequently, its less damage from each attack that I am taking, acting as almost a sort of shield. More guards on my raiders would be nice, I over looked that one. Windsong is one of my least favorite enchants because of how speratic it is between what it is giving me (if i have more mastery, generally ill have to PB more, more haste = faster chi generation - not bad ill take it, and more crit - still not bad haha)

    Colossus is just giving me a barrier over the overall damage I take, which is fairly high due to my gear level. Where as dancing steel would give more crit for EB, more raid mitigation, but inconsistent procs when I want to time my abilities with it.

  5. #5
    Ultimately it's really not going to matter too much. The extra dps from dancing steel is going to be a clear winner for progression raiding in my eyes but for any other type of content I think all the enchants will do ok.

  6. #6
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blueeagle View Post
    As far as EB procs are concerned
    If your not creating 1 stack per second your not generating enough EB stacks. Ideally we would have 100% uptime for EB (which is impossible currently). Both the crit and haste procs improve EB stacks. Each variation of the proc has about a 30% uptime (looking at my Will kill) and 2/3 proc's directly improve our survival mechanics uptime/effectiveness AND boost DPS, and the 3rd proc still improves your EH effectively which isn't a bad thing.

    Dancing Steel still gives you the most bang but the buck is pricey.

    The four elements, like man alone, are weak. But together they form the strong fifth element: Boron.

  7. #7
    I don't mind the pricey, problem is (as you can see from my armory) I have been running into situations where i am practically getting one shot from bosses causing me to gear more towards stamina, and I have noticed much better uptime on shuffle because I am less paranoid to PB.

  8. #8
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blueeagle View Post
    I have been running into situations where i am practically getting one shot from bosses causing me to gear more towards stamina, and I have noticed much better uptime on shuffle because I am less paranoid to PB.
    Your almost the same iLevel as me and I've cleared Elegon/Will and don't think I was ever one-shot and first HoF boss was easily manageable, I don't even use the stam/armor meta. I think at this point I'd suggest posting a fight log there is something else going on outside of gear/weapon enchants.

    The four elements, like man alone, are weak. But together they form the strong fifth element: Boron.

  9. #9
    Blademaster Omnomnoms's Avatar
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    I agree with Dancing Steel being the end all/be all for weapon enchants for Brewmasters, but I believe come 5.1 when Colossus becomes 6PPM it will not be that bad.
    Assuming you get the maximum procs per minute that Blizzard is planning to implement, that is 6 x 7500 absorb = 45000 absorb per minute, increased by weapon attack speed and increased by roughly 50% by dual wielding Colossus.

    This is all just an assumption on my part of course, I'm sure the math will not work out in such a clean manner. However I believe on a budget Colossus or dual Colossus will not be as bad an option compared to using Windsong.
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by SurrealNight View Post
    Your almost the same iLevel as me and I've cleared Elegon/Will and don't think I was ever one-shot and first HoF boss was easily manageable, I don't even use the stam/armor meta. I think at this point I'd suggest posting a fight log there is something else going on outside of gear/weapon enchants.
    I don't tank the first boss in heart of fear (flex tank here) its the second boss on the 2 stacks. Elegon gives me no issues, but Will destroys me if they land a hit. In the end, I agree Dancing steel is way better than Colossus, but with my current haste/crit/mastery levels, when I have colossus up, i feel like it will mitigate more for me without timing the procs to my guard

  11. #11
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omnomnoms View Post
    Assuming you get the maximum procs per minute that Blizzard is planning to implement, that is 6 x 7500 absorb = 45000 absorb per minute, increased by weapon attack speed and increased by roughly 50% by dual wielding Colossus.
    My incoming DPS on Will was 54k (counting Stagger and everything) so would you rather ~negate one second of damage or have 18 seconds each of 1500 haste/mastery/crit?

    I don't think the change will still make it better for us than Windsong and both are 'cheap' enchants.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-16 at 04:29 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Blueeagle View Post
    its the second boss on the 2 stacks. Elegon gives me no issues, but Will destroys me if they land a hit.
    Check out the rolling HoF discussions for the 2nd boss sounds like you shouldn't be eating 2 stacks that much if ever and should have CD's if you do. Also, if your dying on Will cause the combo's are hitting you the solution would be to get hit less not gear different since that is totally 100% avoidable (not saying I avoid 100% but I just use a CD or call for something if I F up).

    Remember you can't time when Colossus would proc so it could easily be mostly while your off tanking or get a majority during the combo and zero once boss starts attacking you. Haste/Crit procs from Windsong help you no matter what phase of the fight it is since your at least building Shuffle time or generating extra EB stacks to bank for when you start tanking again. The mix of mastery procs also behave similar to Colossus in the fact that you will stagger more damage during that proc (which can be PB'd with enough haste for the Chi).

    The four elements, like man alone, are weak. But together they form the strong fifth element: Boron.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Blueeagle View Post
    I don't tank the first boss in heart of fear (flex tank here) its the second boss on the 2 stacks. Elegon gives me no issues, but Will destroys me if they land a hit. In the end, I agree Dancing steel is way better than Colossus, but with my current haste/crit/mastery levels, when I have colossus up, i feel like it will mitigate more for me without timing the procs to my guard
    See I kinda find this funny... I was rather worried about it, since on the first week HoF was out my guild was progressing in there without me, but I was listening in at how tanks were just dying left and right... But when I got in there and did my thing, it was much less stressful. Never got killed. You need a combination of healer externals and personal cooldowns. It's really all about that. There shouldn't be a reason you're getting one shot.
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  13. #13
    I tanked almost everything on Windlord with ilvl 488 (didnt had the shoes until last raid) and never really got one shotted. Tho to be fair i do drop alot with haste build but..ohwell....as i said we only cc 3 mobs and i tank boss + everything besides 2 healer.
    Sometimes even a healer when our dk cant hold up with me (hell of ap you get there...oh boy.).
    So with ilvl around 485 you should do fine in mv...if you drop like a stone you definitly manage something wrong (cant even blame healers if you really get instagibbed.)

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by The Madgod View Post
    See I kinda find this funny... I was rather worried about it, since on the first week HoF was out my guild was progressing in there without me, but I was listening in at how tanks were just dying left and right... But when I got in there and did my thing, it was much less stressful. Never got killed. You need a combination of healer externals and personal cooldowns. It's really all about that. There shouldn't be a reason you're getting one shot.
    its more of a *as i use up my energy to stack my shuffle i get into tight spots with no chi and heavy stagger*
    The hard hitting ones that bring me into a heavy stagger in 1 or 2 hits are the clutch areas that I focus on the most.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-16 at 07:58 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Asmalya View Post
    I tanked almost everything on Windlord with ilvl 488 (didnt had the shoes until last raid) and never really got one shotted. Tho to be fair i do drop alot with haste build but..ohwell....as i said we only cc 3 mobs and i tank boss + everything besides 2 healer.
    Sometimes even a healer when our dk cant hold up with me (hell of ap you get there...oh boy.).
    So with ilvl around 485 you should do fine in mv...if you drop like a stone you definitly manage something wrong (cant even blame healers if you really get instagibbed.)
    The only time im dropping that quick is on Will of the emp, and its if they get a hit in through the dodge. The only way around that one really is to get some more mastery which im gonna try out. The other section where im getting hit that hard is my 2nd stack on Blade lord (2nd boss HoF) which the extra stam seemed to help cover.

  15. #15
    The Patient Valient's Avatar
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    Will of Emperor is not a mastery fight. You have plenty of time during combos where you are not getting hit and you can build shuffle/EB stacks and have a pretty much untouched Guard going into the damaging part. As long as you are not getting the armour debuff you shouldn't have any problems, Avert Harm is very nice for covering off the bad RNG times where you only go into the damage part with 6~ EB stacks.

    What I found is that 4-5 secs before the combo starts, you can start pooling resources for the next phase, by this I mean, if you are at 90%+ HP and shuffle will not drop off, then don't use anymore EB stacks, you can risk taking a damage spike in the last few seconds because you know there is no damage coming after that, so your healers have 15 or so seconds to top you back up. I am only dropping low ever if I get some really bad RNG and I haven't died on this fight for about 5-6 weeks (when I started nailing the combo dances). If you can get the dances right, you get some really nice dps and therefor Statue shields for the raid.

    I used to use the DMC stam trink for this not for the stam but for the on use and just macro it into my EB (lazy I know, but it works in this instance) using it you can sustain ~80% avoidance for every other damage phase for a 15 secs.

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