1. #1

    (Blood tankScreaming Tiger, Qiang's Unbreakable Polearm or...

    Screaming Tiger, Qiang's Unbreakable Polearm 10 man normal, considering no one can use in raid, is it better then the 2hand from Lightbreaker Greatsword for tanking..

  2. #2
    No, agility is horrible. Ilvl isn't a tanking stat.
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  3. #3
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    You want any 2H with strength + mastery. Agility = worthless.

    I'd go with the Lightbreaker Greatsword



  4. #4
    The strength is more defensive than the small bonus you get from the extra mastery. weapon dps means virtually nothing with how much damage tanks are doing.

  5. #5
    Moderator Fnx-'s Avatar
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    As said above, you have no reason what so ever to pick up a agi weapon, go with sword.

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  6. #6
    Titan Kalyyn's Avatar
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    Actually, agility does give a tiny bit of dodge and crit, so its not completely useless. That being said, definitely go with the strength sword.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    Actually, agility does give a tiny bit of dodge and crit, so its not completely useless. That being said, definitely go with the strength sword.
    Not really. They sort of borked it in beta, but the amount you get is literally something like .005% from base agility at 90. It's entirely worthless by any mathematical standpoint.
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  8. #8
    Titan Kalyyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Murdos View Post
    Not really. They sort of borked it in beta, but the amount you get is literally something like .005% from base agility at 90. It's entirely worthless by any mathematical standpoint.
    Granted OP is talking about tanking, so this isn't really relevant, but my DK appears to be receiving 5.01% crit from her 135 agility. I'd still never trade strength for agility in a million years, but if Blizzard asked me "Hey, how would you like to passively have another 500 agility?" I'd be all over that shit.

    That's the one reason that I was sad when they changed horn of winter from str+agi to 10% attack power :/

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    Actually, agility does give a tiny bit of dodge and crit, so its not completely useless. That being said, definitely go with the strength sword.
    They removed Agi->Dodge for plate tanks back in T11.

  10. #10
    Reforging both to parry:
    1146 Agi
    370 Sta
    188 Mastery (1.05)
    50 Parry (0.19%)
    348 Haste (2.72%)
    900.6 Melee DPS

    vs

    899 Str
    274 Expertise (2.67)


    I don't think it's all black and white here.
    The pole arm gives more controllable mitigation through haste/mastery at the loss of parry (from str).
    It also has more stam.
    And then the pole arm probably deals quite a bit more dps.
    Armories:
    Pally: Chiaki
    Dk: Telare
    Warrior: Irlida

  11. #11
    As others have stated the sword would be better tanking wise.

    If you happen to be an Orc DK and trying to hit the exp/hit cap as well, you might want to look into getting the Goresoaked Headreaper off of Rattlegore instead.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaac View Post
    As others have stated the sword would be better tanking wise.

    If you happen to be an Orc DK and trying to hit the exp/hit cap as well, you might want to look into getting the Goresoaked Headreaper off of Rattlegore instead.
    Idk about weapons without mastery.....
    Armories:
    Pally: Chiaki
    Dk: Telare
    Warrior: Irlida

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Nillo View Post
    Idk about weapons without mastery.....
    I don't know about weapons without strength, 899 strength directly converts to 0.91% parry plus whatever your reforges grant you.l.
    Last edited by Murdos; 2012-10-19 at 01:34 PM.
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Nillo View Post
    Idk about weapons without mastery.....
    all depends on preference. You get a little over 1% of mastery with the sword versus almost 2.5% expertise (if orc) with the axe, plus being able to reforge the crit into almost .5% of mastery anyhow.

    So it comes down to 1% expertise vs .5% mastery. I rather have the accuracy stats since it ensures that heart strikes wont be botched and thus slowing down my runic power gain.

    Along with higher accuracy, it greatly helps your dps, which if you are doing any kind of raiding can make a difference in heroics or even normal modes. Sure if you just do 5 mans and LFR it probably doesnt matter, but I like to help the raid dps as much as possible.

    To me, .5% of mastery is not going to be life or death.
    Last edited by Eklypto; 2012-10-19 at 01:48 PM.

  15. #15
    forget the mitigation point of view, wouldn't the polearm greatly increase dps for the tanks? Considered most fights are not even that heavy hitting on tanks, and tank's dps actually matters, wouldn't this weapon be alot better compare to say a heroic 5 man wep?

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by hammertalkers View Post
    forget the mitigation point of view, wouldn't the polearm greatly increase dps for the tanks? Considered most fights are not even that heavy hitting on tanks, and tank's dps actually matters, wouldn't this weapon be alot better compare to say a heroic 5 man wep?
    Weapon dps isn't that strong with the new vengeance.
    Armories:
    Pally: Chiaki
    Dk: Telare
    Warrior: Irlida

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Nillo View Post
    Weapon dps isn't that strong with the new vengeance.
    yeah, and also, you lose 900 STR as well. that's almost as much as not being flasked as a DPS, which noone would do.
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    4) getting charms faster is also not pay2win. getting those is easy, but not everyone has the time or want for dailies.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Nillo View Post
    Weapon dps isn't that strong with the new vengeance.
    why not? deathstrike and runestrike makes up big portion of blood's dmg, I don't see how flat ap increase from vengenance changes that

    yes, you lose alot of strength. But for frost no amount of strength lost is even comparable to raw wep dps decrease in most cases. I don't see why this would suddenly change for blood consider the dmg on their strikes based off similar mechanics

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-22 at 12:11 AM ----------

    nvm I sort of understand now. (Weapon DPS + AP/14) * Weapon Speed. So in a way wep dps is less important due to vengeance.

    Is there a cap to vengeance? And how easy is it to achieve such value?
    Last edited by hammertalkers; 2012-11-22 at 12:02 AM.

  19. #19
    Blood scales pretty terribly with Vengeance compared to other tanks. That said, most of your damage (around 75%) on a single target will be weapon-based damage (HS, RS, DS, SR). The weapon-damage difference between the two weapons (463 to 489) would be around 15%, which means you'll be doing around 11% more damage in total with the polearm. The extra strength you gain from the blue sword will not even get you close to that.

    On multiple targets it's another story. Logically more targets = less weapon based damage and more strength/AP based damage which significantly devalues the damage of your weapon.


    Interesting note: While DKs do around 75% weapon-based damage, Warriors and Druids usually do less than 50%, Paladins around 20%. Somewhat explains tanks DPS performance on different encounters based on their Vengeance numbers.

    Edit: Should note that adding around 100k Vengeance on top of these numbers and and they'll be quite devalued. At 200k AP you'd probably still gain around 6% damage. In any circumstance, strength is bad.
    Last edited by Denalian; 2012-11-22 at 12:52 AM.

  20. #20
    So you're discussing to loose active mitigation due to gaining 1-3% of Parry?

    So you're stating that 2-3% of parry and DPS gain is more useful then more mastery for more active mitigation(if you know how to cook it, of course) and giving a sword to DPS player. Correct? Am I missing something or I'm the only active mitigator here, so Lightbreak<Starshatter<Tiger<Shin'ka for normal weaponz, and Tiger HM<=Starshatter HM?
    because in my opinion you're giving a DPS weapon for DPS class first, tank can run with 463 Mastery Mace and he won't gain as much as if he will take starshatter from DPS classes, while Polearm is usually just goes to disenchant.
    I am sorry, I am just deep hater of passive mitigation on DK(dodge/parry stacking etc) without any reasons for it(but we don't have Baleroc yet) and IMO our vengeance is horrible in compare to other tanks, we should wait for 5.1 and Death Strike buff to show some non-aoe DPS again(as for AoE, our DoTs will make it far more better)

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