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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Kipling View Post
    I know affliction is the top spec, but are the other specs THAT far behind? (I've not leveled my lock yet) surely the gap can't be THAT big?
    The gap is widening with more gear, early on the specs are fairly close to each other (with Affli at top in single target). Both Destro and Demo are able to pull competitive numbers if you play to their strength though, so either OP can't play spec correctly which is already not the best, or his guild is asking him to pull rest of under performing group. And I'm leaning to the first cause.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Destruction may be behind Affliction in the sims, but on those same sims it's still above 13 other DPS specs; including Shadow Priests, Balance Druids, Hunters, Ret Paladins, Monks and Elemental Shaman who lack alternative specs to fill the same role. The problem therefore, is not the spec: It's you.
    As someone who raided as destro in a top 20 guild on Illidan, I can promise you that Destro plays extremely well and is extremely versitile, the most forgiving of all the specs and the most adaptable considering you only have one dot to swap (where as affliction has three and demo has two [three if you includ hand]).

    In 482ilvl gear, I can hold 80-90k single target, and did 100k on Heroic Fang while doing full tiles by myself (sadly we don't log), if you're doing anything less than 65k you're doing it wrong and they are right to replace you. You cannot go into a raid, even with casuals, and expect them to carry you, being more than 5% under the highest or 1% under the lowest, is generally unacceptable in terms of damage.

    You want to keep raiding? Get your stuff together and learn the spec better, are you using chaos bolts on backdraft? are you running an incorrect build (i.e using service), are you reforging/gemming wrong? Its not the raids place to teach you to be a raider, its you, and your fuck all end all mentality is helping no one, including yourself.
    Soulburn: Unstable Affliction. A boy can dream.

  3. #63
    You didn't want to play affliction while it's so easy and so much fun to play?

    Remember you play for the guild in raids, not yourself, at least that's how I look at it.

  4. #64
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    Sim craft puts destro at something like >30k less dps than affliction for my in my current gear, its by far the worst spec at the moment.
    Yeaaaaaaaah sure...
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  5. #65
    Dreadlord Elapo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lockthompson View Post
    OP, just because the guild is of casual status does not mean you can perform at a lower standard. By not playing affliction you're a liability to the raid so it isn't surprising they dropped you. Not everyone gets to play their most desired class/spec in raiding, you do it for the team, not for yourself.
    *by not doing enough DPS in destuction

    Fixed that for you. Our lock loves playing both affli and destr, even tough his DPS is slightly lower in destr. He still does an acceptable amount though. Same goes for our mage, he plays arcane, even though fire is so much better. Don't blame a spec, blame the player.
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  6. #66
    Without having WoL parses or print-screen with meters this is the same than talking about if the egg came before the chicken...

  7. #67
    don't blame your guild. blame bad balancing. your guild being "casual" doesn't give you a free ride on the baddy train. i'ts not like they asked you to play a different role, that would be understandable. if you don't want to switch to a more effective spec as a pure dps class, you're being either bad (for not knowing) or egoistic (for not wanting). clearly if your raid is not advancing well in content, you should give your best, not slack around. even more so if time is short.

  8. #68
    You do whatever is beneficial to the raid, casual, hardcore or semi it doesnt matter;

    If a spec is going to help get more dps then you go that spec for that raid, same with buffs etc but buffs arnt so much an issue ne more.

    Its what raiding is and always has been, i guess LFR is where you will be more comfortable.


    If you aint going to put the "effort" in the be of use to the raid, then i to wouldnt take you.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by David Cavalheiro View Post
    If you got kicked you pissed someone, because not doing enough dps on raids isn't reason to kick noone from guild.
    But he wasn't kicked, he was sat out from raids unless he respecced.
    Not really playing much these days but was a raid leader for 4 years and I too would've sat someone out if they didn't want to do what was best for the other 39/24 people in the raid.
    On your off-raiding hours play as what ever you want but when you raid you should be performing to the best of your class's ability.

  10. #70
    High Overlord Zazzmi's Avatar
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    'Casual' ONLY refers to the amount of time a guild will invest in raiding. Whether your guild is casual OR hardcore, it still requires the same amount of DPS/TPS/HPS to finish an encounter, so the casual vs. hardcore argument is moot.

    OP, it sounds like you have different goals in this game than your former guild. There's nothing inherently wrong with that. If you don't want to play a certain spec, don't. But DO be prepared to only be viable for LFR and nerfed normal modes.

  11. #71
    "the needs of the many, outweighs the needs of the few" comes to mind, the majority rules(unless you live in america) so you will have to do what your guild thinks is best, so i would prolly have done the same as well, what you do on your own time is your own problem, but when you raid there are 9 or 24 other ppl that needs you to perform optimally for your raids, and that isnt just happening with destro, afflic and demo will outperform it at every turn, which will make everything run much more smoothly.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Brauhm View Post
    In 482ilvl gear, I can hold 80-90k single target, and did 100k on Heroic Fang while doing full tiles by myself
    That's quite impressive to be dps'ing Feng while soloing stone guard tiles.

    Assuming you meant Stone Guard, 100k isnt that impressive given the dps boost you get.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Hikashuri View Post
    You didn't want to play affliction while it's so much fun to play?
    This one nearly killed me.

  14. #74
    you're better of finding a new guild. I am in teh same boat, except I didnt get kicked, I am tanking on my DK instead. I wont play demo or aff if I dont want to .... I want to play my destro lock but nobody wants them. And in all honesty, considering how guilds and raiders are, blizzard should have up'd Destros dps a long time ago.

  15. #75
    To get a meaning of casual play u have to digg up the old shfg (stop having fun guys). Wile ur in a casual guild/raid theres none pressuring you to prepot, hanging on eletist jirk, making bgs on ur sparetime for knowing ur class (surv.), etc and tons of other time consuming, your in a kinda chill position where ur raiding with a casual attitude where the progress isnt the meaning of it, its the fun.

    But ofc there are players in your raid which want to achieve more than that, want to have fun when elgalon is dead on hc etc, but to look what it really take for achieving this in a game nerfed to the ground by blizz= Do ur job, don't do it bad. Even casuals can, so ur guild is basicly not pushing you beyond the limit of the casualness, insteed you should listen and read more about why affliction>whatever your playing. The buffs to the raid? I don't know, im just trying to give you the aspect of your guildys which i can feel more than your wine over changing your spec for the benefit of the raid.

  16. #76
    Its amazing that someone acting this selfish can honestly feel like "the others" are making a mistake by not wanting to play with him anymore.

    The argument "I do enough DPS to theoretically beat the enrage timer" is and never was a valid one. More DPS means a shorter fight and a shorter fight means less room for mistakes by anyone and it means more time for the next bosses, some of which might be new to the raid and take a lot of time to learn. At the very least, it means all the players in the raid save some time that they can spend otherwise.

    It is rather bold to waste the time of others because of selfish reasons. If you raid mainly because you want to do things your way, then you are doing it wrong. It is about a team effort and the right attidtude is independent from the level of play.

  17. #77
    Every raid draws their lines for letting ppl play under performing specs before they sit them. This often seems to be an issue with hunters and locks. Look at it from the groups point of view. You might be great at your spec but you could be better in another that should be frustrating to you and them that you are just willing to choose to do less dmg. Sucks having to pick raiding or raiding as the spec you don't want to but that is how it goes sometimes.
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  18. #78
    Legendary! Sigma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by idpersona View Post
    Pretty much what topic says.Well,i wasnt kicked(casual guilds dont usually kick,unless you make drama)but i got the"we dont invite you in farmraids anymore,and progress raids only if there's a free spot"treatment.Thing is,

    1)Im not a bad player.I perform the mechanics of a fight without making stupid mistakes(something players on my guild did plenty) and often offer advice on the fights we do.
    2)Yes,especially on non-havocable fights,dps is shit.Still,it's always acceptable for enrage timers.

    Well nothing much to say,just venting.It's annoying that although lots of locks like playing destruction they're pretty much unable to play it(since my example shows that even casual guilds like mine that havent killed even normal mode Ta'yak yet benchkick you for it).

    Also,600k chaos bolts on pull,wtf are people smoking.I got 4500 mastery,3900 crit,and havent broken ~460k ish crits with potion,double trinkets,and dark soul up.
    and you're refusal to switch to a better spec for the fight makes you look like an arrogant child throwing his toys out the pram because you have been asked to switch to a better spec for the fight. What makes it look worse is you then come to a public forum and cry over it instead of taking it up with your Raid leader / GM / Class officer. Really, if you had this type of attitude in my guild I would have booted you from the guild and not just benched you till you had cooled you heels a little and realized that switching to a better spec for the fight is good for the guild.

    Progress raiding even for casual guilds requires some sacrifice from the raiders, be that time, consumables, repairs (if not supplied by Guild) or even something as simple as switching spec to squeeze a few more DPS out to beat an enrage timer.

  19. #79
    I'm a destro lock aswell that refuses to go aff. Cba to look at 4 dot timers untill my eyes bleed. To get max dps as aff you need to ignore the hit cap... Wich makes it even more annoying to play. I'm in a semi hardcore raiding guild and im allways 1st on dps. Very small difference on single target fights and huge difference when there are adds in the encounter. Destro isn't that far back on aff if you play it right but 2 players who are evenly skilled in their spec's aff will be the winner. As destro you build up your dps with your burning embers so dont waste them. Try to use Chaosbolt when you have your trinkets ready. Dont use them when the target is at 25% health but save them for shadowburn. It's just common sence. Use havoc as soon as you can. Even on the 2 mc'ed people on the 1st boss in heart of fear. Save your big demons for bloodlust and offcourse be sure to be correctly gemmed/reforged. Check mr. robot for that. My only complain with destro atm is our AoE that is far behind on other classes/specs

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-22 at 12:01 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by idpersona View Post
    Pretty much what topic says.Well,i wasnt kicked(casual guilds dont usually kick,unless you make drama)but i got the"we dont invite you in farmraids anymore,and progress raids only if there's a free spot"treatment.Thing is,

    1)Im not a bad player.I perform the mechanics of a fight without making stupid mistakes(something players on my guild did plenty) and often offer advice on the fights we do.
    2)Yes,especially on non-havocable fights,dps is shit.Still,it's always acceptable for enrage timers.

    Well nothing much to say,just venting.It's annoying that although lots of locks like playing destruction they're pretty much unable to play it(since my example shows that even casual guilds like mine that havent killed even normal mode Ta'yak yet benchkick you for it).

    Also,600k chaos bolts on pull,wtf are people smoking.I got 4500 mastery,3900 crit,and havent broken ~460k ish crits with potion,double trinkets,and dark soul up.

    I got 5650 mastery and only 2900 crit and i do hit for 600k on pull. Check Mr. Robot cause i think you are not well gemmed/reforged.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Zumzumzum View Post
    Yeaaaaaaaah sure...
    Shut up and play aff !

    Seriously though, currently, the 3 specs really are close on nearly every fight and anyone preaching a radical spec change probably can't play them properly.

    However, my understanding is that your guild does not take anymore for your performance (and proposed a spec change before to fix it), nothing else.

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