Help with a new gaming computer… Have many MANY questions

[Lychee3000]

Fair enough, technically a Hyper212 is enough even for a 4.4ghz OC while running at safe temps.


Good


Yay finally :P



You do realize that you'll be running a total of 8 fans in your system (including the ones on the CPU cooler). This thing will quite literally be the opposite of quiet, especially if you're placing it on your desk, it'll sound like a jet taking off because all the fans will be going at max RPM's. Doesn't matter what fans you buy, running so many together will be loud as hell.

You're also spending a total of $75 on additional fans which is almost pointless. The case already has good airflow with 2x120mm intakes and 1x120mm rear exhaust. Replacing the CM Blademaster which comes with Hyper212 Evo with 2xSP120's will result in tiny drop at best, maybe 2-3c if you're lucky. Is that worth $30, making the actual total price of your cooler $65? As an ex-Hyper212 owner I can tell you the included 120mm CM Blademaster is designed to work very well with the heatsink.

My advice is to stick with the fans which come with the case, and connect them to a fan controller. The Hyper212 fan will go to the CPU_fan pin obviously, but the rest of the ~3 fans should go to a controller if you really value silence. When a computer is idle or doing light work (as it will be most of the time) you don't need the fans spinning at anything higher than the bare minimum. Get a fan controller such as this one:

Lamptron Fan-ATIC - $39.99

It allows you to connect 5 fans to it and gives 12v/5v/Off settings. When you're at idle you could safely turn off the front 2 fans, leaving only the rear exhaust and your CPU cooler spinning. It would be so incredibly quiet you probably won't even know whether your PC is turned on lol. When gaming you would flick on all fans to 5v, or full blast at 12v. Neat huh?

Many people swear by fan controllers these days because it gives them so much control over their noisy fans.

I was JUST thinking about just staying with the normal fans I have with the case as you mentioned . Even the CM Hyper 212 EVO fan. I think I will not get any case fans and just get the bare minimum for now. If I need to add any fans later on, I can get them and install them myself... And I will not be overclocking from the start anyway.

Now, I need to know what exactly to tell the NCIX builders to make sure that my computer is in complete working order when I go pick it up.
I am thinking of letting them know to make sure that all the parts look fine and there is no physical defect in them, from the case to the fans to the computer components,
To connect the 3 fans to the fan controller,
To put both the 1TB HDD and 128GB SSD at the bottom HDD cage, with the 1TB at the bottom and SSD at the top (or should I get them to leave a gap in the middle between them?),
To have the DVD writer at the top of the drive bays,
To connect the CM Hyper 212 EVO with the fan exhausting to the back of the case through the rear exhaust fan,
To have all cables managed into the back of the case with zip ties and all that,
To install the SSD with Windows 7 that I bought with and have all the proper configurations for SSD,
To have my computer in complete working order and it functions as it should with no grinding noises or any abnormal noises,
To have all the cables needed to connect my computer and start it up,

Anything else to add? I am kind of being picky but I want to make sure, as much as possible, that I don't have to RMA or exchange any of my computer components after I get it home and start it up. Would the NCIX peeps know about the proper SSD configurations or how to install Windows 7 on a SSD properly?

I was looking at this link in regards to SSD optimization:

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5592454629#1

I'll just post what he said here:

** SSD optimization tips:

There are some extra work you have to do to ensure full performance on your SSD.

- Plug SSD SATA cable to a SATA III port on the motherboard. Plugging it to a SATA II port will gimp its performance (unless it's older generation SSDs).

- Enter the motherboard BIOS during boot, and ensure that SATA mode is set to AHCI (or RAID if you do RAID). Leaving it to IDE compatible will cause big performance penalty to SSD speed. Most modern motherboards today will have it at AHCI by default, but it doesn't hurt to double check.

- SSD firmware makes a rather big difference in maintaining speed and reliability of the drive. Because of this, before you proceed with installing Windows on the SSD, update the firmware on the SSD if there is one for yours. You should continue to update it whenever possible, especially if you use a SandForce-based SSD.

- Always do a fresh install of Windows 7 / 8 on the SSD. This is because Windows 7 / 8 does bunch of extra tasks specifically designed for the SSD during the installation only. Do not copy over your OS as it is to the SSD.

- Once installed, disable Windows Search, and drive indexing on the SSD. Also fix Windows swap file (virtual memory) to fixed size (1GB~2GB) to the mechanical hard drive.

- To further save on writing cycles, assign Windows temporary folders to a hard drive, change where your web browser stores cache / cookies. Doing those two alone will significantly save on the writing cycles of your SSD.

- Never run any "SSD optimizers" nor "SSD defragmentation software" of any kind except ones supplied by the vendor of the SSD. These are not necessary and in fact, will hurt your SSD. However, Windows 8's default defragmentation program is now called "Disk Optimizer", and it is OK to leave it to "optimize" the SSD. It knows what it's doing, so do not worry.

- Leave Windows 7 / 8 and programs + specific games you want to see speed boost on the SSD. All "data" such as music, movie, pictures, and all other games, should be on the mechanical hard disk.

--------------------------------------------------------

---------- Post added 2012-11-25 at 04:04 PM ----------

Oh shoot, forgot to ask something...

Should I get this?:

"ADDITIONAL INSURANCE with ExpressRMA ($36.93 - 3% of the subtotal) - Covers the full amount of your order and fast ExpressRMA product replacement coverage from 30 days in case there are problems *. We highly recommend shipping insurance with this order. Click here to see more about ExpressRMA."

Or this?

http://source.ncix.com/ncix-warranty/
The NCIX Care Coverage Protection... the 3-year on-site care coverage bundle - $108.00
I am going to have my computer for 3 years so I don't know if I should get it or not for peace of mind.
Also, the NCIX Care Coverage Protection overlaps with the ExpressRMA above... So it is one or the other.
The ExpressRMA is for 30 days and the care coverage protection is for 1-4 years... but I want to get the 3 year one.

What you think?

[Xuvial]

To connect the 3 fans to the fan controller,
To put both the 1TB HDD and 128GB SSD at the bottom HDD cage, with the 1TB at the bottom and SSD at the top (or should I get them to leave a gap in the middle between them?),
To have the DVD writer at the top of the drive bays,
To connect the CM Hyper 212 EVO with the fan exhausting to the back of the case through the rear exhaust fan,
To have all cables managed into the back of the case with zip ties and all that,
To install the SSD with Windows 7 that I bought with and have all the proper configurations for SSD,
To have my computer in complete working order and it functions as it should with no grinding noises or any abnormal noises,
To have all the cables needed to connect my computer and start it up,

Anything else to add? I am kind of being picky but I want to make sure, as much as possible, that I don't have to RMA or exchange any of my computer components after I get it home and start it up.

> Remember the fan controller sits in a 5.25" bay, I would put the fan controller in the topmost bay and the DVD writer just below it since the controller will have the most cables coming out.



(your setup will look better since your case is black :P)

> HDD/SSD spacing doesn't matter.

Rest is fine. There's no difference between installing Win 7 on an SSD or HDD, the installation process is exactly the same on the user end.Win 7 does it's own stuff in the background when it detects an SSD.

Would the NCIX peeps know about the proper SSD configurations or how to install Windows 7 on a SSD properly?

I was looking at this link in regards to SSD optimization:

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5592454629#1

I'll just post what he said here:

Don't worry about that stuff. Samsung SSD's come with a downloadable tool called Magician, it lets you optimize the SSD with the most important settings with a few clicks (disabling prefetch, etc). If you want to go crazy with optimizations/tweaks then this is the best guide:

http://thessdreview.com/ssd-guides/o...ation-guide-2/

Careful if going all the way through with that guide, it makes you do some risky stuff.

Oh shoot, forgot to ask something...

Should I get this?:

"ADDITIONAL INSURANCE with ExpressRMA ($36.93 - 3% of the subtotal) - Covers the full amount of your order and fast ExpressRMA product replacement coverage from 30 days in case there are problems *. We highly recommend shipping insurance with this order. Click here to see more about ExpressRMA."

Or this?

http://source.ncix.com/ncix-warranty/
The NCIX Care Coverage Protection... the 3-year on-site care coverage bundle - $108.00
I am going to have my computer for 3 years so I don't know if I should get it or not for peace of mind.
Also, the NCIX Care Coverage Protection overlaps with the ExpressRMA above... So it is one or the other.
The ExpressRMA is for 30 days and the care coverage protection is for 1-4 years... but I want to get the 3 year one.

What you think?

All that insurance/RMA stuff is completely up to you mate, I wouldn't know what to take.

[Lychee3000]

Thank you for the quick response. I will do what you said about the fan controller and DVD wrtier

I am going to go ahead and order my computer now

Thank you for everything, Xuvial... And thanks to everyone else who gave me input on this =).

[yurano]

http://thessdreview.com/ssd-guides/o...ation-guide-2/

[/COLOR]Careful if going all the way through with that guide, it makes you do some risky stuff.

I'd go with this guide instead because its more thorough: http://www.overclock.net/t/1156654/s...-for-ssds-hdds

[Lychee3000]

@yurano

Thanks for that link

@Xuvial

Oh, I was not planning on buying a fan controller like separately. I am only using the inbuilt fans anyway so the case's fan controller will suffice for the 3 white LED fans already in the case.

By the way, I placed my order for the computer and the computer desk. All is good now . I will update maybe in a few weeks after I have everything up and running.

[Xuvial]

500R has a fan controller?? Holy crap I just looked, indeed it does! Hahahah neat.

[Lychee3000]

500R has a fan controller?? Holy crap I just looked, indeed it does! Hahahah neat.

Well, it's just a small button for the 3 LED fans at the front. It has 3 notches so 3 different speeds. Also a button to switch the LED light on or off.

[vesseblah]

I was looking at this link in regards to SSD optimization:

That post and half of the regulars on this forum has few critical misunderstandings regarding SSDs


1: write limitations of SSDs are massively exaggerated, moving things like browser cache and other items that are accessed daily to a slow HDD is performance loss for your computer for no good reason

http://www.overclock.net/t/1013672/s...after-900000gb

2: keep pagefile on the SSD, never ever put it into HDD. That will only make your computer run slower again

http://www.overclock.net/t/1173789/p...ile-on-ssd-yes

[yurano]

That post and half of the regulars on this forum has few critical misunderstandings regarding SSDs

1: write limitations of SSDs are massively exaggerated, moving things like browser cache and other items that are accessed daily to a slow HDD is performance loss for your computer for no good reason

http://www.overclock.net/t/1013672/s...after-900000gb

2: keep pagefile on the SSD, never ever put it into HDD. That will only make your computer run slower again

http://www.overclock.net/t/1173789/p...ile-on-ssd-yes

8GB pagefile on a 128GB SSD consumes a lot of space especially since 8GB RAM is considered 'overkill'. As such, the pagefile might not be used often but still consume 8GB of space. This effect is even worse when you have people running 16GB RAM with 120GB SSDs. Your article was written over 3 years ago when 2-4GB RAM was the norm.

Some files do not need to be accessed quickly (eg. My Documents) where as others need to be accessed quickly (eg. Games/Windows). We prioritize things we care about and keep them on the SSD due to space, not write wear.

[Faithh]

How more you actually write to the SSD, how more you wear it. Pagefile is a big part of this. But honestly I have a Corsair Performance Pro 128GB with 16GB RAM with 4 games installed and pagefile is enabled, I didnt notice any performance drops over time and I have the SSD for almost a year I think.

Optimizing SSD is pointless, just keep AHCI enabled before installing windows and never ever defragment it or index it with Windows things. I noticed that my PC with that Intel AHCI driver (Intel rapid storage technology driver) was booting much faster than the default ahci driver from W7.

Just disable Hibernation if you don't use it which saves you like 8GB already.

[vesseblah]

8GB pagefile on a 128GB SSD consumes a lot of space especially since 8GB RAM is considered 'overkill'. As such, the pagefile might not be used often but still consume 8GB of space. This effect is even worse when you have people running 16GB RAM with 120GB SSDs. Your article was written over 3 years ago when 2-4GB RAM was the norm.

Notice that I never said anything about shrinking pagefile, only moving, but on hindsight it looks like I should have to avoid nitpicking from random people. Yes, of course you should shrink it according to how much RAM you have, 1GB is about right with 8GB or more physical RAM, but never ever move it off the SSD. And ofcourse disable hibernation before you want to nitpick from that shit too.

Some files do not need to be accessed quickly (eg. My Documents) where as others need to be accessed quickly (eg. Games/Windows). We prioritize things we care about and keep them on the SSD due to space, not write wear.

It's bigger pain in the ass to move off things like My Documents than the few GB space saved as some braindead programs still use hardcoded file paths. Of course it's an option if you really need to recover that space, but it's usually not worth the hassle when prices of SSDs keep falling down so fast.

[yurano]

Yes, of course you should shrink it according to how much RAM you have, 1GB is about right with 8GB or more physical RAM, but never ever move it off the SSD. And ofcourse disable hibernation before you want to nitpick from that shit too.

It's bigger pain in the ass to move off things like My Documents than the few GB space saved as some braindead programs still use hardcoded file paths. Of course it's an option if you really need to recover that space, but it's usually not worth the hassle when prices of SSDs keep falling down so fast.

Or, you can keep it as 8GB and move it completely off your SSD. With 8GB of RAM, the OS doesn't actually use it very often.

You can keep \My Documents\ where it is if you're concerned about old games writing save files. Newer games seem to use the \Current User\My Documents\ address to access your saves.

For user folders \My Music\, \Downloads\, \My Pictures\ and \My Videos\ are the main culprits of SSD overuse. There are plenty of people with enormous music folders who can benefit from moving it off. \Downloads\ consumes a ton of space and is super write heavy. \My Pictures\ and \My Videos\ can consume a lot of space if you use it. None of these user folders require fast access times or read speeds and I doubt any of these folders are 'hardcoded' anywhere so these can all be 'optimized'.

Shrinking\disabling pagefile, disabling hibernation and moving user folders are all in the optimization guides you criticized. All of these are meant to reduce space consumption. It seems like you're the one with a misunderstanding of SSD optimization.

http://blogs.technet.com/b/markrussi...7/3155406.aspx

How Big Should I Make the Paging File?

Perhaps one of the most commonly asked questions related to virtual memory is, how big should I make the paging file? There’s no end of ridiculous advice out on the web and in the newsstand magazines that cover Windows, and even Microsoft has published misleading recommendations. Almost all the suggestions are based on multiplying RAM size by some factor, with common values being 1.2, 1.5 and 2.

Since the commit limit sets an upper bound on how much private and pagefile-backed virtual memory can be allocated concurrently by running processes, the only way to reasonably size the paging file is to know the maximum total commit charge for the programs you like to have running at the same time. If the commit limit is smaller than that number, your programs won’t be able to allocate the virtual memory they want and will fail to run properly.

So how do you know how much commit charge your workloads require? To optimally size your paging file you should start all the applications you run at the same time, load typical data sets, and then note the commit charge peak. Set the paging file minimum to be that value minus the amount of RAM in your system (if the value is negative, pick a minimum size to permit the kind of crash dump you are configured for).

For the average gamer with 8GB or more of ram, the value is negative AND crash dumps are irrelevant.

[vesseblah]

Shrinking\disabling pagefile, disabling hibernation and moving user folders are all in the optimization guides you criticized. All of these are meant to reduce space consumption. It seems like you're the one with a misunderstanding of SSD optimization.

For fuck's sake, looks like it's easier to just put you on ignore if you continue nitpicking.

I specifically criticized the two points: SSD write longevity myth and optimal pagefile placement. The rest of the SSD optimization guides are valid.

[yurano]

For fuck's sake, looks like it's easier to just put you on ignore if you continue nitpicking.

I specifically criticized the two points: SSD write longevity myth and optimal pagefile placement. The rest of the SSD optimization guides are valid.

Bro, you were the one who started a flame war by calling other people stupid.

You made a weak assumption to criticize people are trying to help. I'm just proving your argument wrong and unfounded.

[Lychee3000]

People... Let's get along with each other, shall we?

Anyway, quick question.

I just saw that Cyber Monday has come and there are EXCELLENT deals now, especially on SSDs.

I am thinking of changing the current one I am going to get to getting a 240GB SSD:

Intel 330 Series 240 GB SATA 6GBS SSD
http://www.shopbot.ca/pp-intel-ssd-3...ce-391683.html
Only $139.99... $20 more than the Samsung 830 128GB SSD but almost twice the amount of GB... And I think 240GB is a good amount for all of my games currently and for the next 3 years. Also the Intel SSD has a consistent read and write (500 and 50, respectively).

I am not suggesting the OCZ Vertex or Agility series because I have seen not that stellar reviews about them as well as the company itself.
Also, not suggesting the Crucial ones since they are more expensive currently than the Intel...

What you guys think?
I think I can still change my order since they have not assembled my computer yet.

[Faithh]

People... Let's get along with each other, shall we?

Anyway, quick question.

I just saw that Cyber Monday has come and there are EXCELLENT deals now, especially on SSDs.

I am thinking of changing the current one I am going to get to getting a 240GB SSD:

Intel 330 Series 240 GB SATA 6GBS SSD
http://www.shopbot.ca/pp-intel-ssd-3...ce-391683.html
Only $139.99... $20 more than the Samsung 830 128GB SSD but almost twice the amount of GB... And I think 240GB is a good amount for all of my games currently and for the next 3 years. Also the Intel SSD has a consistent read and write (500 and 50, respectively).

I am not suggesting the OCZ Vertex or Agility series because I have seen not that stellar reviews about them as well as the company itself.
Also, not suggesting the Crucial ones since they are more expensive currently than the Intel...

What you guys think?
I think I can still change my order since they have not assembled my computer yet.

Honestly I find performance difference between SSD's irrelevant because you won't notice if one SSD is 50MB/s than another one. It might be 0.25sec a faster game loading which you won't notice unless you have a timer everytime up..

Reliability is rather more important for me and Intel SSD's ARE reliable.

[Lychee3000]

Honestly I find performance difference between SSD's irrelevant because you won't notice if one SSD is 50MB/s than another one. It might be 0.25sec a faster game loading which you won't notice unless you have a timer everytime up..

Reliability is rather more important for me and Intel SSD's ARE reliable.

So that Intel 330 Series 240GB is ok to get, right? It has low IOPS but I don't know how much of an effect it has on gaming, especially the games i would like to play (WoW, SC2, D3, SWTOR, GW2).

Or should I get a 256GB SSD instead for a few more bucks? I want to get a SSD that's reliable, performs well, and can handle all my games and their expansion packs or add-ons... As well as lasting me for 3 years, if possible. Can you suggest me a SSD that fulfills all those criteria?

[Xuvial]

So that Intel 330 Series 240GB is ok to get, right? It has low IOPS but I don't know how much of an effect it has on gaming, especially the games i would like to play (WoW, SC2, D3, SWTOR, GW2).

Or should I get a 256GB SSD instead for a few more bucks? I want to get a SSD that's reliable, performs well, and can handle all my games and their expansion packs or add-ons... As well as lasting me for 3 years, if possible. Can you suggest me a SSD that fulfills all those criteria?

The Intel 330 240gb is solid for your purposes.

Anandtech gave it a positive review: http://www.anandtech.com/show/5817/the-intel-ssd-330-review-60gb-120gb-180gb/9 (and nobody argues with Anand when it comes to SSD's :P)

[Lychee3000]

The Intel 330 240gb is solid for your purposes.

Anandtech gave it a positive review: http://www.anandtech.com/show/5817/the-intel-ssd-330-review-60gb-120gb-180gb/9 (and nobody argues with Anand when it comes to SSD's :P)

Awesome :P
I made the request to NCIX with the price match request... Hopefully they approve .

---------- Post added 2012-11-26 at 08:48 PM ----------

I don't know if anyone will be able to advise me or not on this but here goes...

I saw that the intel 330 sold out a while ago at the *surprise price*, according to NCIX. So, I don't know if they will honor me the price match or even the SSD so I looked for a different deal on SSDs... I found this:

ADATA SX900 2.5" 256GB SSD SATA 3 SandForce 2281 550MB/SEC Write and 530MB/SEC Read
http://ncix.ca/products/?sku=70080&v...y&promoid=1030
$159.99 CAD

It used to be 279.99 but the price is cut by $110!. That's massive. I read reviews on them and I only saw one bad review out of all the 5 stars for this SSD. AND it has excellent Read/write range as well as IOPS. And the size is bigger too, 256GB compared to 240GB.

Would you suggest this?